If women don't play X-Wing, why is that a problem? Why does the gender of my opponent matter?

We must have exactly 50/50 representation in everything. We should force women to play X-Wing, for equality.

If women don't play X-Wing, why is that a problem? Why does the gender of my opponent matter?

We must have exactly 50/50 representation in everything. We should force women to play X-Wing, for equality.

MOAR EQUALITY QUOTAS!

there simply aren't as many women interested in these sorts of games?

But why?

there simply aren't as many women interested in these sorts of games?

But why?

Because all the white male terrorists chased them off!

Or maybe it's a nuanced situation involving peer pressure among women, varying levels of interest and aptitude by sex, and other such stuff that will never provide as clear cut and easy an answer as "Because men suck."

there simply aren't as many women interested in these sorts of games?

But why?

Because all the white male terrorists chased them off!

Or maybe it's a nuanced situation involving peer pressure among women, varying levels of interest and aptitude by sex, and other such stuff that will never provide as clear cut and easy an answer as "Because men suck."

I actually think it starts way earlier than that, when people start buying toys for toddlers and choosing what media to expose them too. It's definitely a very complicated issue, that doesn't relate just to wargames either. A lot of the high-powered, high-wage employment markets are dominated by men, and women traditionally dominate more care-giving industries like nursing, teaching, aged care, child care, etc. Is this because women are genetically inclined to these kind of roles, or is it because of how our society is structured? And if it's a blend of the two answers (as it almost surely is) then to what degree is each element responsible?

As we promote the X-Wing culture as "Fly Casual" and how friendly it is to new people... why don't we have more women involved in our hobby? I wouldn't say it was lack of interest in Star Wars. I also wouldn't say that women are not good at tabletop games or strategy games.

Another guy thinking that if a community isn't 50% women that means that men are sexist. How brainwashed can you be? Woman and man are different so they have different hobby preferences. Simple as that. But when a girl comes to a netrunner/ x-wing tournament she is treated way better than a new white male. I'm not a fan of this but that's a fact. Guys white knight to such an extent that when I got to play one she tries to cheat me several times, being used to getting what she wants, and when I caught it it was "cmon dude".

There is one fact that you might consider sexist. In almost eveual gary community there is a silent agreement that girls suck at competetive games. Most are casmers so they always lose to competetive ones, true, but there is another reason. Because they are girls nobody tells them they suck and made a very stupid move. If I **** up and don't realize it, my friends will tell me that so often that I will learn Because everybody has been brainwashed to be super careful girls don't get any negative feedback, don't learn as fast as they could and are treated like children by men who just don't know what to do.

I am sure this problem is not prevalent than most of us realize, but framing things this way takes us no closer to solving it.

Instead of despicable behavior being the disease we need to identify and treat, straight white male gamers are the disease and their despicable behavior is merely a symptom of their collective evilness.

Now, I understand that the vast majority of gamers are straight, white, and male (at least in this part of the world) so when gamers do disgusting things to others, chances are a SWM is the culprit. But what this mind set implies is that sexual harassment from a gay man either doesn't happen or is somehow less of a crime. Same if a black male gamer makes a sexist remark or if a woman makes a racist one. Those are instances of acceptable behavior because they aren't the biggest slice of the pie chart?

Yes I'm a straight, white, male gamer so obviously I am biased here and feel a bit attacked. If you want to affect change, don't start by declaring that the majority are ALL guilty either be engaging in this shameful behavior or looking like someone who does.

Start, instead, by condemning the behavior and anyone who engages in it. That's how you get people behind you.

Put bluntly, the author of the article linked is a hypocrite. You can't make generalizations about a race and gender in the title (and throughout the article) and then go on to condemn racism and sexism. While the experiences she's had sound horrifying and painful, she's built her response on more sexism and more racism and somehow thinking that will change the world for the better.

The pot is calling the kettle white.

there simply aren't as many women interested in these sorts of games?

But why?

Because all the white male terrorists chased them off!

Or maybe it's a nuanced situation involving peer pressure among women, varying levels of interest and aptitude by sex, and other such stuff that will never provide as clear cut and easy an answer as "Because men suck."

I actually think it starts way earlier than that, when people start buying toys for toddlers and choosing what media to expose them too. It's definitely a very complicated issue, that doesn't relate just to wargames either. A lot of the high-powered, high-wage employment markets are dominated by men, and women traditionally dominate more care-giving industries like nursing, teaching, aged care, child care, etc. Is this because women are genetically inclined to these kind of roles, or is it because of how our society is structured? And if it's a blend of the two answers (as it almost surely is) then to what degree is each element responsible?

I think that's a pretty deep topic, that's probably not going to be answered on a gaming forum, or anywhere anytime soon.

I'm an archaeologist not a rocket scientist, but I reckon that instead of a bunch of mostly middle-aged male gamers discussing **** that they really know very little about, they should maybe do the obvious.

Ask women why they don't game.

Find out and then address the issue.

Cheers

Baaa

first off, if you don't like a topic of conversation or have seen it too many times before, you are free not to keep reading. telling people not to post these kind of topic is not very nice. just because you don't want to talk about it, it doesn't mean others don't want to talk about.

I will say this, I think that even though it may be true that girls on average aren't too interested in x-wing and similar miniature games because they are interested in different things than guys, it's entirely possible that part of the reason that many girls aren't into going to a tabletop game is that our culture has established certain places as conducive to social activities which are acceptable to girls, and any other place is kind of unknown and perceived as possibly unsafe.

keep in mind that a single girl, in our society, is generally more in danger going around town that a single guy. to go in a store to meet and play with people you've never met before, it's inherently more of a risk for a girl than is for a guy. you never know when you meet a weirdo who'll make you uncomfortable or try to follow you home. so it takes more courage to go to a store in the evening for a girl, compared to a guy.

granted, my wife doesn't care to play x-wing even at home with me, so I think the above point is not the only reason, but it's probably part of the reason.

I think the average guy, when going out, doesn't think "is my outfit so revealing that guys will not leave me along the whole night and some crazy guy will follow me home?" but I think it may cross the mind of a girl at one point or another.

I'm an archaeologist not a rocket scientist, but I reckon that instead of a bunch of mostly middle-aged male gamers discussing **** that they really know very little about, they should maybe do the obvious.

Ask women why they don't game.

Find out and then address the issue.

Cheers

Baaa

We did

-Grown ups playing tiny plastic toys in a fiction world. Silly and childish, grow up already ©Generic female response

first off, if you don't like a topic of conversation or have seen it too many times before, you are free not to keep reading. telling people not to post these kind of topic is not very nice. just because you don't want to talk about it, it doesn't mean others don't want to talk about.

I will say this, I think that even though it may be true that girls on average aren't too interested in x-wing and similar miniature games because they are interested in different things than guys, it's entirely possible that part of the reason that many girls aren't into going to a tabletop game is that our culture has established certain places as conducive to social activities which are acceptable to girls, and any other place is kind of unknown and perceived as possibly unsafe.

keep in mind that a single girl, in our society, is generally more in danger going around town that a single guy. to go in a store to meet and play with people you've never met before, it's inherently more of a risk for a girl than is for a guy. you never know when you meet a weirdo who'll make you uncomfortable or try to follow you home. so it takes more courage to go to a store in the evening for a girl, compared to a guy.

granted, my wife doesn't care to play x-wing even at home with me, so I think the above point is not the only reason, but it's probably part of the reason.

I think the average guy, when going out, doesn't think "is my outfit so revealing that guys will not leave me along the whole night and some crazy guy will follow me home?" but I think it may cross the mind of a girl at one point or another.

Well said, and I think the aggressiveness with which people attack this topic and try to drive it off course only shows that it's an issue that they are perpetuating. This thread is not a place for you to come in flexing your alpha male ego and if you aren't mature enough to participate in this conversation is a reasonable manner then your input isn't wanted. We have had a number of people here give first hand accounts of this sort of behavior so really the only thing we should be discussing is the proper way to recognize and prevent it as unfortunately it is not as obvious to someone who isn't directly experiencing it.

BTW, can we get your source showing game stores are more dangerous for women than anywhere else? Something non-anictodle.

Show me where I said that game stores are more dangerous for women than anywhere else. A direct quote, please.

Go ahead. I'll wait.

Also, "anictodle" isn't actually a word. Perhaps you meant anecdotal?

My LGS hasn't had much of a problem, as far as I can tell. The topic of girls/women rarely comes up anyway and if it does then the discussion is pretty civil. Not a lot of girls playing games on the actual game days (Warhammer, Friday Night Magic, X-Wing) but there's a group of board game people that frequently plays and there's always a bunch of girls. Not sure what they play, seems to change every time. They arrive when I'm leaving so I don't know them well.

The only time I can recall any group of guys at our store driving a girl (or ethnic minority) away was that socially awkward girl that used to show up on Fridays. Even then, that wasn't because she was a girl. It was entirely because she was watching One Piece in the back while we were trying to play Magic, and One Piece is ****ing awful so nobody appreciated that. Even then I don't remember anyone ever saying anything to her directly, we just complained to each other about how it was distracting or how we didn't like One Piece.

That said the store has a lot of manga and other stuff that seems to bring in a larger than average number of girls, which may help. The owner has a good attitude towards women and has mentioned a number of girls he was friends with back in college, so he isn't the type to stand for someone being especially sexist. He does occasionally put up wih it from this one libertarian nutjob, but that's mainly because he secretly thinks the guy is hilarious. THe nutjob in question also tones it down a lot when there are women present; he only lets loose when in an all-male environment because he thinks that we all agree with him even if we say otherwise. Attempts to make him not crazy have all failed.

Also, a small observation but I find girls seem to prefer cooperative and/or story driven games. Mass Effect and other Bioware titles have a much larger female playerbase than games like CoD or League of Legends, for example. There could be a number of explanations but it would help explain why most LGS staples are played mainly by guys.

Look.

I know good and well that gaming is definitely an intimidating atmosphere for women. I mean that in every type of gaming, tabletop gaming, video gaming, and so on.

You wanna know why so many guys act utterly repugnant so **** often?

Separation. Cliques. Fear. Straight up, flat out, keeping boys and girls separate from birth. That's the problem. That seriously is, the way we market toys, shows, clothes, food, games, the things we say only boys and girls can do...

That creates a divide.

A divide I can not f**king stand. You wanna know a funny thing? Boys and girls are pretty much the same up until a certain age- six, was it..? Then there's a split. Girls start getting outwardly taught to be ladylike, that boys are insensitive jerks and that they shouldn't be loud. That boys will be boys and that their job is to look and sound pretty, and that they're better than the big lumbering dumb boys.

That's f**king awful. That's what we teach kids.

That sound right to you? There's a lot more than that going on, but a lot of this crap comes from what age we're taught that we're different, and should stay different, and that's just how it is and how it's going to be. We teach kids sexism without even knowing we do.

What's even worse is that there's even such a thing as slanted progressivism. "Aw yeah man, girls can do guy things! That's great!"

"What? You're a guy that wants to do girl things? You're much less of a man now. But that girl over there, she's just as woman as she was before it all!"

I admit on that one, there's a personal thing.

Do you have any idea how hard it was to tell my Former Service in the United States Marine Corps Father that I enjoyed MLP:FiM?

Sounds small, right? My dad took news of me having intimate relations with men just fine, and I enjoyed doing that. I still do. I'm about as bi as a fork in the road. That didn't phase my dad.

But watching a show that had previously only been known as "For little girls"? Too far! MUCH TOO FAR! But my little sister...

She got to enjoy Green Lantern as a character, idolize Tony Stark and Steve Rogers. Her parents celebrate that she likes boy things and girl things.

But, the older son enjoying something not made specifically for him? Not being an athlete or a terribly physical individual? Shame. "I failed as a parent" and so on. Hell I recently sang "Bad Romance" word for word, note for note all out on Rock Band 4 and the entire time and time after, my dad felt nothing but shame. Even the french part!

But, hey, little sister goes all out on a song by dudes for dudes and so on? Nah it's cool.

Do you see what I'm saying here?

There is nothing we can do to fix the mentalities of grown men. They are grown men now, and the only thing that will change them is experiencing it themselves, or having a legitimate reason to change other than wanting to.

But we can fix how we raise our Children.

We can stop telling them they're so different. That _____ is for boys, and that _____ is for girls, that they have to act certain ways and that society expects something specific from them. Tell them that they can change things, that though society may expect the usual from them, they don't have to conform to those standards anymore. That things can change.

People say "Change starts with you."

But you can't change things by shaming people.

You can change things by making our children the engine of change for the betterment of society. Stop teaching them tired old concepts that no longer apply, or that they have to do _____. They are their own people, and as human beings have a curiosity and free will unknown to anything else on this world.

Never get in the way of that.

That's what we can really do about this.

Nice one Captain.

Also, that tumblr post is maybe the worst way to go about this. Making the majority group feel attacked just makes them feel justified in not speaking up when something like this happens. And as someone else pointed out, they're criticizing racism and sexism by accusing a specific race and gender of sexually harassing people. I'm admittedly skeptical of a lot of those anecdotes as well. I can believe a lot of them, but some of them are a bit harder. In particular, I have trouble imagining a bunch of guys literally chanting that "old enough to bleed..." saying. What seems much more likely is that one guy would say some creepy **** like that and the other guys would be too flabbergasted to do anything before she was out the door (not that I blame her for getting the hell away from such a person as fast as possible). I'm not sure if the incidents mentioned are supposed to all be things that happened to the author or if they were supposed to be a collection of things sent in by others, but I have a hard time believing that that much groping has been directed at a single person. A lot of the people in these anecdotes seem less like people and more like the atheists in those Chick Tracts you might have seen online. I'm not saying these things don't happen, I'm just doubting that these are all accurate accounts of things that happened to one person.

Nice one Captain.

Most of my posts are s*itposts or not incredibly high brow.

Thought I'd mix things up a little. Keep things interesting.

Warning... subject matter is strong and may cause a reaction... it did in me...

I was actually having a good weekend, enjoying the Hoth Open, all of the fun with the podcast switcheroos, and being on Twitter during all of it. At the same time, I have been backstage on our local theatre's production of Steel Magnolias. And then I came across James D'Amato's (One Shot / Campaign Podcast... for those of you that follow any of the Star Wars RPG people) post:

James D'Amato@OneShotRPG

I want gaming to be safe and open, but we need to work to make that happen. Everyone in my audience should read this http://latining.tumblr.com/post/141567276944/tabletop-gaming-has-a-white-male-terrorism-problem …

I will warn you, there is strong language in here... and it is about Male White Gamers. I'm sure not everyone on the forums here is one of the people causing the problem. In fact, I don't know that anyone is, but the following questions/thoughts immediately occurred to me:

1) Star Wars in general started off on the wrong foot on this. Over the years, disparity has been addressed some, but it was obviously white guy centric at the start and through the metal bikini...

2) I've watched a lot of games and listened to a lot of podcasts within X-Wing. Aside from one match with Kris Sherrif's canadian store, I don't recall seeing or hearing another woman on a show. Perhaps I have missed them and they are more populous than I have had the opportunity to see, but I'm not currently convinced of that.

3) I've followed several large events in whatever media was available. I've seen a lot of white guys. I know there are others that play, if you want to involve other nationalities, but I really do not know what the diversity is. What I do know is I have seen a lot of guys like me.

As we promote the X-Wing culture as "Fly Casual" and how friendly it is to new people... why don't we have more women involved in our hobby? I wouldn't say it was lack of interest in Star Wars. I also wouldn't say that women are not good at tabletop games or strategy games. As I don't have a local gaming store, I am an odd man out at this. The closest gaming store at all is 30 miles away (which is new and better than my previous 50+ mile trip) but the wife of the owner is heavily involved, they just don't play enough X-Wing often enough for my preference.

As the post is in a non-specific tabletop game, the post is not necessarily pointed at our group. But, on the other hand, it's not specifically NOT pointed at our group? So, are we part of the problem or are we making our stores a safe place for women to join our ranks and in time they will be seen on the top tables at the Open Series and Worlds?

Please be respectful of others as you venture into the comments (or leave one) below...

Bull guano. Didn't happen. Why do I say that? It presupposes gamers are vile people who hate women.

Rubbish, I would my self choose not to label large numbers of whole subsections of society in a negative way (as people in this thread have done). That's a biggoted way of thinking.

Some nutter posts obvious trollbait on the interwebz and people swallow it up, why? Because all this current obsession people have with the mythical prevalence of mysogeny? If "she" had posted up that all gamers were racist and she as a black woman had been abused...would that have been swallowed as readily?

There are fewer women playing wargames than men. This in turn puts women off. Because no one wants to be in an obvious minority. Vilifying the player base as a bunch of socially inept woman haters then feeds any trepidation and prevents women from getting involved.

If we want more women involved, then let's try and be more positive. We don't need to dwell on negative myths and male hate fantasy.

Look.

I know good and well that gaming is definitely an intimidating atmosphere for women. I mean that in every type of gaming, tabletop gaming, video gaming, and so on.

You wanna know why so many guys act utterly repugnant so **** often?

Separation. Cliques. Fear. Straight up, flat out, keeping boys and girls separate from birth. That's the problem. That seriously is, the way we market toys, shows, clothes, food, games, the things we say only boys and girls can do...

That creates a divide.

A divide I can not f**king stand. You wanna know a funny thing? Boys and girls are pretty much the same up until a certain age- six, was it..? Then there's a split. Girls start getting outwardly taught to be ladylike, that boys are insensitive jerks and that they shouldn't be loud. That boys will be boys and that their job is to look and sound pretty, and that they're better than the big lumbering dumb boys.

That's f**king awful. That's what we teach kids.

That sound right to you? There's a lot more than that going on, but a lot of this crap comes from what age we're taught that we're different, and should stay different, and that's just how it is and how it's going to be. We teach kids sexism without even knowing we do.

What's even worse is that there's even such a thing as slanted progressivism. "Aw yeah man, girls can do guy things! That's great!"

"What? You're a guy that wants to do girl things? You're much less of a man now. But that girl over there, she's just as woman as she was before it all!"

I admit on that one, there's a personal thing.

Do you have any idea how hard it was to tell my Former Service in the United States Marine Corps Father that I enjoyed MLP:FiM?

Sounds small, right? My dad took news of me having intimate relations with men just fine, and I enjoyed doing that. I still do. I'm about as bi as a fork in the road. That didn't phase my dad.

But watching a show that had previously only been known as "For little girls"? Too far! MUCH TOO FAR! But my little sister...

She got to enjoy Green Lantern as a character, idolize Tony Stark and Steve Rogers. Her parents celebrate that she likes boy things and girl things.

But, the older son enjoying something not made specifically for him? Not being an athlete or a terribly physical individual? Shame. "I failed as a parent" and so on. Hell I recently sang "Bad Romance" word for word, note for note all out on Rock Band 4 and the entire time and time after, my dad felt nothing but shame. Even the french part!

But, hey, little sister goes all out on a song by dudes for dudes and so on? Nah it's cool.

Do you see what I'm saying here?

There is nothing we can do to fix the mentalities of grown men. They are grown men now, and the only thing that will change them is experiencing it themselves, or having a legitimate reason to change other than wanting to.

But we can fix how we raise our Children.

We can stop telling them they're so different. That _____ is for boys, and that _____ is for girls, that they have to act certain ways and that society expects something specific from them. Tell them that they can change things, that though society may expect the usual from them, they don't have to conform to those standards anymore. That things can change.

People say "Change starts with you."

But you can't change things by shaming people.

You can change things by making our children the engine of change for the betterment of society. Stop teaching them tired old concepts that no longer apply, or that they have to do _____. They are their own people, and as human beings have a curiosity and free will unknown to anything else on this world.

Never get in the way of that.

That's what we can really do about this.

This is the first time I've wished I could like something more than once.

Some of us believe the post because we've seen and heard similar things happen in person, or because we've heard of too many similar things happening from women we know. When I read through her story -- and I'll admit, she seems to have sh!t luck, hit a perfect storm of misogyny, or whatever, but -- as I went from little vignette to little vignette, you know what happened? Instead of doubting each one, one at a time, I remembered seeing or hearing about each one, one at a time. "My wife told me about that, one year," I thought, or "Her best friend mentioned something like that," or "I remember when some guys at the game store said something like that," or "Yeah, I saw that at GenCon last year."

Her post isn't what makes it an issue. Her post -- incendiary as it is, incendiary as the title is -- is starting the conversation, but it's not the whole story, not the whole issue. The things that happen just like the things in her post? That's the problem. These are things that happen. Maybe you haven't heard of them before. Maybe you've heard of them before and immediately denied they could happen. Maybe no one's told you about them before because they felt you wouldn't listen. But they happen, and that's the problem.

And the immediacy with which she gets called a liar, and the immediacy with which we circle the wagons and deny any of those things could ever happen in our hobby, and the immediacy with which gamers get defensive about all of it.

Some of us believe the post because we've seen and heard similar things happen in person, or because we've heard of too many similar things happening from women we know. When I read through her story -- and I'll admit, she seems to have **** luck, hit a perfect storm of misogyny, or whatever, but -- as I went from little vignette to little vignette, you know what happened? Instead of doubting each one, one at a time, I remembered seeing or hearing about each one, one at a time. "My wife told me about that, one year," I thought, or "Her best friend mentioned something like that," or "I remember when some guys at the game store said something like that," or "Yeah, I saw that at GenCon last year."

Her post isn't what makes it an issue. Her post -- incendiary as it is, incendiary as the title is -- is starting the conversation, but it's not the whole story, not the whole issue. The things that happen just like the things in her post? That's the problem. These are things that happen. Maybe you haven't heard of them before. Maybe you've heard of them before and immediately denied they could happen. Maybe no one's told you about them before because they felt you wouldn't listen. But they happen, and that's the problem.

And the immediacy with which she gets called a liar, and the immediacy with which we circle the wagons and deny any of those things could ever happen in our hobby, and the immediacy with which gamers get defensive about all of it.

I should point out that to someone like me, who has never seen anything even close to what she was discussing, she really does seem like a liar. The worst incident I'm aware of at my LGS was the libertarian guy I mentioned ranting about how women should be legally forbidden from posting or uploading content to the internet ("they can look, but they shouldn't be able to put anything on it or talk to each other"). The owner has a talent for calming that guy down and only let him get that far because they were the only people in the store and the owner enjoys talking to people with extreme opinions.

It's likely that some of the other posters have had experiences like mine, and from our perspective it's harder to believe. I'm not saying there's no problem, but I am saying that I suspect there is a great deal of exaggeration or misremembering in that tumblr post and the hostile "white guys are the problem" attitude is hypocritical and counterproductive.

See to me racism, sexism, attacks against religious or political beliefs, and the like should not be tolerated. It doesn't matter who the victim is and who the perpetrator is. It doesn't matter if the person across the 3x3 field of stars, debris, and asteroids i'm getting ready to (hopefully) enjoy the next 75 minutes of taking little plastic star-ship battles as seriously as any admiral takes a war is a middle aged white man, a young asian kid, or a 80 year old African-American Grandmother, or any other of the diverse combinations that humans can come in under the sun or the moon. I'm there to have fun, roll some dice, and with a bit of luck, and a bit of skill out fly my opponent, ideally with us both ending the game with a handshake, an exchange of "Good Game" and a smile as we pack up and discuss the key turning points, and lucky (or unlucky) rolls we both had.

While a conversation on the topic could be good. I am saddened, and appalled with how you started it. You ask are "Are Male White Gamers the Problem?". To that i say Two Things.

1 - If it was intentional to try and create a stir with flamebait, same on you. We as a community should be, and can be, better then that. If that was not your intention, then please understand that not only are there better ways to pose such a question if you want an actual conversation on the matter, and not a mudslinging, blame game, shouting match. You are attacking a whole group of people, stereotyping, generalizing, and discriminating against them based upon their race and gender. Which leads to point number 2

2 - You are asking the wrong question. The question is not "Are male White Gamers the Problem?" The question should be "Do female and minority gamers feel safe and welcome, if not how can we fix it?" Your question makes the assumption that they do not, and further makes the assumption that it is a specific subset of the gaming population that is the issue. Now, i know you may say "But i was just asking IF they were the problem, not blaming them!" The problem with that is that the question is an attack, and forces the answer to be defensive instead of investigative. It's the difference between asking "Who killed this person?" and "Are you the murderer?". One is a investigative question, the other is a accusation.

You used the question as an attack, doing so prevents positive and constructive conversation and discourse. It creates a argument where one side has to prove they are innocent instead of having a discussion on the issue. So in surmation

"Are White Males the problem?" No

"Do women and minorities feel safe, and welcome in the x-wing community?" I cannot answer for them, but i have never personally seen someone singled out in a malicious manner at any event, from just game nights at the store to the recent hoth event at adepticon. Though I also will not dismiss such stories outright, but i do find it harder to believe because of my personal experience, and the experiences of those who i know.

"If they do not feel safe and welcome, what can we do to change that?" We can strive in the words of Bill S. Preston, Esq. and Ted "Theodore" Logan to "Be Excellent To Each Other". If you see someone being inappropriate, don't just be glad it isn't you and ignore it, say something. That doesn't mean you need to intervene yourself, but there are staff at stores and conventions, there fellow gamers, and if the situation merits it, there is always the police. At events where there are children, keep an eye on them for their parents. This doesn't mean you are responsible for them, but if you see a toddler playing with a power strip, remove them from the situation and find the adult they belong with. If you see someone being a creeper, overly handsy, mention something to the convention staff, or simply ask the person they are creeping on if they are ok.

X-wing, in my experience has a awesome community, and it will stay that way as long as we hold ourselves to that standard.

Fly Casual, and Be Excellent to each other.

..... of course i have been known to spout crazy from time to time, so who knows.

Well said.

1. No, I wasn't intentionally trying to inflame or incite and I had probably been thinking on it too long and did not have a good clear title to use for the subject. I don't know that there is a good clear title for the subject. I'm also not blaming a group of society, I just happened to notice that the shoe fit... not forcing anyone to wear it and not saying there aren't other reasons, causes or factors.

2. Good analysis. Good questions. It is obviously complicated and I was going on thought-stream. I should have typed it up in Word and waited till the morning, edited it and then posted it. My apologies on that.

I like the 'Be Excellent to Each Other' bit and I think we should all keep working on that, even if Wyld Stallyns never rose to prominence. I agree, the community is awesome. Maybe there is less diversity because we are the primary target audience. Maybe we are doing everything right and this is the way it will be. Maybe other games affected or influenced feelings before this. There may just be a difference in the kind of games that are enjoyed, because there probably is a gender biased diversity problem in chess too. If that is the result, I'm perfectly ok with that. If it is different than that, this is where I would be concerned.

As we promote the X-Wing culture as "Fly Casual" and how friendly it is to new people... why don't we have more women involved in our hobby? I wouldn't say it was lack of interest in Star Wars. I also wouldn't say that women are not good at tabletop games or strategy games.

Another guy thinking that if a community isn't 50% women that means that men are sexist. How brainwashed can you be? Woman and man are different so they have different hobby preferences. Simple as that. But when a girl comes to a netrunner/ x-wing tournament she is treated way better than a new white male. I'm not a fan of this but that's a fact. Guys white knight to such an extent that when I got to play one she tries to cheat me several times, being used to getting what she wants, and when I caught it it was "cmon dude".

There is one fact that you might consider sexist. In almost eveual gary community there is a silent agreement that girls suck at competetive games. Most are casmers so they always lose to competetive ones, true, but there is another reason. Because they are girls nobody tells them they suck and made a very stupid move. If I **** up and don't realize it, my friends will tell me that so often that I will learn Because everybody has been brainwashed to be super careful girls don't get any negative feedback, don't learn as fast as they could and are treated like children by men who just don't know what to do.

Nah... I don't think the community should be 50/50. And I'm not brainwashed and I don't mind explaining things and showing how the game works (or any game for that matter). The only time I've ever "white knighted" a girl while gaming was playing ping pong with a beautiful girl that eventually became my wife. Which actually turned out to be a bad mistake on my part. She hates for anyone to "let her win" and is very competitive (she went to state playoffs in basketball twice and in high jump). I also could see a learning environment might be different for a girl among guys than how a guy would be treated. Probably not much that can help that out, though at the same time, the girl is also potentially teaching the guys how to be less socially awkward, so that may even out.

I'm not calling her a lair, nor am i saying those things didn't happen. As much as i have severe doubts about some of those stories, both from my own personal experiences, and my own professional experiences ( i work in the security field, specifically personal protection ). However, my doubts does not make them untrue, nor was i actually there. I refuse to partake in victim blaming, or shaming. I will say this though, if a police officer ever hangs up on you, discounts your version of events, or any number of things the blog's author claims, talk to another officer, not only are they offenses that will cost them their job, but in several cases legal action against not only the officer personally, but against the city and/or state. Granted, my experience is limited to the US, and from what i gathered the author is Canadian, and mentions several Canadian conventions specifically, and i do not know the particular legalities in the great white north near as well.

That being said. The issue being taken is that this is NOT "Starting a conversation" this is attacking and shaming innocent people because they are the same gender, age group, and skin tone as the offenders. If you don't believe me, re-read the message you are defending and replace White, Male, and Middle-Aged, with any other combination of Skin Tone/Racial Identifier, Gender, and Age Group then see how it reads. This is a blatant attack, not starting a dialog. It belittles both the underlying message the author is trying to get across, and any attempt to fix the problem.

Edit - Grayfax's post went through as i was typing, instead of making a new post, or confusing people thinking my above was directed at him/her (can never tell over the net) i will address that below here.

i understand, and i try to assume the best of people, while accepting they might not have the same intentions. Specifically when speaking on issues such as this i would urge people that you cannot have a civil conversation when you start with accusations and blame. I truly believe that you had the best intentions, and maybe didn't think the wording through or, as is so common when discussing a topic such as this, continued with vernacular and wording that we see too commonly in topics such as this. Which is sadly often agenda driven (on both sides) and focusing on blame, instead of focusing on solutions.It is easy to make a shoe fit when the shoe is sized for your target. Most Gamers are Middle Aged White Men, Occasionally a gamer acts like a idiot therefore Middle Aged White Men are idiots.This is a classic Hasty Generalization Fallacy. It happens, and i assume it was non-malicious, and non-intentional, but you can't know there is a problem, until you can see the problem.

Asking questions, especially about community ethics, is always important. Sometimes those questions can be asked in a better way (see all the cheating questions and blame going around lately) but they **are** important to ask, talk about openly, and discuss as a community. I agree, the X-Wing community is awesome, but it can't stay awesome if we just say it is. We need to constantly police ourselves (not each other, Ourselves) and make sure we work hard, because it is hard work, to stay awesome.

This is somewhat similar what the major podcasts (at least the ones i listen to, so maybe not major) have covered in the "Fly Casual" Talks. Mynock Squadron, Nova Squadron ... and i Think Back to Dials (sorry it's 6am for me, i work nights coming off a shift and my brain is frazzled) have been talking about, and there have been some really really good discussions on the subject. Fly Casual, is great, but we as a community need to police outselves (once again, not others) on it, to make sure it stays awesome and does not get changed into a blunt tool to beat over your opponent's head.

As far as chess, i can actually answer that, or at least give a perspective on it. I played competitive chess at a national level when i was a wee lad. While there were many girls (i say girls because this was grade school and middle school) that played, the boys did out number them by (and this is a anecdotal memory mind you) of about 10:1. I have no idea the reason. Societal influence, interest in the game, gender roles of children in the 80s and 90s. All are most likely factors. I wish they were not, but then again i think chess should be taught in school for various reasons not pertinent to this topic.

In the end, and mind you this is my personal opinion, i think it comes down to competitiveness and what we teach to children, We teach boys and girls to be competitive in different areas and on different levels. I do think this is changing on a societal level, but it is also a slow change, because it is a generational change, you only see the effects with the new generation because once those tendencies have been taught it is very hard to change them.

but like i said, take everything with a grain of salt, sometimes i've been known to spout crazy. =)