At face value this often seems like a simple question.

If you want a Gun Ship then take the Assault Frigate.

If you want a carrier then take the Assault Frigate.

if you want to get in close then take the Scout Frigate.

Except this doesnt seem right. The scout frigate has 1 less red die than the Assault Frigate and a more evades lending itself to being a long range gunship in its own right. So why do we love Assualt Frigates with Ackbar so much? When does the Scout Frigate come into its own? If you really want to brawl the Torp Frigate seems like the cheaper option.

To be fair, the Scout Frigate is really good at long range because it synergizes well with TRCs, much better than the Assault Frigate. You get one evade for defense and one for offense without burning any. You can get a little more consistency out of it offensively and defensively. I think of the Assault Frigate as more of a brawler where as the scout frigate is more slippery, at least at long ranges. My philosophy for MC30s is you either build them for close up or far away. In other words, unless you have some crazy plan, you probably want to avoid taking ordnance if you are going to stay at long range most of the game with Ackbar.

The Scout frigate comes into play knowing that eventually, something is going to get at close range of you. And the Scout frigate has an answer when it does. Personally, I like to load up Torps and unleash my hull-eating piranhas on Imperials seeing how they like being on the receiving end of black dice.

I hardly ever take Scout Frigates. I just prefer slipping in close with Torpedo Frigates and unloading. Black Dice are where it's at! The points I save dropping from Red to Blue dice almost pays for the title that ALL MC30's should have.

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

I am with you. While I value the Torp Frigate I have had many an instance where I would stop at speed 0 right in blue range of a Torp Frigate and just out of black range. Whats the most it can do then? 2 damage? A scout frigate has the remote possibility of doing 4 damage. and has a longer range.

A few more key points on this:

• The Scout Frigate has no brace, and so if the opponent is running XI7s, is orders of magnitude more fragile than the Assault Frigate.
• The Assault Frigate has significantly better squadron capacity, so if you are using the ships to boss squadrons around, the Assault Frigate wins.

I think of the AF as a ship of the line / carrier and the Scout Frigate as a rather slippery glass cannon. Which you want depends on what you need to get done.

I hardly ever take Scout Frigates. I just prefer slipping in close with Torpedo Frigates and unloading. Black Dice are where it's at! The points I save dropping from Red to Blue dice almost pays for the title that ALL MC30's should have.

I generally fall under this line of thinking. I'm not a fan of the scout frigate. Yes, it synergizes with TRCs, but so does a CR90, and at a significantly cheaper cost for almost the same long range firepower (if you're Ackbaring, the scout gets one more die). The MC30, first and foremost, is a ship that wants to be up close and personal. The Torpedo boat is not only cheaper, but it's also better up close because of the significantly higher chance of getting an accuracy.

I tend to see it this way:

Scout Frigates like to be at long range (where their defense tokens work best) and short range (where their dice work best). They make much better use of Turbolaser Reroute Circuits, so they can operate as kind of fake CR90s until it's time to get in close. Under Ackbar they're close to being as good as Assault Frigates (4 red dice to 5).

Assault Frigates wear a bit more evenly throughout ranges but prefer long and medium range. They can usually handle more than one serious hit due to the Brace token. Conversely, the MC30 is relying on its ample shields and dual Redirects to keep it going and once those are used up it tends to explode.

Both are decent ships. I personally think the MC30 is underrated, but it requires a bit of practice to really unlock its full potential. Assault Frigates are more newbie-friendly.

I like both quite a bit, although for different roles.

Strangely enough, I find the Assault Frigate is the cheaper option and the one I take when points are tighter. Naked Assault Frigates work just fine, although you can sprinkle upgrades to flavor. MC-30s REALLY want upgrades and benefit from them a great deal.

I like both quite a bit, although for different roles.

Strangely enough, I find the Assault Frigate is the cheaper option and the one I take when points are tighter. Naked Assault Frigates work just fine, although you can sprinkle upgrades to flavor. MC-30s REALLY want upgrades and benefit from them a great deal.

Yeah, I agree that the AF holds up lot better on its own than the MC30c.

Foresight and Admonition...nice little surviving machines. They so much want Lando or Walex. And Ordnance Experts and APTs.

Title-wise its a slam dunk for the MC30c. What are the titles for the AF again?

I tend to see it this way:

Scout Frigates like to be at long range (where their defense tokens work best) and short range (where their dice work best). They make much better use of Turbolaser Reroute Circuits, so they can operate as kind of fake CR90s until it's time to get in close. Under Ackbar they're close to being as good as Assault Frigates (4 red dice to 5).

Assault Frigates wear a bit more evenly throughout ranges but prefer long and medium range. They can usually handle more than one serious hit due to the Brace token. Conversely, the MC30 is relying on its ample shields and dual Redirects to keep it going and once those are used up it tends to explode.

Both are decent ships. I personally think the MC30 is underrated, but it requires a bit of practice to really unlock its full potential. Assault Frigates are more newbie-friendly.

I agree wholeheartedly that the MC30 is underrated, but also less user friendly for newer players. But, once you have gotten a feel for flying it, I just think that the Torpedo version is the better option, overall. As stated, you are saving points to get more reliable dice and a better chance at hitting that accuracy, though the range obviously suffers.

If you are running an Akbar build, then of course the Scout is probably better than the Torp. Though in that case, I would rather run CR90s for a slight loss of firepower (1 Red die at range) at a SIGNIFICANT point savings, and/or Assault Frigates, which I think is the best all around ship the Rebels have with a nice ranged Broadside and better fighter control.

I tend to see it this way:

Scout Frigates like to be at long range (where their defense tokens work best) and short range (where their dice work best). They make much better use of Turbolaser Reroute Circuits, so they can operate as kind of fake CR90s until it's time to get in close. Under Ackbar they're close to being as good as Assault Frigates (4 red dice to 5).

Assault Frigates wear a bit more evenly throughout ranges but prefer long and medium range. They can usually handle more than one serious hit due to the Brace token. Conversely, the MC30 is relying on its ample shields and dual Redirects to keep it going and once those are used up it tends to explode.

Both are decent ships. I personally think the MC30 is underrated, but it requires a bit of practice to really unlock its full potential. Assault Frigates are more newbie-friendly.

I agree wholeheartedly that the MC30 is underrated, but also less user friendly for newer players. But, once you have gotten a feel for flying it, I just think that the Torpedo version is the better option, overall. As stated, you are saving points to get more reliable dice and a better chance at hitting that accuracy, though the range obviously suffers.

If you are running an Akbar build, then of course the Scout is probably better than the Torp. Though in that case, I would rather run CR90s for a slight loss of firepower (1 Red die at range) at a SIGNIFICANT point savings, and/or Assault Frigates, which I think is the best all around ship the Rebels have with a nice ranged Broadside and better fighter control.

I in turn agree wholeheartedly with you . In general I think the Scout Frigate is worth considering in certain circumstances:

1. Ackbar fleets
2. Fleets with substantial numbers of supporting CR90s (like Lyraeus's Dodonna fleet), where the MC30s can function similarly to their skirmisher cousins until necessary for them to go on a torpedo run.
3. Fleets that aren't set up well to use black dice ships (no bid, no out-activating) but would like some black dice "just in case" to act as a guard dog against enemy ships that get too close. So like a 2 Assault Frigate + 1 MC30 fleet, for example.

Torpedo Frigates generally want less upgrades and are cheaper by default on top of that. They're also less confused about their purpose. To speak on that a bit more, a Scout MC30 used at long range all game is basically a worse CR90A. A Scout MC30 used as if it's only a black dice ship all game is basically a worse Torpedo MC30. When including it and using a Scout MC30, you need to have a good sense as to which role it needs to fill at what times and when it needs to transition from one role to the other (and then back, potentially).

Look, lets just agree to to agree. All this back and forth is getting old.

Wait...

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

And Intel Officer...with Ackbar of course. The Torp seems a more legit option with other admirals. But with fishface the Scout is solid.

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

And Intel Officer...with Ackbar of course. The Torp seems a more legit option with other admirals. But with fishface the Scout is solid.

Nah, who needs Ackbar. Dodonna all the way!

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

And Intel Officer...with Ackbar of course. The Torp seems a more legit option with other admirals. But with fishface the Scout is solid.

Nah, who needs Ackbar. Dodonna all the way!

Except your fleet - then the scout is OK with Dodonna!

I'll take scout frigates with trcs all day long.

And Intel Officer...with Ackbar of course. The Torp seems a more legit option with other admirals. But with fishface the Scout is solid.

Nah, who needs Ackbar. Dodonna all the way!

Except your fleet - then the scout is OK with Dodonna!

You do have to build around both Dodonna and Ackbar. . .

The guy who won our latest tournament, had an Ackbar list of 3x MC30 Torpedo Frigates and 3x CR90A.

The combo of 2x red + 2x blue at medium range was not so shabby. When 3x black was added at close range, made it quite devastating. + Ordnance Experts with APT.

I haven't got to run a Mon Mothma torpedo fleet yet, but I'm looking forward to using her with both titles on two torpedoes. Last time I played I used a pair of TRC90's and the way it came out the black dice on a scout would have come in really handy. That was my first time using Reiken

The guy who won our latest tournament, had an Ackbar list of 3x MC30 Torpedo Frigates and 3x CR90A.

The combo of 2x red + 2x blue at medium range was not so shabby. When 3x black was added at close range, made it quite devastating. + Ordnance Experts with APT.

What was his bid, if you can remember?

I haven't got to run a Mon Mothma torpedo fleet yet, but I'm looking forward to using her with both titles on two torpedoes. Last time I played I used a pair of TRC90's and the way it came out the black dice on a scout would have come in really handy. That was my first time using Reiken

I ran a Mon Mothma fleet with 2 Torp Frigates and 4 TRC90s in a casual game last week. It was great fun. My opponent got exactly 1 front arc shot from his ISD the entire game, and those double arcing last then first activations on the Frigates were awesome (not Demo level, but not far off).

One of the biggest reasons I've moved away from Assailt Frigates in Wave 2 is the lack of dice manipulation. The MC-30 scout is just much better at it. It uses TRCs more efficiently and had Ordnance Experts as well.

I haven't got to run a Mon Mothma torpedo fleet yet, but I'm looking forward to using her with both titles on two torpedoes. Last time I played I used a pair of TRC90's and the way it came out the black dice on a scout would have come in really handy. That was my first time using Reiken

Mon Mothma with torpedo frigates and the titles is amazing. Utterly amazing. She brings out the most in both titles. Admonition can close to close range, still force a re-roll with an evade, and then jettison that same evade token to cancel. Foresight is just an annoyingly slippery bastard. I love the hell out of those ships with Mon Mothma.

I have never been a fan of the skirting and throwing 3 reds with Assault frigates, thus throwing 2 with the scout frigate is even less appealing to me. I only really include AFs if I'm needing carriers, or I have Ackbar to boost the attack (but even then I'm often disappointed due to lack of effective dice manipulation). I'd rather get in close and deal massive damage. This line of thinking is why I tend to run expensive super hard hitting MC30s. I like the scout frigate for this role, since with TRCs, my double arc is guaranteed 4 damage, plus whatever I roll with the blacks and ordnance. This is more expensive, but it consistently does more damage than a torpedo frigate. Another bonus with this, is I usually get a round of shooting from long range, which again, due to TRCs around 4 damage. A torpedo frigate usually misses out on this initial weakening volley.

As for Ackbar with a scout as a skirmisher. I like it better than AFs due to the better TRC capability, but I have a hard time justifying using them in that way since I feel like I'm not using their full potential.