Actually all the auto damage **** from the ghost pisses me off.

Soontir waves an angry fist at AB turret Kanan in the ghost, can't get in to range 1 and usually will roll 2 attack dice on him.

Schrodinger's Fel is both dodging your arc and token turtling.

Paragoombas invincible goomba.

Heh. He's probably lost so many games to it he's out of tears so he resorts to rage.

Many of those games I've played perfectly only for my opponent's dice to spike. Last few I've killed have only been because of hard counters like Feedback.

Soontir is clearly broken. I don't see why you dismiss me, I was right about the Phantom, I was right about fat turrets. I'm right about Soontir.

If you don't make a list that has a counter to Soontir in it, you automatically lose.

that's why I freaking LOVE the Doom+Sumo double-deci list.

especially when you come to a tournament and see 13\16 players palp-acing or PTL on half of lists.

and then you put on your COOL FACE and say "Prooblem, soontie? want a ram? Or a antipursuit block? Vader to the face? Stress from mara, stress from Captive?

and when their eyes widen in rage "filthy anti-matchup, that's not fair!" you just smile on and wait for the next matchup, 5-0 100-0

Careful. We lump trolls together.

The way Soontir functions means that even if you play perfectly against him and get that crucial block, his dice can spike for that one perfect shot you have and you've lost your one chance to kill Fel. 3 hits, 1 crit from a Homing Missile at range 2 on a bumped Soontir?

Oh look, 3 evades and Palpatine. Aw shucks, so close. Soontir isn't overpowered, he's a glass cannon. Just have to block him lol.

Because rolling 3 natural evades with 3 dice happens all the time, right?

No offense, but if you're still struggling to deal with Soontir's existence in X-wing, then you probably should have quit when Autothrusters were released.

Also, weren't you adamant that Superdash was the OP plague of a ship a few months ago? I remember trying to convince you otherwise by explaining how Soontir can easily dispatch him.

I guess you were convinced?

In seriousness though Fel is a high risk high reward ship and yeah he's a pain to deal with but he also has some brutal hard counters and costs a third of your list. He is good but he is far from the unbeatable demigod people make him out to be.

Spoken like a true Palp Aces player.

He's not high risk, high reward. He's the hardest to kill ship in the game unless someone goes out of their way to hard counter him.

He can convert a blank blank focus roll to 4 evade results. That's the very opposite of high risk.

...I don't play with Fel or Palpatine so thanks for showing your ass. Fel is every bit as durable as a basic tie without his actions and is extremely vulnerable to stress and ionization as a result. The fact that you aren't skilled enough to kill him doesn't make him broken.

Suddenly Auto-humpas make him 146% PWT-counter and Palp says "nope" when your dice go derp.

AT and palp-less fel with only Stealth device is the Wave 2 fel

he's dead.

FEL IS DEAD
LONG LIVE THE FEL!

Ten Numb + VI + Mangler Cannon = A bad day for Fel.

I've never feared Triple Autoceptors or Palp Aces with the Ten at Ten list (Ten Numb + VI + Manger Cannon, Airen Cracken + VI, Blue Squadron + FCS + Heavy Laser Cannon, Bandit Squadron).

I'm not going to claim I've never lost to it...I have. But I beat it more than I lose to it.

Because Fel WILL be in arc at Range 3 and Fel WILL take a crit. Fel then becomes easy meat.

You can sub in a two tacticians, an advanced sensor, a shield upgrade, and tracer missiles to make Fel's life even worse by stacking that stress on him too.

I was disappointed in the lack of torkil

But I was impressed by your diagrams, most impressed.

I was disappointed in the lack of torkil

But I was impressed by your diagrams, most impressed.

Torkil + Palob = Trolltime for Mr. Fel.

Hilarious when it happens.

Actually all the auto damage **** from the ghost pisses me off.

Only when the last competitive rebel build will have disappeared,

and when the last cool non-imperial mechanic has been made useless,

and the last non-Palpmobile build is extinct,

will Blail realize that he can not eat imperial boots!

Nice analysis. The one other point though is that, as noted, not only do you have to deal with soontir's quantum state, but when you catch him, you can't afford to catch him at range 3 - because the difference between shooting at a kitted out squint at range 2 (4 dice, essentially a TIE phantom) and range 3 (5 dice with autothrusters) is massive.

Oh look, 3 evades and Palpatine. Aw shucks, so close. Soontir isn't overpowered, he's a glass cannon. Just have to block him lol.

I actually rolled the full 4 evades in the last tournament. Did not bring palpatine either. The thing is you roll those 3 (or 4) evades + palpatine is about 20%. You might only remember those 20% because they are so outstanding. It still just a 1 out of 5 chance. And once the stealth device is gone the chances drop significantly to zero % for 3 + palpatine and just 22% for 3 evades. Thinking about this, I really should be running Palatine. He really is such a great backup.

Actually all the auto damage **** from the ghost pisses me off.

I lost to that ghost last tournament, but I can tell you one thing: You must be flying pretty retarded to get caught in range one by that ghostly brick. And outside of range 1 the ghost becomes pretty tame with that configuration. The only downside is really that you should break off your attack often because the ghost is a brick that WILL kill nearly all TIE-Fighters in a single turn if you get into range 1 to it. Don´t underestimate the range 1 thread, stay in range 3, and annihilate the ghost.

edit: spelling

Actually all the auto damage **** from the ghost pisses me off.

I lost to that ghost last tournament, but I can tell you one thing: You must be flying pretty retarded to get caught in range one by that ghostly brick. And outside of range 1 the ghost becomes pretty tame with that configuration. The only downside is really that you should break off your attack often because the ghost is a break that WILL kill nearly all TIE-Fighters in a single turn if you get into range 1 to it. Don´t underestimate the range 1 thread, stay in range 3, and annihilate the ghost.

I'm not sharing it, but I made a build that basically makes that impossible. =)

Sadly, its worst match is 3uboat. haha!

I have been using an imagined version of these diagrams (probably much less accurate) to shoot down Fel with Omega Leader, and I've had fairly good luck doing that. In practice I find the green area is usually MUCH bigger when you approach from the flank. This is due not only to edges often blocking the escape route at some point, but also because many players hesitate to boost/roll in the direction your ship is moving, as this puts them in a bad spot next turn - i.e. with your ship almost directly behind.

If your squad lacks Omega Leader or equivalent anti-fel technology, here's food for thought: it's obvious that Fel is great at ignoring or dodging 1-2 attacks a turn. If you have one guy shooting at Fel, it's probably a wasted shot (and any actions taken to make that shot). This is counterintuitive, so I've seen games with dozens of actions and shots "wasted", this is also why Fel is so notorious and frustrating to fight. Avoid these situations like the plague! All or nothing is the key: each turn, choose to either "ignore fel" or - if you see Fel's move is easy to predict and several ships can pounce - "focus on Fel". Predict Fel's move and postion your WHOLE squad in response to block/shoot the bugger. Ignore everything else for that turn. But don't carry this to the next turn unless Fel is in a very bad spot again: it's usually best to shift focus back to something else or break off, as pot-shots at Fel WILL BE wasted.

It helps that Fel is predictable with the green 2's - he usually has 2-3 manouvers to pick from that make sense in a situation.

Torkil + Palob = Trolltime for Mr. Fel.

Hilarious when it happens.

For pretty much anyone. It's just as amusing to take the focus token off Poe Bloody Dameron.

In practice I find the green area is usually MUCH bigger when you approach from the flank. This is due not only to edges often blocking the escape route at some point, but also because many players hesitate to boost/roll in the direction your ship is moving, as this puts them in a bad spot next turn - i.e. with your ship almost directly behind.

Indeed. Looking at that graphic, it becomes a lot more obvious than it has been to me in game - when facing me, the fastest way to safety is to zip past me. In an engagement where I'm on the flank, he has to cross 90' of my arc - so boost becomes less useful and he's often stuck.

I killed him just the other night by firing him twice. Nothing special, just a pair of 3 dice attacks. He evaded the first one with his tokens, then, the second attack one-shot him with his all-blank roll.

Which is impressive but you have to agree unexpected.

Fel has two 'states' - where autothrusters are in play or where they aren't. At range 3 with autothrusters, he's nigh untouchable by generic fighters - 5 green dice will garner 1 evade reliably even off unmodified dice, and autothrusters a second. Those are both 'renewable', meaning it's only 3-hit attacks (not 3-dice, 3-hit) that matter, and with evade, focus, and palpatine, jinking away an extra hit three times can be done reliably too.

Therefore, you almost categorically cannot kill Fel at range 3 whilst he has his tokens and stealth device in place - to the point that (for example) if flying a TIE fighter swarm, I'd evade for the first round because it's better defence and my attack will do nothing - it's better to invest actions preserving firepower for subsequent rounds.

Fel can be killed, but it's at medium-to-close range and ideally with some trick up your sleeve. Flechette torpedoes, R3-A2, Feedback arrays, mines, tacticians.....all of them work. No faction is unable to take a means of crippling him; it's your choice not to take one.

Ten Numb + VI + Mangler Cannon = A bad day for Fel.

I've never feared Triple Autoceptors or Palp Aces with the Ten at Ten list (Ten Numb + VI + Manger Cannon, Airen Cracken + VI, Blue Squadron + FCS + Heavy Laser Cannon, Bandit Squadron).

I'm not going to claim I've never lost to it...I have. But I beat it more than I lose to it.

Because Fel WILL be in arc at Range 3 and Fel WILL take a crit. Fel then becomes easy meat.

You can sub in a two tacticians, an advanced sensor, a shield upgrade, and tracer missiles to make Fel's life even worse by stacking that stress on him too.

Honestly doubt that. Ten Numb is one of these "counters", that really aren't, especially when facing triple Imp Aces / Squints.

Sure, if you'r opponents tries to run away the whole game Numb can smoothly crit him away. However if he simply tries getting into range 1 and actually kill Numb, he'll drop like every B-Wing in a bit more than one round. At that point you probably killed one of his aces. Then what? Cracken and a Blue Squad against two Squint Aces? Have fun

This discussion amuses me (as do most discussions where Goomba is involved).

Soontir has been around since, what, Wave 2? Early 2013? If you haven't figured out how to handle him in the past three years, I don't think there is a person alive who can help you.

He wasn't an issue before Autothrusters and Palpatine.

Soontir when blocked is not as easy to kill as a basic TIE Fighter. That's laughable that you think that. He still has 4-5 agility, Autothrusters, and Palpatine. One moderately lucky defense roll on his part and your perfect setup will result in failure.

What are the chances that across 4 agility dice and Palpatine, that you'll be able to get at least 3 evade results? No tokens or Autothrusters, just Palpatine and Stealth Device.

This discussion amuses me (as do most discussions where Goomba is involved).

Soontir has been around since, what, Wave 2? Early 2013? If you haven't figured out how to handle him in the past three years, I don't think there is a person alive who can help you.

He wasn't an issue before Autothrusters and Palpatine.

Soontir when blocked is not as easy to kill as a basic TIE Fighter. That's laughable that you think that. He still has 4-5 agility, Autothrusters, and Palpatine. One moderately lucky defense roll on his part and your perfect setup will result in failure.

What are the chances that across 4 agility dice and Palpatine, that you'll be able to get at least 3 evade results? No tokens or Autothrusters, just Palpatine and Stealth Device.

Maybe you should be shooting Palp a bit more?

This discussion amuses me (as do most discussions where Goomba is involved).

Soontir has been around since, what, Wave 2? Early 2013? If you haven't figured out how to handle him in the past three years, I don't think there is a person alive who can help you.

He wasn't an issue before Autothrusters and Palpatine.

Soontir when blocked is not as easy to kill as a basic TIE Fighter. That's laughable that you think that. He still has 4-5 agility, Autothrusters, and Palpatine. One moderately lucky defense roll on his part and your perfect setup will result in failure.

What are the chances that across 4 agility dice and Palpatine, that you'll be able to get at least 3 evade results? No tokens or Autothrusters, just Palpatine and Stealth Device.

Maybe you should be shooting Palp a bit more?

And just let the aces get behind me?

What are the chances that across 4 agility dice and Palpatine, that you'll be able to get at least 3 evade results? No tokens or Autothrusters, just Palpatine and Stealth Device.

That's why most people tend to agree that, when fighting the palpmobile aces, you should be shooting palpmobile 1st.

Otherwise, you have a hard time getting damage through even Vader's 3 greens.

If you can build him with a good support squad that can do damage if ignored, you're golden. There is a lot of Soontir hate out there, so it's a challenge to keep him alive against certain squads. But that can be to your advantage as he can take a barrage of shots while the support jumps in. Otherwise, he comes in and cleans up the mess if they decide to go after your support first.

What are the chances that across 4 agility dice and Palpatine, that you'll be able to get at least 3 evade results? No tokens or Autothrusters, just Palpatine and Stealth Device.

About 48% for the first attack. If you have to use palpatine (you probably will) and there's another shot, the odds are more like 15% - which means the odds of dodging both is pretty low (about 7%)

But yeah, the fact that if you block soontir, you have a 50% chance of missing with a range 1, 3-dice attack is kind of frustrating; you really need a second (well, third, allowing for the blocker) to tag team him as well to be confident of the hit.

That's why most people tend to agree that, when fighting the palpmobile aces, you should be shooting palpmobile 1st.

Otherwise, you have a hard time getting damage through even Vader's 3 greens.

If you've got the speed or reach to run him down. A shuttle can be annoyingly hard to catch, especially if he has enough points for an engine upgrade. But yes, it's probably easier than trying to take out the aces first.