I'd say that picking up something within reach should be a half-action in a non-melee combat situation. In a melee combat situation I'd make the person attempting to pick up the object make an Agility (or Dodge or Acrobatics) test or incur an attack of opportunity. After the item is in hand then it'd have to be readied as normal. Or, if a character has Acrobatics, let them make a test against Acrobatics to see if they can pick up the item as a free action. Modifiers could be used depending on the situation and severity of battle. Perhaps when engaged in a melee battle with a particularly rough opponent you'd have to make a Willpower check to see if you'd even be able to go for something on the ground.

I'd say do what ever would make the combat more exciting and fun.

Yui 56 said:

This is pretty close to what my most recent post proposed, except that I suggest making it an Opposed Test so that a skilled opponent has a better chance of thwarting your attempt.

Yui 56 said:

That's what everyone should go for.

However, if we're discussing the RAW, you'd have to adhere to what's written in the book and not having your interpretation deviate too much from those rules. If you adhere to the RAW, then picking an object up from the ground would be the equivalent of a "Ready" action. That's what I've argued in this thread, because the OP didn't originally ask for house rules, he/she asked in the "Rules Questions" section of the messageboard. And in here it's more about the rules as written rather than house rules.

But in any case, regardless where the rules as written might be lacking, everyone shold do what you said. Implement whatever changes makes the combat more exciting and fun.

Personally, I find combat to be more exciting and fun when it's not bogged down by an large amount of dice rolling. Hence why im more inclined to go with the interpretation closest to the RAW, rather than rolling a bunch of extra dice just to see if a character can actually attempt a standard ready action or not. But that's not why I argued here, I just wanted to provide the interpretation sticking closest to the RAW, because that's what im assuming the OP asked for in the first place.

If one is looking for house rules, there's an excellent house rules section here on the Rogue Trader messageboards.

I was always under the assumption that the 'Ready' action was done to an item actually on your character's person. But the RAW does leave it open for that sort of interpretation. Since the book (RT pg 242) says Ready is "The active character draws a weapon or retrieves an object from a pouch or a pocket." I assumed the floor would not be that sort of instance. Now if the item was on a shelf right next to the person or on a desk or something it might be able to be considered a 'Ready' action.

I also assumed since you were giving examples of how such an action could be done IRL that you were deviating from the RAW somewhat. Truth. My interpretations could be considered 'house' rules. But I think something like Acrobatics (RT pg 77) would fit for picking up an object while engaged in melee. Since picking something up from the ground isn't specifically covered in the RAW it is very open to different interpretations... Thus, that is why I only made suggestions.

Seeing you two go at each other makes me .

HappyDaze said:

That would work also. Though I'd be careful as to what Varnias said as to not get bogged down in a bunch of dice rolls.

But as far as trying to go just by the RAW and not adding anything else. I'd say that picking up an item would be a half-action and readying it would be considered another half-action (unless, of course, they have Quick Draw). Of course we could make the situation more sticky and say, "What if the item in question is a heavy weapon?" It could even take a full action if it was awkward enough... But I digress. The rest I'd leave up to GM interpretation.

Yui 56 said:

Well, if I am to be honest, I think for certain weapons a half-action is way too long. If I am to throw the RAW out the window, I'd actually suggest that drawing pistol and basic sized weapons as well as swords in scabbards should be a free action rather than a half action. (if one combat round is roughly 4 seconds, then a half-action takes up to 2 seconds. You don't need too much practice to draw a pistol or knife or grip a rifle hanging from the shoulder on a strap in well under one second)

Half actions for readying a weapon should be reserved for the really big and cumbersome hardware like two handed melee weapons who can only be hanged across the back (eviscerators, great weapons etc.), or weapons of heavy class (like autocannons and heavy stubbers).

But the thing is, If I did that the Quick Draw talent would be nerfed to death. What would be the point of taking it if it only really does anything when you're armed with two handed melee weapons and heavy weapons?

So my reasoning here is that if you can ready a huge assault cannon just as fast as you can ready a pistol hanging in a holster from your waist without suffering penalties (even if you are in melee combat), then it should take roughly as long to pick up a weapon from the ground and ready it in the same amount of time.

I understand what you're saying. And I agree. But a round (according to the book) is about 5 seconds maximum(RT pg 234) and this is for no matter how many participants; assuming less time for something like just two people fighting (unless they're fighting in slow-mo ). So a character's turn could be anywhere from a half second to three-quarters of a second long respectively (given 6-10 participants). So the characters are already moving blindingly fast anyway (faster than I could move even on my best day ). Heavy weapons and two-handed melee weapons do not gain the benefits of the Quick Draw talent (RT pg 105). So in a small way its taken into account. But even so. I agree with you. A big 'ole bulky assed flame-thrower should take longer to ready. But either way, without all the bells and whistles, I believe that picking something up is considered a half-action and then readying the item would be another half-action(w/o Quick Draw). Because in game time that whole turn would take only about a half to three-quarters of a second (.25-.375 seconds to ****** the item, .25-.375 seconds to get it ready). That's pretty fast if you ask me.

Yui 56 said:

The turns aren't "shorter" because of more combatants, all turns are as long as the combat round, it's just that all actions resolves near simultaneously with only split second differences between them.

So every combatant has 5 seconds each turn, it's just that their actions resolve more or less at the same time and it's only their skill rolls and eventual faliures and successes that determines who is faster/fast enough over his or her opponent.

So it's not happening in slow-mo where bullets conventiently wait in mid air for people to dodge them. It's rather the people dodging whose successful skill rolls actually let them react before the shooters have managed to fire their shots and leap out of the way in time to not get hit.

The reason why a round is divided in turns based on initiative is simply for administrative purposes. All combat rounds are still going to be 4-5 seconds in length, and all combatants have that time to act and react. The difference in order between their actions is a matter of milliseconds if not microseconds in length.

Varnias Tybalt said:

Doh! Upon rereading the time thing (RT pg 234) you're right . I guess that makes more sense then a bunch of people moving like the Flash. But either way, I still believe that picking something up would be considered a half-action and readying it would be another half-action. The only reason I'd say this is because of the description of the 'Ready' action (RT pg 242). Since the item in question is not on your person it could not be readied (in a pouch or sheeth or holster or whatnot). The description of 'Ready' even goes so far as to talk about dropping an item, but nothing about picking it up. For that reason I'd say that picking something up would be a seperate action than Readying it.

So I guess my philosophy (if that's a good term for it ) is that if the action doesn't specifically say that something is allowed (IE picking something up from the ground) then its not implied and considered a different action. It may not be perfect, but IMO it keeps players from lawyering or reading more into certain actions and skills than is there.

Edit: The exception to this philosophy would be skill or characteristic tests since their success isn't automatically assured and failure could mean bad reprocussions. IE Testing Acrobatics to see if you can pick up and ready an item as a free action. If you fail you use a half-action and find yourself prone or something.

Yui 56 said:

It does, doesn't it?

Yui 56 said:

Just as a suggestion, if we wanted to involve talents in the matter. A character with the Leap Up talent should be able to pick up a weapon from the floor and ready it in just a half-action. Seems only fair that if you're agile and swift enough to actually get on your feet from even a PRONE position, you could scoop something up from the ground as a free action as well.

Varnias Tybalt said:

That's awesome! Its funny you mentioned that because I saw that Talent and thought immediately of this. So someone with Leap Up and Quick Draw would probably get to pick up a weapon and ready it as a free action. Speaking as a Tech-Priest/Explorator loving person... Agile people suck. Just use Ferric Lure like a normal person.

Yui 56 said:

So

Leap Up + Quick Draw = free action to ready weapons lying on the ground.

Leap Up = free action to pick weapon up, but half-action to ready it (as normal)

Quick Draw = half action to pick weapon up, but consider the weapon readied as free action.

This solution should make everybody happy.

My personal comments on tech-priest:

I never have to pick up a weapon from the ground. With all the gun mechadendrites and bolters with fore-arm weapon mod, mounted on a powerfist usually insures that he's always armed.