I don't think the ruling would apply to a Hera crewed ship. The whole point of the rule is revealing a red maneuver when it's illegal (because you can't perform reds while stressed). Hera crewed ships have never been subject to the "red maneuver while stressed" rules, so this wouldn't be any different

1 hour ago, VanderLegion said:

I don't think the ruling would apply to a Hera crewed ship. The whole point of the rule is revealing a red maneuver when it's illegal (because you can't perform reds while stressed). Hera crewed ships have never been subject to the "red maneuver while stressed" rules, so this wouldn't be any different

I agree. But unfortunately the wording of the FAQ doesn't cover the fact that a stressed ship may be able to perform a red maneuver, it just describes what happens when a stressed ship REVEALS its dial.

Most likely an oversight but it still needs clarification.

1 hour ago, irishthump said:

Thanks for that!

It still basically nullifies my list. I was running a U wing with Hera , Advanced Sensors , Push the Limit , Inspiring Recruit + Engine Upgrade .

Perform an action before revealing dial, Target Lock + Focus and take a stress.

Reveal Stop maneuver and flip around behind my opponent.

Clear double stress next turn.

Ah well, it was fun while I lasted!

You really shouldn't try and create a list around a technical loophole in the rules, because eventually, that loophole is likely to get closed.

3 minutes ago, Parravon said:

You really shouldn't try and create a list around a technical loophole in the rules, because eventually, that loophole is likely to get closed.

It wasn't created around a loophole. It was created around what the upgrade cards allowed when RAW. The FAQ was intended to close the loophole that allowed the U Wing to reveal a red maneuver while stressed, do 180, then perform a white 2 forward as a "penalty" for revealing the dead stop when stressed.

This doesnt occur when Hera crew is equipped.

14 minutes ago, irishthump said:

It wasn't created around a loophole. It was created around what the upgrade cards allowed when RAW. The FAQ was intended to close the loophole that allowed the U Wing to reveal a red maneuver while stressed, do 180, then perform a white 2 forward as a "penalty" for revealing the dead stop when stressed.

This doesnt occur when Hera crew is equipped.

That's the loophole I meant. It may have been within RAW, but it is now clearly not what was intended, and the FAQ has now confirmed that. This is one of those things that the design team come up with but seem to overlook during playtesting. It's only when the wider player base try something that's normally against the spirit of the rules (but still within RAW), that the issue comes to light.

The designers probably didn't encounter this particular loophole because they were probably thinking you can't dial in a red while you are stressed , so they probably didn't do that. They probably need to run a few more " what-if " scenarios during playtesting, but I suspect they were more focused on how the U-wing played under normal playing conditions, and how the various pilots interacted with it.

I would think Hera trumps this ruling...or basically Hera is a voided card.

13 hours ago, Parravon said:

That's the loophole I meant. It may have been within RAW, but it is now clearly not what was intended, and the FAQ has now confirmed that. This is one of those things that the design team come up with but seem to overlook during playtesting. It's only when the wider player base try something that's normally against the spirit of the rules (but still within RAW), that the issue comes to light.

The designers probably didn't encounter this particular loophole because they were probably thinking you can't dial in a red while you are stressed , so they probably didn't do that. They probably need to run a few more " what-if " scenarios during playtesting, but I suspect they were more focused on how the U-wing played under normal playing conditions, and how the various pilots interacted with it.

I think you a slightly skewed view of what a rules loophole is!

By your definition Tycho using Rage turn after turn is a loophole. Or Nien Numb with PTL, Pattern Analyzer, Targetting Astromech and Vectored Thrusters. Or QuickDraw with Rage and Electronic Baffle.

And don't try to tell me the designers weren't aware that the U Wing would be able to use Hera to execute red moves while stressed. The Hera crew card has been used to allow the VCX to K Turn ad nauseum since the ship came out!

On 3/11/2017 at 11:11 AM, irishthump said:

I agree. But unfortunately the wording of the FAQ doesn't cover the fact that a stressed ship may be able to perform a red maneuver, it just describes what happens when a stressed ship REVEALS its dial.

Most likely an oversight but it still needs clarification.

The FAQ for red maneuvers has ALWAYS been written as if Hera crew doesn't work. The old version of the FAQ was written the same way, it disnt have any exceptions for ship that were allowed to do so. If you ignored the old version and still did your red maneuver while stressed with Hera, you can ignore the new one just as easily

2 hours ago, VanderLegion said:

The FAQ for red maneuvers has ALWAYS been written as if Hera crew doesn't work. The old version of the FAQ was written the same way, it disnt have any exceptions for ship that were allowed to do so. If you ignored the old version and still did your red maneuver while stressed with Hera, you can ignore the new one just as easily

Thanks for that. But Frank's reply would seem to confirm that a U Wing with Hera Crew can not use the title card to 180 after if performs the red maneuver.

42 minutes ago, irishthump said:

Thanks for that. But Frank's reply would seem to confirm that a U Wing with Hera Crew can not use the title card to 180 after if performs the red maneuver.

No it doesn't. The new FAQ clarification ONLY applies to ships that can't do a red maneuver while stressed. The "can only resolve abilities that change the difficulty of the maneuver" is a part of the overall "performing a red maneuver while stressed" for ships that can't do so. It's part of the same section that ends with doing a 2-white straight. If you're arguing you can't resolve pivot wing with Hera, then the rest of the rule would ALSO have to apply, and you'd have to also do the 2s white maneuver, and hera would be a waste of points becasue she wouldn't do anything. It's all or nothing. Either none of the section applies to a hera-crewed ship, or all of it does.

(And either way, pivot wing is before performing th emaneuver, not after)

Feedback array while cloaked. don't think this one is in yet.

Does anyone have the address to send questions?

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/contact/rules/

Hello,