Paul has every right to be upset after what Doug posted today. I don't blame him at all. I was disgusted when I saw Dougs post throwing everyone under the bus. He killed his own mantra with that post. Paul is a human being. Stop putting him on some kind of pedestal people.

Because everyone just let it go when lance Armstrong was caught doping, or when Michael vick was caught dog fighting.

When you're a big name in something you're in the spot light and have to bare that in mind when you act.

People are always disappointed to find their heroes have feet of clay.

Because those were allowed by the rules/law, right?

Make no doubt, FFG is going to look very closely at this. Cutting down these players helps nothing.

Hoth, New Mexico, Virginia. This is just the beginning.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

Paul has every right to be upset after what Doug posted today. I don't blame him at all. I was disgusted when I saw Dougs post throwing everyone under the bus. He killed his own mantra with that post. Paul is a human being. Stop putting him on some kind of pedestal people.

Because everyone just let it go when lance Armstrong was caught doping, or when Michael vick was caught dog fighting.

When you're a big name in something you're in the spot light and have to bare that in mind when you act.

People are always disappointed to find their heroes have feet of clay.

Doping: Expressly forbidden

Dogfighting: Illegal

Intentional Draw in X-Wing Competitive Play: Expressly condoned.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

They started with 45. Drops don't change how many rounds you play.

Ackbar, when the shields fell.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

2 dropped sometime in the middle.

6 rounds, per regulation.

Dig harder.

Ackbar, when the shields fell.

Piett, when the shields fell maybe?

this 'both sides are bad' bull has to stop. Hothie's posts, both here and on Facebook are personal attacks thinly veiled behind cries of 'sportsmanship'. It's the passive-aggressive nature of the attacks that get me- he could at least grow a pair and not try and dance around what he's saying.

All things considered, Paul has every right to be furious about this. This isn't exploiting a poorly worded rule, this isn't finding a loophole, this is doing something FFG have explicitly given the a-ok to do. And yet we have a former world champion calling him a 'disappointment' and 'the end of casual play', from the pretense of a moral high ground.

If I were Paul, I'd be seriously considering walking away from the game, or at least competitive play. He wins his games, he follows the rules, he does his best to be an upstanding bloke and this is the thanks he gets? We as a community should be ashamed.

Paul has every right to be upset after what Doug posted today. I don't blame him at all. I was disgusted when I saw Dougs post throwing everyone under the bus. He killed his own mantra with that post. Paul is a human being. Stop putting him on some kind of pedestal people.

Because everyone just let it go when lance Armstrong was caught doping, or when Michael vick was caught dog fighting.

When you're a big name in something you're in the spot light and have to bare that in mind when you act.

People are always disappointed to find their heroes have feet of clay.

Doping: Expressly forbidden

Dogfighting: Illegal

Intentional Draw in X-Wing Competitive Play: Expressly condoned.

Then compare it to PED's in baseball.

They were legal until more recently than you think. Yet, players from the era of legality have a hard time making it into the hall of fame on mere suspicion.

I think we should bet on the over/under of the time that this thread gets locked on Monday morning, April 11th. I bet that the mod's post explaining the lock will occur at 9:11 am CST US.

this 'both sides are bad' bull has to stop. Hothie's posts, both here and on Facebook are personal attacks thinly veiled behind cries of 'sportsmanship'. It's the passive-aggressive nature of the attacks that get me- he could at least grow a pair and not try and dance around what he's saying.

All things considered, Paul has every right to be furious about this. This isn't exploiting a poorly worded rule, this isn't finding a loophole, this is doing something FFG have explicitly given the a-ok to do. And yet we have a former world champion calling him a 'disappointment' and 'the end of casual play', from the pretense of a moral high ground.

If I were Paul, I'd be seriously considering walking away from the game, or at least competitive play. He wins his games, he follows the rules, he does his best to be an upstanding bloke and this is the thanks he gets? We as a community should be ashamed.

First we owe Paul absolutely nothing. You make the decisions you get to deal with public opinion. If he left the game over this would be ridiculously. His statement was beyond childish.

I think getting the crap he got from Doug is perfectly good reason for him to be angry. Paul doesn't seem to care about the masses hating him. But, to get that crap from someone who he thought was friendly with, yeah, that is an entirely different situation.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

They started with 45. Drops don't change how many rounds you play.

You play 5 rounds all the way up to 64 players. Drops don't change how many people are at the top tables unless one of those people dropped.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

45.

2 dropped sometime in the middle.

6 rounds, per regulation.

Dig harder.

Good gracious, the top result for tournament rules is old. Why did FFG change that? Should be 5 all the way to 64 players. Well, thats why this happened then.

In any sort of tournament with a cut to Top 8, you don't play until there is a winner. You play until mathematically there should be 8 players left.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

They started with 45. Drops don't change how many rounds you play.

You play 5 rounds all the way up to 64 players. Drops don't change how many people are at the top tables unless one of those people dropped.

I'm seeing 25-44 for 5 rounds in the basic structure.

This whole affair makes me sad. We have worked so hard to build an open, fun, and competitive community. seeing all the vitriol and poison in this thread is really a kick in the nuts. FFG, please change this rule and let us get back to pursuing excellence.

As a TO, I will say this. Being full set against the rule. But enforcement of them being my responsibility. And I follow the organization rules meticulously. If you come to me asking to draw, I will challenge you to prove to me that you have not discussed it before coming to me. Which I would only be justified in doing. If you are successful in that case I will examine the standings to determine if there is even a remote opportunity for you to be displaced from your rank, and if so disallow the draw as obviously I can't let you change the results of the tournament. So until it's revoked, I will enforce the rules. Most critically. If it's not revoked The Guardtower may need a new TO for their X-wing events.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

They started with 45. Drops don't change how many rounds you play.

You play 5 rounds all the way up to 64 players. Drops don't change how many people are at the top tables unless one of those people dropped.

I'm seeing 25-44 for 5 rounds in the basic structure.

You are correct. A previous PDF that is still online showed 64, so my initial post is wrong. Which is the number it should be. If there is a cut to top 8 with Swiss normal rounds, it should be 5 rounds to 64 because with that cut, you need to play just enough rounds to get to a top 8.

We are debating the wrong rule. FFG has the number of Swiss rounds wrong, which caused this, not intentional draws.

This whole affair makes me sad. We have worked so hard to build an open, fun, and competive community. seeing all the vitriol and poison in this thread is really a kick in the nuts. FFG, please change this rule and let us get back to pursing excellence.

It's things like this that really expose how people are...

Terrible rule, but players are put in an awkward spot by it and you can't blame them for using it. It also really would feel sh*tty to be the one poor fool who tried to live up to the spirit of the game and be punished for it, so be upset at the rule not the players.

At least I can go to tournaments and stop being surprised and upset at how people act now. Or maybe just stay home and re-play X-Wing: Alliance instead.

Did some other digging, found out that that the tournament was NOT played to FFG rules.

There were 43 people in the tournament. FFG rules state there should be 5 rounds of swiss.

With 6 rounds of Swiss, this scenario is going to happen pretty much every time at this number of players.

There are reasons why the Swiss rounds are capped BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I'm disappointed in everyone here.

They started with 45. Drops don't change how many rounds you play.

You play 5 rounds all the way up to 64 players. Drops don't change how many people are at the top tables unless one of those people dropped.

Regionals are using the Advanced event structure which calls for 6 Rounds and a cut to Top 8 for attendance between 41-76 players. Even the Basic structure calls for 6 rounds at 45 players. So I have zero idea where you are getting this from but it is not correct based on the X-wing Tournament Regulations.

This is what led Paul Heaver to post what he did. Doug, the guy who "retired" from X-Wing. Riiiiiight. What melodramatic crap.

Doug Kinney, everyone. Calling out a 17-year old kid. The players in question followed the rules as published and distributed by FFG. Take your gripes to them instead of insulting players who played by the rules.

So the moral of the story is we need to drop the last round of swiss so players feelings are not hurt when. The top cut all take draws effectively wasting 90mins of people time playing a round that does not matter.

It seems a bit dodgy to be screenshotting what someone posted to their own private Facebook page... It's significantly different than replying/responding to something publicly posted to a forum.