I like the list. Particularly the deadeye + munitions part.
To get a decent chance of shooting the munitions on an ace you need deadeye.
The best 21 point ship scum has is Kaato+homing missile+chimps which is very similar to these M3a's
(fun fact : the cheapest deadeye+munitions ship in the entirety of X-wing is Kaato)
Against mentally challenged folks yes.
Otherwise no.
Edited by Hujoe BigsHow about Mindlink for the EPT and Proton Rockets for ordinance? With the link you can focus-lock with 5 dice when you get that one good position...
And switch Serisu to tractor-Scyk and maybe VI to make it easier to get that good position for the TSVs
I've actually run something like that:
This was a fun list I ran once and beat a Kanan/Biggs list with.
The trick is one will focus and the other 3 will evade, so that with serissu, 3 have a focus and evade at the same time and serissu's reroll. The tractor beam also helps a lot in setting up good targets for the Mangler canons.
Against mentally challenged folks yes.
Otherwise no.
Refer you to post #50.
Against mentally challenged folks yes.
Otherwise no.
OK....I just sick of people posting things like this. Have you flown with or against any of the lists that were mentioned in the thread? With Mindlink, you can have action efficiency that is like a group PTL. The list that TallTonyB mentioned sounds fair. He says he won games in a tournament against real people that aren't mentally challenged.
There is the general attitude that the Scyk sucks and should never see play. It's an attitude that gets pushed across the forums and podcasts and generally accepted with very little attempts at actually making the ship work. No one tries interesting builds and no one uses it and everyone just gives up on it. It's like the Tie Defender until Biophysical won a good sized tournament with two of them. People have started to use the Defender before the fix comes out and been placing in Top 4 slots in Store Championships with them....before the fix comes out. Also, there has been at least one Store Championship that was won by someone with a Scyk in their list. There were a few others that made it to the Top 4.
It could just be that Attani Mindlink is the fix for the Scyk that people are looking for, but if no one bothers to actually try it, how would we know?
I put together the following but I can't justify buying 3 more Scyks to try it:
4 Cartel Spacers - 2 with Tractor Beams + 2 with Manglers
Serissu with Mangler
I like these little ships but they do fall apart too easily, i find much more so than tie fighters 
Against mentally challenged folks yes.
Otherwise no.
OK....I just sick of people posting things like this. Have you flown with or against any of the lists that were mentioned in the thread? With Mindlink, you can have action efficiency that is like a group PTL. The list that TallTonyB mentioned sounds fair. He says he won games in a tournament against real people that aren't mentally challenged.
There is the general attitude that the Scyk sucks and should never see play. It's an attitude that gets pushed across the forums and podcasts and generally accepted with very little attempts at actually making the ship work. No one tries interesting builds and no one uses it and everyone just gives up on it. It's like the Tie Defender until Biophysical won a good sized tournament with two of them. People have started to use the Defender before the fix comes out and been placing in Top 4 slots in Store Championships with them....before the fix comes out. Also, there has been at least one Store Championship that was won by someone with a Scyk in their list. There were a few others that made it to the Top 4.
It could just be that Attani Mindlink is the fix for the Scyk that people are looking for, but if no one bothers to actually try it, how would we know?
I was told relentlessly that it would be shut down by stress and the stress meta even though the stress meta is a myth, and even though you can just hand the stressed one a focus with the other one.
Edited by ParaGoomba SlayerShhhhhhh,heychadwick! They won't see it coming. That is just fine with me.
Edited by balindamoodI have run TPV'S mindlinked with Serrisu and done OK. However, once you realize that Serrisu is basically there to be the source of focus tokens, you can do better with something more robust. I have run a Contracted Scout with either Gonk or APL and done better, but I think that the Gand Findsman may be the best option. He has one less health and evade die than the CS, but when it is the last ship on the board...and it is from time to time, then I would rather have the three red dice to actually do some damage than the two dice turret of the CS.
Id figure Serrisu would get the focus as the lower TPV would be making the first focus action and Serrisu would just be giving green dice rerolls. (Still pale in comparison to autothrusters.) The problem is how do you defend Serrisu? Katoo Lecheroes with bodyguard?
Edited by MarinealverPlayed mindlinked TPV's with manglers vs a 4 blue T70 list. Went really well till about turn 4, had a whole squad vs. 2 T70's but still lost in the end. Fun list but needs some work to be in better shape. Trying Ser. and TPV next with manglers and mindlinked BSA's.
Really I think they are at an almost good place, a small fix to them (and K Fighter as well) should be all they need.
Will say these things make TIE fighters look pretty sturdy.
Will say these things make TIE fighters look pretty sturdy.
Which shouldn't really be the case. They have the same agility, a better action bar, higher PS and a superficial health advantage. One vs one at least, the Scyk should clearly perform better.
Unlike TIEs, it's very easy to rack up the points when upgrading them, though.
Will say these things make TIE fighters look pretty sturdy.
Which shouldn't really be the case. They have the same agility, a better action bar, higher PS and a superficial health advantage. One vs one at least, the Scyk should clearly perform better.
Thank you for making this point. I remain perplexed that the Scyk has the reputation of being "squishy".
The only functional differences in their performance (leave aside cost considerations here) is in the option to TL (which, if taken at the wrong time, can penalize your survivability since you took no defensive tokens) and their dial.
I would tentatively argue that the Scyk has a better dial for defensive purposes, when compared to the TIE/ln. It has two more greens, two more 1-speeds, and trades the 5-straight for a 5-k. It's only disadvantages are that it has one fewer total maneuver options than the TIE, and lacks the 3-turn (traded off for 1-banks), both of which features could leave you occasionally in worse positions relative to enemy arcs and ranges.
It is the base cost of generics that makes the Scyk "seem" squishy, since your survivability to investment ratio is worse than the TIE. A PS2 Scyk costs 2 points more than a PS1 TIE. This seems okay, in that you gain both action versatility (TL) and PS. However the generic PS2 Scyk still costs a point more than the PS3 TIE. Is the option to TL really worth both an extra point and a loss of 1 PS? Next, looking at the generic EPT-slot pilots, the PS5 Scyk costs 3 points more than the PS4 TIE. It turns out that the Scyk is basically priced equivalent to the TIE with charges/discounts of 1 point per PS change, and 2 points for adding TL to the action bar. (This math doesn't hold vs the Academy Pilot, which should cost only 11 points per this formula.) Basically, generic Scyks are priced like generic TIEs with a mandatory Targeting Computer upgrade.
On its face, it seems like an even value vs the TIE cost scheme (accepting that an Academy Pilot is artificially made 1 point too expensive simply to prevent 9-ship naked swarms), with the unpalatable price of Targeting Computer being offset by the opportunity advantage of being able to add a secondary weapon at a 2-point tax via the title. And really, it's that 2-point tax that starts to make the Scyk seem "squishy" in survivability to investment ratio, since you're sacrificing the ability to field the massed numbers of a swarm.
(I doubt I've added anything revolutionary with this analysis, but it has been insightful to work through the math here on my own.)
I think the issue is cost and pilot ability. They are, on the face of it, statically similar to a tie but the problem is that you can get a swarm of 5 ties in a list all with pretty decent abilities without the need for upgrades. Have 12-14 points left, squeeze in another AP. You cannot do this with a Scyk. The base models cost too much, and to upgrade them to something worth flying, you are only running four. The issue is simple, they cost too much for what you get. Mindlink gives you something by upping the group action economy...I think to the point of making them marginally competitive, but they still cost too much for what you get...just like all other excludive Scum small based ships.
Edited by balindamoodI think the issue is cost and pilot ability. They are on the face of it, statically similar to a tie, but the problem is that you can get a swarm of 5 ties in a list all with pretty decent abilities without the need for upgrades. Have 12-14 points left, squeeze in nanother AP. You cannot do this with a Scyk. The base models cost too much, and to upgrade them to something worth flying, you are only running four. The issue is simple, they cost too much for what you get. Mindlink gives you something by upping the group action economy...I think to the point of making them marginally competatice, but they still cost too much for what you get.
5 ships is not a swarm.
You can fly 7 in a list. They do not cost too much, without the title they are costed appropriately and in line with the TIE Fighter.
Of course, this game has power creeper TIE Fighters out of the game so I suppose even the TIE Fighter is overcosted.
I disagree on both counts. Obsidian pilots are 13 points, not 14, and I belive them to be equals. I do not know what the official definition of a swarm is, but I feel that 5 or more is basically it. There have been a number of 5-tie+ lists starting to do well again. Maybe not winning a large percentage of major tournaments, but they are represented. We could argue if this a a function of meta, new stuff, or flying ability, but they are there. Scyks are not, and I think the cost-to-performance is the issue.
Four Sckyks List. Could it work?
I disagree on both counts. Obsidian pilots are 13 points, not 14, and I belive them to be equals. I do not know what the official definition of a swarm is, but I feel that 5 or more is basically it. There have been a number of 5-tie+ lists starting to do well again. Maybe not winning a large percentage of major tournaments, but they are represented. We could argue if this a a function of meta, new stuff, or flying ability, but they are there. Scyks are not, and I think the cost-to-performance is the issue.
Except, as I worked out above, cost is exactly the same as PS3-4 TIEs with a 1-point-per-PS increase and a built in 2-point Targeting Computer cost. Thus, I think they (the generics at least) probably suffer from the fact that when run naked or in mini-swarms, they have to be flown in such a way to gain the benefit of a Targeting Computer upgrade. That requires a different approach than you would use with a simple TIE swarm or mini-swarm formation. It argues for using them alongside a different anchor ship that can somehow provide them the action economy to actually make use of their TL functionality. I don't know what that optimal anchor would be.
Really, they should have been a point cheaper and the title should have been 1 point rather than 2. Then you would be in better shape for making use of their native TL ability, even if all you did was put a Flechette Torpedo on each one (which amounts to a free one-use control weapon if costs were reduced as I suggested).
With regards to actions, I find that if you can get a shot and don't have to worry about return fire, target lock. If you can't get a shot and can't get shot yourself, target lock. Pretty much every other instance (other than arc dodging), focus or evade.
I disagree on both counts. Obsidian pilots are 13 points, not 14, and I belive them to be equals. I do not know what the official definition of a swarm is, but I feel that 5 or more is basically it. There have been a number of 5-tie+ lists starting to do well again. Maybe not winning a large percentage of major tournaments, but they are represented. We could argue if this a a function of meta, new stuff, or flying ability, but they are there. Scyks are not, and I think the cost-to-performance is the issue.
Except, as I worked out above, cost is exactly the same as PS3-4 TIEs with a 1-point-per-PS increase and a built in 2-point Targeting Computer cost. Thus, I think they (the generics at least) probably suffer from the fact that when run naked or in mini-swarms, they have to be flown in such a way to gain the benefit of a Targeting Computer upgrade. That requires a different approach than you would use with a simple TIE swarm or mini-swarm formation. It argues for using them alongside a different anchor ship that can somehow provide them the action economy to actually make use of their TL functionality. I don't know what that optimal anchor would be.
Really, they should have been a point cheaper and the title should have been 1 point rather than 2. Then you would be in better shape for making use of their native TL ability, even if all you did was put a Flechette Torpedo on each one (which amounts to a free one-use control weapon if costs were reduced as I suggested).
If the Cartel Spacer was just 1 point cheaper it would make a huger difference. The other pilots are 2 points too expensive.
When you only have 2 attack dice and 3 defense dice, and activate at PS 2, you are better off using focus or evade.
The short banks are nice for slow rolling, but there is no Scum Howlrunner to make range-3, 2-dice-primaries effective.
A cost errata and "Heavy" title granting +1 hull is what they need to bring them in line with TIE Fighters and /FOs, but I don't see FFG doing that. Even though they are fine with errata to rules cards before they arrive in stores. (tractor beam)
3 TPV with palob and mindlink for all. Cannons and turrets to taste. Or replace palob with guri. Use the actions for things other than focus and then get guri where she wants to be. No points for fancy crap on guri though.
Guri is too expensive if you have manglers on the Scyks. You have 28 points left for support.
Just wanted to clarify that when I said they feel fragile it was in regards to how many you get in a list. If I lose an academy it's no big deal, when I played a four Scyk list they die almost as quick but cost twice as much.
Can't play them in a basic swarm either cause you are down a ship to academy's and pirates, and I don't feel like the action bar makes up for it.
Well With Atani mindlik perhaps Serrisu could be good with Kato Lecheros and bodyguard. Serrisu gives everyone green dice rerolls, and Kato could take one of the many free focus tokens and give a ship an extra green dice.
Well With Atani mindlik perhaps Serrisu could be good with Kato Lecheros and bodyguard. Serrisu gives everyone green dice rerolls, and Kato could take one of the many free focus tokens and give a ship an extra green dice.
That is an idea worth looking into, might free up a few points for other stuff too. Only problem is that he can only bodyguard Serrisu, if Serrisu dies first he can't help anyone else because of PS5 all around (assuming TPV's).
Guri is too expensive if you have manglers on the Scyks. You have 28 points left for support.
I tried 3 Mindlinked TPV's with Manglers and a Mindlinked Contracted Scout with Intel Agent and Unhinged Astromech as a blocker.
Worked out pretty well actually. Kicked a Dash Miranda's ass.
