Westeros player returning to the LCG format -

To get back into the game I picked up the core set and two chapter packs: War of Five Kings and Calling the Banners. Am I missing something or are the Chapter Pack cards weak compared to the Core Set? Yes, there are a few useful cards in the CPs, but most of the Core Set cards seem relatively competitive and the set only has one copy of most cards. And the Chapter Packs do not address the key missing element in the Core Set - lack of Plots.

I am also not a big fan of the Winter / Summer meta in the second set of chapter packs. It seems like you need a lot of key cards for a playgroup to make this work - much more than buying one of each chapter pack and sharing with the group. Would like to see an emphasis on building up the core mechanics rather than concentrating on specialized Global effects like Winter / Summer.

I am thinking that most play groups would be better off picking up a second copy of the Core Set before buying any Chapter Packs.

I think really that the ideal plan is for people to get hooked enough to buy multiples of both the chapter packs and the core set, which of course makes it much easier to utilize some of the new themes and mechanics such as Summer/Winter.

The chapter packs have some strong one and some weak ones (i.e. i think the winter chapter pack as the better overall cards in it then the summer) but i think as a whole the chapters apcks stand up to the core set. They only think they miss is the 'known charcaters' but the charcaters they have are good.

Also, if you want to add to your plot choices, pick up ancient enemies chapter pack.

Calling the Banners was kind of meh - although the Baratheon Vigilant guys are really awesome.

War of the Five Kings had the freaking armies and Pyro's cahe - all awesoem cards.

Overall i find the power level in the CPs to be a little stronger than that in the Core set. The Core set has a lot of utility cards, but few have made thier way into my decks yet - apart from some Plots of course.

I do tend to agree that the winter/Summer packs need some thought to use properly. But in teh overall meta - you CANNOT ignore iwnter/summer - I think the Cariion crows are msut includes, even if you don't run a lot of season effects. it looks like the ones that are out there are pretty freaking environment defining.

Stag Lord said:

Dr.Cornelius said:

It is banned in the LCG format. Stag may have glossed over that point since the NY meta is playing mostly "old-style Standard" rather than LCG.

The chapter packs only seem weaker because there are so many cards in the core sets.

Yet, the chapter packs have almost all the most powerful cards. Carrion Bird is an auto-include in nearly every deck, I find I'm playing with chapter pack characters ahead of core characters (Vanguard Scouts, those Vigilant/Reknown crazy baratheon guys (I think they're called House Florent Scouts)), and the (arguably) strongest plots are from Ancient Enemies.

The events in the core set far outstrip the variety and quality of events in the chapter packs, mind you.

You know, Carrion Bird kinda blows me away as far as power creep goes. Shadowcat was admitted as kind of a black sheep of Westeros as having been too powerful and utilitarian. That was for a 2 gold, 2 STR, Military icon, with Stealth and No Attachments. Now we get it even cheaper at 1 gold, 1 strength, military icon, and a pretty defining ability in the Summer/Winter environment. Interesting....

I agree - if you have ANY osrt of summer/winter effect in your deck - 3 x Carrion Birds are a must. The drawbacks for it being "out of season" are so severe, you just can't take the chance. Otherwise, you really can't even play some of those summer/winter cards - especially the Baratheon ones. Summer's Champion and sleyse basically become expensive claim soak out of season. In Summer - they are freaking awesome.

I don't mind auto incudes htough - and these are some of the best one gold characters we have ever seen.

They probably would have been more balanced from an "auto-include" point of view with their seasonal control ability if they hadn't had stealth.

Bastard of Robert as a Baratheon weenie is pretty darn near an auto-include, too, as a 1-cost, 1-STR, 1 icon, stealth even without the extra ability.

Of course, Bastard of Robert is just for one house. Carrion Birds are essentially an auto-include for all "six" houses.

Stag Lord said:

I think it's auto-include even without summer/winter mechanics. It's a naturally explosive card because of self-reference. We can all agree that Carrion Bird will have strong effects on military challenges in the early game; cheap stealth is really good. Well, what's the best way to counter your opponent's Carrion Bird? Your own Carrion Bird. Their raven manipulation text is also self-referential. If you and your opponent have carrion birds out, and you flip a higher initiative plot, you can sneak your military challenge in (with stealth of course) and shuffle their bird back in their deck (unless they wisely just kill it for claim). In any case, you'll want to include them as meta against any winter or summer shenanigans your opponent will use against you, considering Black and White Raven are immune to non-raven cards.

In short, they'd have been near-auto-includes if they didn't have their raven manipulation text. With a near-exclusive meta function and self-referential explosiveness, you pretty much *have* to play it, because your opponent sure will. If they don't? Whatever, you have cheap stealthy pigeons.

Kennon said:

Just pointing out that a 1-for-1 monocon with stealth is likely to be cut very late, if at all, from a deck. If the Bird wasn't neutral, it would pretty much be an auto include for the House that had it.