None of the Imperial Senators in the Rebel Alliance council mentioned being freshly out of a job in Rogue One, so presumably sometime between Rogue One and A New Hope is when the Emperor dissolves the Senate. Thus, when she leaves Scarif, Leia has certain powers and privileges; but by the time Vader catches her, they are gone.

I can almost see them disbanding the entire Senate just to strip Leia of her diplomatic status once they realize it was her ship that took off with the data.

The Senate is dissolved during ANH.

Or the characters we see on screen are just learning about it, the timing could go either way.

None of the Imperial Senators in the Rebel Alliance council mentioned being freshly out of a job in Rogue One, so presumably sometime between Rogue One and A New Hope is when the Emperor dissolves the Senate. Thus, when she leaves Scarif, Leia has certain powers and privileges; but by the time Vader catches her, they are gone.

I can almost see them disbanding the entire Senate just to strip Leia of her diplomatic status once they realize it was her ship that took off with the data.

The Senate is dissolved during ANH.

Or the characters we see on screen are just learning about it, the timing could go either way.

It could have been dissolved 10 year prior and they never bothered to tell anyone. LOL

Until evidence to the contrary is put into canon then the ANH timing stands.

None of the Imperial Senators in the Rebel Alliance council mentioned being freshly out of a job in Rogue One, so presumably sometime between Rogue One and A New Hope is when the Emperor dissolves the Senate. Thus, when she leaves Scarif, Leia has certain powers and privileges; but by the time Vader catches her, they are gone.

I can almost see them disbanding the entire Senate just to strip Leia of her diplomatic status once they realize it was her ship that took off with the data.

The Senate is dissolved during ANH.

Or the characters we see on screen are just learning about it, the timing could go either way.

It could have been dissolved 10 year prior and they never bothered to tell anyone. LOL

Until evidence to the contrary is put into canon then the ANH timing stands.

Nothing shown or said on-screen during ANH establishes that the dissolution of the Senate took place during the span of time depicted during ANH.

All we can surmise is that Leia doesn't know about it yet because of her attempt to claim a sort of Senatorial immunity, and because of her reaction to being told about the dissolution of the Senate, so despite your sad attempt at "humor", it's highly unlikely to have happened 10 years prior.

In fact, the exact reveal from Tarkin is as follows:

"The Imperial Senate will no longer be of any concern to us. I've just received word that the Emperor has dissolved the council permanently. The last remnants of the Old Republic have been swept away."

Your exact claim was "The Senate is dissolved during ANH." What Tarkin says does not establish this as fact -- it ONLY establishes that Tarkin is telling Leia that he has recently received word of it. For all we know, Tarkin knew of the plan for weeks or months before it occurred (no unlikely, given his status in the Imperial hierarchy), and knew that it has been done since before the opening scene of ANH. Just because he tells Leia about it at that moment, doesn't really -- in and of itself -- establish all that much about the timing of the actual event.

Unless of course you're trusting Tarkin to be honest with Leia...

Now, the events of Rogue One give us tighter "first likely timing" of the dissolution of the Senate, and suggest it takes place after those events.

E: the funniest part of all this is, at least according to Wikipedia, in Legends "canon", my theory about Leia's revealed involvement in the Rebellion being the pretext for Palpatine and his "braintrust" dissolving the Senate is actually what happened. Just read that while looking at the page with the quote from Tarkin... Who knew?

On Antilles and Leia lying to Vader - they're not trying to convince him. They're telling Vader where to stick it, and with some dignity to everyone else involved. It's not unlike a red-handed perp in the box insisting he doesn't know anything.

Keeping with the same topic, I read a short article in Vanity Fair (they have Star Wars nerds in the masthead?) about how tentative lines in ANH about the Death Star plans become nonsensical.

And that's just wrong - as is the case for something as deeply culturally engrained as this, the audience knows the story too well. Only Galen Erso actually saw the flaw. Jyn never did, and though she inspired everyone to believe in taking risks to find out, anyone pragmatic enough to have survived leading the Rebellion is going to be skeptical. So it makes all the sense in the world for Leia to consider it nothing more than a hopeful but long-shot claim and want verification up until Dodonna's briefing.

Bottom line: meta-knowledge can lead astray!

Or its been several days since Scarif, before they caught up with the Tantive IV.

Vader cannot be sure its the same ship, the Alliance have a number of Corvettes, and have been chasing a few different leads.

Noone has specified Rogue One ends a mere 10 mins before ANH starts, it could be hours, or days... potentially weeks, between the two.

Or its been several days since Scarif, before they caught up with the Tantive IV.

Vader cannot be sure its the same ship, the Alliance have a number of Corvettes, and have been chasing a few different leads.

Noone has specified Rogue One ends a mere 10 mins before ANH starts, it could be hours, or days... potentially weeks, between the two.

I only hope that this brief period of time will lead to a re-canonization of Kyle Katarn and the original Dark Forces Cast. I miss Kyle.

"The Imperial Senate will no longer be of any concern to us. I've just received word that the Emperor has dissolved the council permanently. The last remnants of the Old Republic have been swept away."

Your exact claim was "The Senate is dissolved during ANH." What Tarkin says does not establish this as fact -- it ONLY establishes that Tarkin is telling Leia that he has recently received word of it.

The line you're quoting was not directed at Leia; it was directed to a conference room full of Imperial officials.

"The Imperial Senate will no longer be of any concern to us. I've just received word that the Emperor has dissolved the council permanently. The last remnants of the Old Republic have been swept away."

Your exact claim was "The Senate is dissolved during ANH." What Tarkin says does not establish this as fact -- it ONLY establishes that Tarkin is telling Leia that he has recently received word of it.

The line you're quoting was not directed at Leia; it was directed to a conference room full of Imperial officials.

Is there not a response to Leia when she claims Senatorial priveledge?

Either way it doesn't change the fact -- the claim that the dissolution of the Senate definitively occurs after the opening crawl of ANH is not supported by anything we see or hear in ANH. Based on facts alone, such a claim may or may not be true.

Is there not a response to Leia when she claims Senatorial priveledge?

Not that makes any reference to the Imperial Senate or its dissolution, no. She brings it up to Vader twice when they meet on the Tantive IV; both time he shrugs it off and basically says that he knows that she's a traitor.

Either way it doesn't change the fact -- the claim that the dissolution of the Senate definitively occurs after the opening crawl of ANH is not supported by anything we see or hear in ANH. Based on facts alone, such a claim may or may not be true.

'Definitely', no; I'll agree with that... but it's a reasonable assumption given how things unfold...

In Leia's first scene with Vader, she twice refers to the Imperial Senate as though it's an active organization. In the scene immediately following, an Imperial officer also brings up the Senate; specifically expressing concerns as to how they might react to them holding Leia captive.

Later in the movie during the (if I'm not mistaken) first scene aboard the Death Star, another Imperial officer is again expressing concerns about the Rebellion gaining support within the Senate. It is then that Tarkin walks in and tells him to cool his jets because the Senate has gone bye-bye.

Now, one can do all of the narrative gymnastics that they want to regarding slow communication or people lying or keeping it a secret or whatever, but the events as presented in the movie do in fact appear to indicate that the Senate was dissolved at some point after the opening crawl.

Anyone pay attention to the CC on that clip?

Tarkin apparently refers to Vader as "beta". Hah, priceless!

So how many will see the movie again? or not, because of the ethics? How many will buy digital copies? How many will go see Star Wars 8, or not, if the tech is used again?

Why would people have ethical issues with what happened when Disney had permission from Cushing's family to do what they did? I somehow doubt Cushing left "do not use CGIs of my characters in future movies" wishes in his will or expressed those desires while he was alive.

So how many will see the movie again? or not, because of the ethics? How many will buy digital copies? How many will go see Star Wars 8, or not, if the tech is used again?

Why would people have ethical issues with what happened when Disney had permission from Cushing's family to do what they did? I somehow doubt Cushing left "do not use CGIs of my characters in future movies" wishes in his will or expressed those desires while he was alive.

In this particular situation, I don't think the ethics are that complicated or dire. It was going to be hard to do this movie without those characters appearing at some point, and they had full permission.

However, when you get out into the larger topic of digitally replacing actors, it gets far stickier.

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

No need for spoiler tags in this thread, is there?

As for what you wrote: are people not invested in Obi-Wan? Vader? Han? They all die during the course of the movies. When it comes to how people relate to characters, death is not the end.

If you watch a historical movie, do you feel "eh who cares, these people are long dead by now"?

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

No need for spoiler tags in this thread, is there?

As for what you wrote: are people not invested in Obi-Wan? Vader? Han? They all die during the course of the movies. When it comes to how people relate to characters, death is not the end.

If you watch a historical movie, do you feel "eh who cares, these people are long dead by now"?

I was never "invested" in Vader. Han's death in TFA was just another bit of the rot that made up that entire movie. And I don't have a problem with one character dying, or some characters dying. I have a problem with the wholesale death of the entire team.

Most characters are "going to die" eventually, but if I'm watching historical fiction where I knew all or most of the characters were going to die in the course of the actual movie, then my "investment" is going to be at a minimum.

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

You can only get invested in characters who are part of multi-movie franchises?

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

No need for spoiler tags in this thread, is there?

As for what you wrote: are people not invested in Obi-Wan? Vader? Han? They all die during the course of the movies. When it comes to how people relate to characters, death is not the end.

If you watch a historical movie, do you feel "eh who cares, these people are long dead by now"?

I was never "invested" in Vader. Han's death in TFA was just another bit of the rot that made up that entire movie. And I don't have a problem with one character dying, or some characters dying. I have a problem with the wholesale death of the entire team.

Most characters are "going to die" eventually, but if I'm watching historical fiction where I knew all or most of the characters were going to die in the course of the actual movie, then my "investment" is going to be at a minimum.

Yeah...that Saving Private Ryan. What a piece o' crap.

So yeah, saw it the other day, and I wasn't too impressed to be honest.

It felt average. I didn't get any investment into the characters, and couldn't recall the names of most of them even while watching it. They just fit their PC party stereotypes. Heck, the pilot even kept calling himself "The Pilot".

I never got that emotional rush I usually get with Star Wars movies, even the prequels give it to me. I found the fan service excessive and unnecessary from start to finish.

Though I am happy (if you can say that) that the ending was how I suspected it would end. I'm glad they went that route.

Overall I give it a 6/10.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

You can only get invested in characters who are part of multi-movie franchises?

I don't recall saying that.

Yeah...that Saving Private Ryan. What a piece o' crap.

Meh, I lost interest in what was going to happen to any of the remaining characters before the end of the movie.

You know, I think the most disappointing thing for me is that they made Rogue One into a fairly standard dirty-dozen / magnificent-seven-style action flick.

I guess back when it was announced, it we learned it was going to be about "the stolen plans" part of the backstory, I was expecting more infiltration, intrigue, plotting, suspense, etc.

I guess back when it was announced, it we learned it was going to be about "the stolen plans" part of the backstory, I was expecting more infiltration, intrigue, plotting, suspense, etc.

Infiltration: Most of the last act of the movie. Check.

Intrigue/Plotting: Rogues secretly attempting a mission on their own, Krennic kidnapping a scientist from his family to develop a super weapon and further his career, Krennic vs. Tarkin political maneuvering, Orso putting a design flaw in the DS. Check.

Suspense: Lots in the last act if you didn't read spoilers - who lives and who dies?. If you weren't a Star Wars fan at all, will they get the plans?. Vader walk of death was pretty suspenseful with that guy holding the plans through the partially open door. Check.

Yeah, the Vader scene had me on the edge of my seat by the end of it.

Well, just got back from watching it again - my mom wanted to go see it a second time, so she could follow all the action. How does it stand up with a little bit of distance and now that the Honeymoon has cooled off a bit?

I was sitting there, end credits rolling, thinking "Yeah, I could just sit here for the next showing and be perfectly fine". For a counterpoint, I only saw E7 twice and can't be bothered to even put the DVD on in the year I've had it. Even the CGI Tarkin didnt really bug me that much this time.

On that note, I asked my mom if she thought anything was off or weird with the Leia and Tarkin cameos. She said she really didnt notice anything, and that should she have? "Well, Peter Cushing has been dead since 1994".

"Oh."

So yeah, it looks like if you aren't a supernerd and knew what was up with the actor(s), the CGI pill goes down easier.

Either way it doesn't change the fact -- the claim that the dissolution of the Senate definitively occurs after the opening crawl of ANH is not supported by anything we see or hear in ANH. Based on facts alone, such a claim may or may not be true.

Exactly. If I go to bed right now and check my facebook feed on Sunday morning, I will have just received word that the Seahawks delivered a massive beatdown on the Bulls and that the last team between us and the Superbowl has just been swept away.

Still doesn't change the fact that the game was played on Saturday.

And honestly...

The ending means we'll never have any investment in those characters.

Strongly disagree. I was WAY more broken up by the deaths of K2, Chirrut and Baze than I was by the strangely emotionally dead scene when Solo died.

Exactly. If I go to bed right now and check my facebook feed on Sunday morning, I will have just received word that the Seahawks delivered a massive beatdown on the Bulls and that the last team between us and the Superbowl has just been swept away.

In YRWU (your real-world universe), is it the Detroit Bulls or Chicago Bulls playing as a football team? And the Atlanta Falcons and Dallas Cowboys don't exist? (you got a couple more games to play to get in the Super Bowl)