One of the things that WFRP3E players like about the dice system is the ability to gain a lot of info out of the die roll. I think this is entirely doable with a percentile system and posted this solution on a WFRP3E thread. Basically, any double rolled on the percentile dice cause an additional effect.

Double 0 = Chaos Star. A serious negative side effect or Critical Failure. Examples: Misfires, dropping or breaking items, causing a person to become your enemy, etc.

Double 1 = Comet. A serious positive side effect or Critical Success. Examples: Scoring a Critical Hit without depleting the target's wounds below 0, hitting two people with the same attack, scoring +2 degrees of success, etc.

Double # that is less than or equal to your Check Digit (example: a 1-3 for a person with a 39) = Boon +1 DOS (which can cancel out a DOF), cancel out a Bane, or similar good effect.

Double # that exceeds your check digit = Bane 1 DOF (which can cancel out a DOS), Time required is doubled, Action causes an extra point of Fatigue, or similar bad effect.

I should point out that when I talk Check Digit, I'm referring to the unmodified Character Attribute, without modifiers. So a person with a Attribute at 39%, with a check digit of 3 who rolls with a +30 modifier will succeed on a 66, but acquire a Bane in the process...

DoS and DoF are already accounted for in the roll.

2d10 that come up as 0 and 0 = 100 which means you have failed to the point of the Emperor abandoning you to your fate at that point in time.

2d10 that come up 1 and 1 = 11 and means you missed an extra DoS that you could have possibly had if you had rolled a 01.

I don't mean to be snippy, but unless I am playing with the HERO system, I don't want to be rolling handfuls of dice or adding more complicated mechanics to my dice roll. I haven't played WFRP3E but what I have read of it makes me think it is set up as an entry point for card game and MMO players to get into a Pen & Paper RPG. For experienced Pen & Paper people that kind of mechanic takes the creativity and imagination of both player and GM, guts them and hands it over to a bunch of dice to dictate the story. I don't like everything being controlled, hence my and many others loathing of DnD4E.

Depth should come from the Player and GM interaction not from a die roll, but if that makes you happy go for it.

There are already rules for different levels of success and failure. For example, medicae has both when on extended care:

- Each DOS, the patient heals faster for each DOS.

- Simple fail - heals at normal rate.

- 2/3 DFF, patient takes 1 damage. That will hurt a bit, but will only kill those out of wounds.

- 4+DOS - 1d10 damage with no reduction from armour/TB and sudden death. Very nasty.

I'm also playing a game where each test is rolling a variable number of d10s. Each d10 that is 7+ counts as a success, if there are no success then each 1 rolled counts as a botch.

The difference between the OPs method and the above examples is that in my examples you can reduce your chance of failing badly by increasing your ability in that area*. But for the OPs suggestion:

- double 0: 1% chance for something really bad to happen, regardless of skill or situational modifiers.

- double 1: 1% chance for something good to happen, regardless of skill/modifiers. But what's worse is that this is a roll of 11, meaning that even if the test modifiers say that the target number is 10 or less 11 still counts as a pass. For example, lets say that a character has a BS of 35 and is shooting a target at extreme range (-30). Under the ops suggest they will hit if they roll 5 or below, or if they roll 11.

- double # with check digit. 8% chance for one of these to happen. To get half of them being boons, you need your characteristic to be 50-59. So most players will be looking at more than 4% of their rolls triggering a bane. Include the double 0 effect and at least 1 in every 20 rolls will go badly.

If you want to make other effects happen within a percentile system, I suggest you base them of how far away the roll was from the pass/fail value.

*Except weapon jams. But they are a property of the weapon, not the person using it. And even they can be reduced/eliminated by getting a better gun.

Luther.... you have essentially just posted up the Unknown Armies dice roll stuff there. Dunno if that was by accident or on purpose, but just telling you it's been done before and works well.

Never played UA, but I hear it was pretty cool. Great minds and all that.

As for the other posts, I think you're missing thrust of the thread. I like RT just fine as it is, but someone posed an interesting questionon another board asking how you can get the same sort of results you receive from rolling the WFRP3E dice in a percentile system like RT. So I basically gave a way to get those specific dice results, banes, boons, delays and the like, from a D100 roll. As for the 'discrepencies' like gaining a boon even if you fail a roll with an 11, that is part and parcel of the system I'm trying to emulate, in which something beneficial might happen even if you fail your roll and vice versa.

Now, obviously, these results will show up a lot less often then they do on a WFRP roll, and the more specific results like Delay and Fatigue have to be determined by the GM. It does seem faster to read then the WFRP dice version in my mind, cause there's only two dice to read. In the end, though, it's just a thought experiment and an option for those who want it...

OK, here are some examples of the 'Deep Percentile' die roll in action...

Ex1: Rogue Trader Xanatov swings his power sword at an alien menace. He has a 45 WS, with a Check Digit of 4. He has a +10 modifier from outnumbering the alien with the help of a crew member. He rolls a 55, which succeeds, but exceeds his Check Digit, gaining him a Bane. The GM determines that his hit strikes home, but he has overextended his lunge in the process and gains a point of Fatigue as a result.

Ex2: Xanatov is firing his plasma pistol at an alien menace. He has a 41 BS. The alien is in cover, giving him a -10% to hit. He scores a 33. The shot misses, but as 3 is below his check digit, he gains a Boon. The GM decides to force the alien to make a pinning test.

Ex3: Xanatov is chatting up the wife of the Planetary Governor in order to gain her interest and hopefully some info on the Governor's plans. He has a Fellowship of 57 and rolls a 44, gaining a Boon. The GM determines that he not only succeeds in his seduction attempt, but that any later roll used during 'pillow talk' to get important info will receive a +1 Degree of Success.

Ex.4: Xanatov is trying to strong arm the Governor with information on his disreputable deals. His Fel of 57 has a +20 bonus due to the nature of the info gained. Xanatov rolls a 66. This succeeds but is higher than his Check Digit, resulting in a Bane. The GM decides that word has gotten back to the Governor about Xanatov's trist with his wife (through a loose lipped servant, hidden cameras or the like) and his anger is overriding his sense of self-preservation cancelling out one Degree of Success from Xanatov's roll. As he had no DOS from the roll, this turns the roll into a failure and the Governor refuses Xanatov, who now has a powerful enemy.

Ex.5: Xanatov is trying to escape the wrath of the Governor in his guncutter, but someone has sabotaged the controls. The Explorator is trying to repair them and succeeds, but gains a Baine in the process. The GM determines that the repair is made, but the sabotage was so expertly and extensively done that it took longer than usual and allowed the Governor's forces the time they need to catch up with the Rogue Trader and his cohorts. This means that the Guncutter will have to fight its way back to the Rogue Trader's ship.

Now, the most obvious difference between the 'Deep Percentile' system and the WFRP3E dice system is that these Banes & Boons show up much less frequently. I think this is fine for me, because I would like my special effects to remain just that: special.

For those who want to see effects with more frequency, similar to that found in WFRP3E, than I suggest that instead of only checking the Check Digit on doubles, you check it on every roll, using both dice. So if you get a 36 when you have a 47 stat, then you get a Boon for the 3 and a Bane for the 6, which cancel each other out. This will give you a higher probability of Boons or Banes and also allow for Double Boons or Banes. And Lord help the poor PC who rolls a 00...

Luther said:

It really is, and has probably the most simple and best percentile system out there. In fact, it'd probably work perfectly for DH/RT.

I'd strongly suggest getting hold of it if possible. Some places still sell it.

MILLANDSON said:

I would strongly second Mil's opinion here: excellent game with one heck of a beautifully simple system. Half of me has long wanted to adapt DH just so I could use it's combat system which has to be the fastest and most tense one I've ever played. I never had a combat situation in UA that lasted more then three minutes of real time without there being a substantial amount of dead/bleeding/screaming/panicked combatants littering the scene -well except for a running gunfight that occurred once while the PC's were trying to steal the Mystic Torso (a mute, blind, def, quadruple amputee who was worshiped as an avatar of Venus) from a cult of a plastic surgeons and a rival pack of mercenary Elvis impersonators that were hired by the ultimate film nerds of the Celluloid Temple (they wanted to use the alleged Mystic Torso of Venus to reconstruct Marilyn Monroe).

The "Deep Percentile System" seems interesting, though, to be honest, the DoS and DoF mechanic mostly covers it, at least the way i run tings. A success with no DoS or a failure with no DoF tends to be a success with not so nice consequences or a failure with pleasant side effects. Though this is usually outside of combat, this thread has made me start thinking that i should count the 0 DoF and DoS rolls inside of combat similarly with effects similar to the overlap's you listed. It just might speed combat up a bit by getting more things to happen more times.

Thanks for the idea!

Graver said:

Well, the idea behind DP is that it takes the DOS/DOF and adds to it, so if you get a degree of success on a really easy roll, but only barely, there can be a delay, an opportunity for an enemy, an over extension of yourself, etc. or something else that affects the situation beyond how well you did.

And that's the main point, not to fiddle with DOS/DOF, which would be represented in WFRP3E by Hammers and Crossed Swords, but to add story elements like the Hourglass, Blood Drop, Eagle and Skull symbols, which you can't easily do with two dice marked 0-9. A secondary point is to do all this with a glance, not through math...