As far as so called "extreme-feminists", I don't really engage with anyone who exhibits the generally attributed behaviours but are there really people that think that others need permission to talk to them? That's goofy.

I'll talk to anyone, men, women, children, old people, plants, animals, hell....I'll even make faces at babies and toddlers. What kind of person (other than those who haven't had their morning coffee) gets offended by someone talking to them?

Starts at 0:59

Because if you don't say anything back to the person talking to you, your at risk at having your head cut off...

Ps after seeing the rest of the video I would like to say I don't support all of it, if anything at all. Just was pointing out that we need permission to say hello too these women.

Thanks for that. While I can see where it might be uncomfortable for a woman to have to deal with this crap (street catcalling) and I certainly don't engage in it, I don't think there is a basis for 'permission' either way.

I live in a very big city. Beggars constantly hound me for money. Do I like it? No. Do I engage them? No. I do what everyone else does. I put in my headphones and walk on by.

As far as threats of physical violence, again, it sucks but the answer is not creating some silly social construct that says you need some form of approval before speaking to a woman lest she be concerned for her safety. To my mind that's some patriarchal silliness.

Anyway, everyone is starting to think I am a a-hole when I am actually a really nice guy so I, too, will check out....

Have I mention this already?

Because this bull video is a perfect example for it. It essence of internet retardness and anyone who actually likes that bull deserves some of the anger and ignorance he gets out of it. We take some stupid claims, we add stupid claims against it, and than let this **** go viral, because both sides can happy share this **** to pat themselves their shoulders. ******* assholes.

Edit:

And on top if it you Black Knight Leader ruined the happy ending of this thread with positing this ridiculous bull youtube video.

My wife and daughter play but only with phones off blinds closed and contract signed that I don't tell anyone they have ever played.

Ooops....

Edit:

And on top if it you Black Knight Leader ruined the happy ending of this thread with positing this ridiculous bull youtube video.

Good?

why does every thread on this devolve into an opinion slinging battle? Don't you freedom guys have much better things to do than try to push your "opinions" onto others?

I'm not saying it's any better in the East where everything is suppressed, but at least we don't have to deal with nutjobs trying to tell you their way of life and their opinion is much better than yours.

But what concerned me was the noticeable absence... and it being at odds with how we consider ourselves as better than other gaming communities.

Tabletop gaming as a whole is pretty well known as a, um, bad place to not be a straight white male. I have a vague sense that X-Wing might be a better community than most tabletop communities, but I could be mistaken.

Even if we are better than most, I think it's entirely plausible that women would be unwilling to risk the bad behavior they have experienced from other communities to give us a try.

One of the reasons this topic is a great one to constantly have on the front page of the main site is that it helps us internally police the bad behavior. And it lets newcomes know that this is a community that will shout down bad behavior. That knowledge makes the bad behavior less likely to happen in the first place.

I have found X-Wing to be one of the more accessible and welcoming of games I've played. Our local scene for X-Wing is almost half women and we have make sure everyone is welcome and accepting. Both my little sisters, one in middle school and one in high school, have started to play as well. The community is as strong and as accepting as you wish to make it, and I wouldn't feel comfortable having my little sisters play in my LGS if it wasn't a combined effort for everyone these to set standards.

I have a hard time believing this is real, to be honest. Is the point here to believe this happens behind the scenes and I've just never seen/heard about it at all for the last 20 years or so of gaming? There are lots of reasons why it's been primarily a male dominated industry, for the same reasons video games still are.

The fact that this is so common is exactly why the games industry is male dominated. Women don't want to put up with the things the author is describing, and so leave the industry.

I know a _lot_ of lady nerds, and _all_ of them have stories.

There have been several threads like this, and as Sithborg says, they don't end well.

It's a shame: it's a conversation that needs to be had, but knees jerk and tempers flare and now everyone's yelling and nothing's getting accomplished. I think it's a conversation better had in person, where people aren't pseudonymous and tend to be more closely bound by social norms about swearing, flipping tables, etc.

They don't end well, because the people who are being asked to change their behavior don't want to. I'm hopeful we see one of these threads every month until dude nerds learn to share our toys.

No woman is unsafe in the stores I go to. She might hear someone say something stupid, but if I hear them, I'd stop them.

Being the sort of person who stops stuff is _very_ good. A lot of the time what happens is someone says something, no one reacts to it (or the dudes nearby react positively to it!), and the person who said it is emboldened to escalate it. Or, if not them, someone who heard it.

A lot of the reason people don't feel safe is because someone says something dumb and isn't called out, and the person the dumb thing was directed at has seen those dumb things escalate into a physical issue.

So they flee. And now the community is -1 potentially cool player, but +1 jerk.

There have been several threads like this, and as Sithborg says, they don't end well.

It's a shame: it's a conversation that needs to be had, but knees jerk and tempers flare and now everyone's yelling and nothing's getting accomplished. I think it's a conversation better had in person, where people aren't pseudonymous and tend to be more closely bound by social norms about swearing, flipping tables, etc.

They don't end well, because the people who are being asked to change their behavior don't want to. I'm hopeful we see one of these threads every month until dude nerds learn to share our toys.

And I hope there will always be posters to call out the bull like "White male terrorism!" in those threads.

There have been several threads like this, and as Sithborg says, they don't end well.

It's a shame: it's a conversation that needs to be had, but knees jerk and tempers flare and now everyone's yelling and nothing's getting accomplished. I think it's a conversation better had in person, where people aren't pseudonymous and tend to be more closely bound by social norms about swearing, flipping tables, etc.

They don't end well, because the people who are being asked to change their behavior don't want to. I'm hopeful we see one of these threads every month until dude nerds learn to share our toys.

Right. According to you gamers who haven't seen a systemic problem are just in denial of it, and are part of the problem? What behavior is it you want to see corrected, when many posters report this is news to them? At best I can assume you actually are part of the problem, and feel better about yourself by assuming everyone else is as well. Just because you rubbed your genitalia on a woman when no one was looking, and you and I both share a common hobby, does not make me like you nor share in the guilt for your despicable behavior. There is some seriously strange reasoning going on this thread, where a group of posters like yourself assume everyone who plays games is a pervert. It's not true, and it doesn't do the hobby, women, or the men any favors by preaching a false narrative that if a girl walks into a gaming club some dude is going to try to **** her in the comic section.

If that is actually your experience, then I feel sorry for whatever amoral place you live and play in, because it's not normal.

Have not read the last 29 pages but has anyone pointed out that the reason there are few women playing this game is because, as my wife would say, its just a sill game with plastic things and dice and its not that intresting?

Have not read the last 29 pages but has anyone pointed out that the reason there are few women playing this game is because, as my wife would say, its just a sill game with plastic things and dice and its not that intresting?

Women love games, this just might not be one of them because of the style of game play. I believe this more than their being white male terrorists trying to **** and kill girl gamers, if they don't get a response from them after saying hi.

That and I have noticed guys here try to over complicate how to get women to play this game, I wouldn't be surprised if that aspect makes them uncomfortable. Just talk to them like a gamer and ask them to play the game.

It might be more an aspect of video-game culture that gets associated with the tabletop thing rightly or wrongly, but when women see that they can be subjected to violence, or the threat of violence in certain environments, the term terrorism doesn't sound that far-fetched. More than that, if people, regardless of their politics, can come together in support of someone who's been repeatedly subjected to assault while just trying to do something she finds fun, we have a much bigger problem than defining fly casual and cheating bull I've been running into.

If women don't play X-Wing, why is that a problem? Why does the gender of my opponent matter?

If we are doing things which make potential players not want to play, that matters. If we are doing it in such a way that it leaves us with more jerks, that's the same problem, multipled.

SJWs literally make everything miserable...

is there a tldr on this whole thing? or a link or something?

its not that i`m not interested in whatever the topic is...i just cant figure out WHAT the topic is. it`s very noisy in here.

From what I've observed at my store I don't see any real issue between the male and female gamers, but I do see a preference for certain games. D&D is almost split 50:50, Magic is around 2:10, Card & Boardgames around 1:10. Then out of the 25 or so X-wing/Armada/WH40k gamers there's 1 woman who plays 40K, and occasionally a 10-12 year old girl who comes with her dad to play in our X-wing tournaments.

Out of my circle of gamer friends all the girls only play D&D (or video games like Elder Scrolls & Zelda), except for one who use to play 40K years ago.

I have the impression that the majority of women tend to prefer games that focus on characters, stories, and imagination over straight up combat.

Well, I made through the almost 30 pages of this thread. And my opinoin hasn't changed much since reading the original tumblr post.

What happened to her was terrible. Nothing like that should ever happen to anyone.

However.... when she goes on her sexists, misandrist, racist crusade against all white males I almost stop caring.

I have never have nor would ever said or done those sorts of things in the shops and places I play. I have never seen or heard of those sorts of things happening in the shops and places I played. If I saw those sorts of things happening where I was, I would definitely stop them by whatever means necessary.

But hey, according to her none of that matters because I'm a white male and am just as guilty of things occurring OUTSIDE of my presence that I have NO control over simply because of how I was born.

Guess again.

THAT is what really pisses me off and makes me stop caring.

Talk bad about any group because of the actions of an individual and you're a terrible person (which is what I really feel). Unless that group is white males. For some reason some think that's OK. Some jump at the chance to be bigoted racist claiming to try and fight racism and bigotry.

F that.

Well, I made through the almost 30 pages of this thread. And my opinoin hasn't changed much since reading the original tumblr post.

What happened to her was terrible. Nothing like that should ever happen to anyone.

However.... when she goes on her sexists, misandrist, racist crusade against all white males I almost stop caring.

I have never have nor would ever said or done those sorts of things in the shops and places I play. I have never seen or heard of those sorts of things happening in the shops and places I played. If I saw those sorts of things happening where I was, I would definitely stop them by whatever means necessary.

But hey, according to her none of that matters because I'm a white male and am just as guilty of things occurring OUTSIDE of my presence that I have NO control over simply because of how I was born.

Guess again.

THAT is what really pisses me off and makes me stop caring.

Talk bad about any group because of the actions of an individual and you're a terrible person (which is what I really feel). Unless that group is white males. For some reason some think that's OK. Some jump at the chance to be bigoted racist claiming to try and fight racism and bigotry.

F that.

Really wish I could like this post twice. Thrice, even.

I'm an archaeologist not a rocket scientist, but I reckon that instead of a bunch of mostly middle-aged male gamers discussing **** that they really know very little about, they should maybe do the obvious.

Ask women why they don't game.

Find out and then address the issue.

Cheers

Baaa

And when a woman writes an article about it, we should read it, believe it, and teach the creepers not to be bad people

I know one lady who played Netrunner where I used to live. She stopped going because people made it weird. I taught people at a summer program I worked at X-wing. Two women really liked it because one was a big Star Wars fan. Another because she liked the tactics and spaceships. Perhaps the biggest Star Wars fan I know also plays FFG stuff, but only at home or with friends because she's had too many weird experiences at game stores. So even if there is some inherent gender bias towards certain games, there still people who would be interested in playing but for the unpleasantness of the social scene.

Sexual harassment in the gaming community is a huge deal and the fact that some assholes get so up in arms just from people trying to talk about it only proves how big an issue it is.

For the record I've tried to get girls into it but it hasn't interested them. I've done my part, have you OP?

Quick question though: why aren't more guys into scrap booking? Are you into scrap booking? If not, why do you perpetuate the sexist stereotypes of arts and crafts?

As for harsh reactions...What do you expect? People also don't like the implicit "you are guilty by default" stuff. You come making that charge, then wonder why you get a negative reaction? Especially with the condescension doing from sine of the supporting comments? Really?

I hate these threads because they seem to exist solely so people can do some moral preening about how they care so much more than you, and by the way you should stop what you are doing and reflect on your life and the bad things you or someone like you has done, entirely at the discretion of some internet stranger. That some other guy will show up in a month saying the same thing is irrelevant, we should confine wag our beards as though these are deep ponderings.

But haven't you heard you can't be racist or sexist against straight white men.

Yes, us poor, downtrodden white men who have CONTROLLED THE WORLD FOR A THOUSAND YEARS.

Thanks for showing your opinions mean less than nothing.

Discrimination in any form is still discrimination. But I guess according to people like you, it's alright if it's happening to straight white men.

You make me sick. And I pray to God that you have no influence over the next generation to breed your willfully ignorant and hateful views.

Sexual harassment in the gaming community is a huge deal and the fact that some assholes get so up in arms just from people trying to talk about it only proves how big an issue it is.

Ah the insufficiently supportive of the revolution charge. Good one.

For the record I've tried to get girls into it but it hasn't interested them. I've done my part, have you OP?

Quick question though: why aren't more guys into scrap booking? Are you into scrap booking? If not, why do you perpetuate the sexist stereotypes of arts and crafts?

As for harsh reactions...What do you expect? People also don't like the implicit "you are guilty by default" stuff. You come making that charge, then wonder why you get a negative reaction? Especially with the condescension doing from sine of the supporting comments? Really?

I hate these threads because they seem to exist solely so people can do some moral preening about how they care so much more than you, and by the way you should stop what you are doing and reflect on your life and the bad things you or someone like you has done, entirely at the discretion of some internet stranger. That some other guy will show up in a month saying the same thing is irrelevant, we should confine wag our beards as though these are deep ponderings.

So if we were to accept that scrapbooking's on one pole and X-wing's on another, what do you believe makes it such that women don't like it and men do?