Hi all

How often do people use destiny points in their games?

As a player and as a GM, I feel that they should be reserved for significant moments in the game, but then all too often they don't have that much of an effect, and they seem wasted. A guy I play with uses them almost every roll, if he can, just to give him the edge, which to me feels against the spirit of the game but does make them more useful.

For players, how do you like to use destiny points? How do they tend to flow in your games?

For GMs, how often do you use destiny points in a session? Do you plan when they're going to be used, or do you do so on the fly?

Thanks in advance.

We had about half a dozen sessions thus far, first time with FFG SW, so we're still getting used to destiny points.

Thus far, we only really used them for narrative purposes and the "Deus Ex Machina"

For example, in the first session we were heading to a landing platform to steal their starter ship from a Vigo.

As we exited the lift I flipped a point to have the ship completely checked up and take off ready.

A small fire-fight with the landing pad crew later, and we're out of orbit.

I have since taken over as GM due to time contraints of our previous one.

Personally I like the story-telling use of DPs better, but I wouldn't mind the PCs using them for Upgrades (or talent activation where applicable), but I'm not sure right now if they remember that they can even do that.

It's been a while since we were able to play..

Overall though, I would say that DPs are a little underused at our table right now.

As a player, I use them whenever I need to shift the odds in my favour. Or when I want to use a Force ability and roll black pips. Or when I want to activate a talent that has a DP cost.

So as a player, I use them a lot.

As a GM, I use them whenever the situation can result in an interesting complication. Which can be almost ANY meaningful roll. Or when the players have used the majority of the pool and I need to "push the destiny pool" back towards them.

So I use them a lot.

They aren't as super powerful as other games treat special point. In my experience, they work best when being flipped back and forth in a consistent basis. With neither side hording.

They get used constantly in the games I play in, with the players in my FaD game being quite free with spending them to upgrade skill checks or introduce facts, mostly of the "hey, we've got adventure useful item X with us!" variety.

Myself as a player, I tend to be a bit more sparing in spending Destiny Points unless I think it's really worth it, but part of that is not wanting to deny the other players a chance to "be cool," especially if we're running low.

Now as a GM, I tend to be a bit more hesitant to spend them than I should, either to upgrade my NPCs' checks or upgrade the PCs' difficulties to affect them, mostly as half my group seems to be plagued with downright awful dice luck more often than not; I've seen them bomb out on checks with an Easy or Average difficulty, having no successes but more advantage than they know what to do with.

Liberally. As a PC in our group it's a couple of times per encounter, GMing I can almost flip one a round. The faster they are spent the more you get out of them. It's only a problem when one side or the other doesn't buy into the agreement and starts holding on to them. We almost never let it be a pool of one colour, if it's getting heavy in Dark Side I spend up big!

I'm a big fan of using them to introduce facts too; battle is a bit easy and I want reinforcements? Flip a DP. Need a grenade to do something cool, flip a DP. Need to change the environment? DP. It lets me be a mean GM without the players feeling like I'm being an a$$.

I have 5 players, and some are starting to get their Signature Abilites which require 2 to activate. I don't feel my players use them enough, or when they do they we go from 7/8 light ones to 7/8 dark ones in an instant. As the GM I always try to keep more light on the table than dark. If I notice more dark on the table and know that a big moment is coming up, then I throw in some cheesy stupid encounter with some minions. Like the PCs get mugged or something. Then I can upgrade my checks with no real consequence, and still giving the players the edge a few minutes down the road.

I did have to make a house rule. (And I hate house rules) but I told my table that if we go through an entire encounter and they don't spend any, then they all get flipped to the dark side. They were hoarding them there for awhile, and said that if they flipped, then that meant I got to flip them!!! Which is the point. So after I came up with this "house rule", "threat". Whatever you want to call it, the DP usage and has been a lot more fluid!

As GM, I use them whenever I have something I feel appropriate for a 'Despair' and upgrade the check. I rarely plan them out ahead of time for Narrative stuff, but I do use them less frequently for on the fly things (sure you loot the safe, but now you hear a self-destruct countdown beginning).

Me? All the time - as a GM, anytime I've got a good idea for a despair or that a little bit extra challenge could be interesting. As a player, I tend to really reach for the brass ring and overextend my abilities - so a bit of an edge is welcome.

The points are meant to flow back and forth freely, the Devs have said. Do not hesitate to use them.

My players use them all the time for Upgrading and sometimes for the "oh Luckily we had the Oxygenbreather on Board because we have to leave the ship on thi methan aired planet" Situations.

Me as GM, when ever I want to be an a$$ and throw in some meany little problems... like "ups your Hyperspacegenerator just broke someone should repair ist or you won´t escape those Ties..." or "hey look who´s there, your old pals the white armored sixpack of Impereal Elite"

Also in BBG fights to introduce a new phase of the battle (all my players are MMORPG verterans so they like it when a Boss battle has more than one pattern)

And of course when ever I think "man a despair would now be really cool... for the story... not for them"

As a GM, I don't use them nearly as often as I should. Part of me feels like it's indulging the "Jerk GM" aspect of the GM/Player relationship, and sort of subtly implies the "the GM want's us to fail!' knee jerk reaction many gamers have. The Us vs The GM mindset. And I don't like it.

This actually had a direct negative impact on the game though, as I wasn't flipping dark side points to light, so my players could use them, and they were in a REALLY tough scene. And the young jedi character couldn't use the dark side pips he wanted to, because there was no light side destiny point to flip. This directly lead to me house ruling away the need to flip a DP to use the dark side, and it's just going to cost an extra point of strain. Personally, I think this is more in line with the "quicker, easier, more seductive" concept of the Dark Side, but it also just makes it easier for my players to utilize that aspect of the game if they so choose.

Now as a GM, I tend to be a bit more hesitant to spend them than I should, either to upgrade my NPCs' checks or upgrade the PCs' difficulties to affect them, mostly as half my group seems to be plagued with downright awful dice luck more often than not; I've seen them bomb out on checks with an Easy or Average difficulty, having no successes but more advantage than they know what to do with.

I recently took over as GM for an F&D campaign, when the previous GM ran into work-related issues.

I haven’t been as consistent about this as I should be, but one thing I’ve found works really well is to sometimes just choose to flip over multiple DPs, without any immediate effect. SOMETHING, somewhere in the galaxy has just happened, and it’s really bad. But the players won’t find out about it right now, and maybe not any time soon.

It scares the holy living crap out of the players. And it does give me a lot of leeway to make the story go certain directions, if I think that’s best.

Meanwhile, they’ve now got more white DPs they can flip.

Outside of that, I agree that they should be spent freely and often to upgrade the difficulty of the players checks.

If a Despair can lead to something really, really bad — and maybe really funny — then that’s a great reason to do it.

So far they have been used pretty often to upgrade checks. Only a few times have players used them to change the narrative to a positive for them. I tend to mostly just use them to upgrade difficulty of rolls, but I did use one in Escape Mos Shuuta, to say Trex had a stealth field generator and activated it.

I really like the flow of it and it honestly doesn't seem to powerful while still adding a ton of flavor to the system. Often my players will ask if they can look for something, or if they can ask an NPC for something and I normally, say "you can if you flip a destiny point."

It also, makes me feel like less of a jerk-GM, because I'm not just saying, hey you guys are getting ambushed by a sniper, SURPRISE ATTACK! If I do something like that normally I will flip a DP first, so they know something is coming and they are at least getting something out of it.

I also like that I can upgrade a check of a PC which only has a 1in12 of a Despair, but they then get a DP to spend that can be used almost exactly like a triumph to change the narrative in the PC's favour.

OK, great, thanks guys. The general sense I'm getting is that I should be using them more as both a GM and a player, so I'll have to work on that. Thanks all.

It's probably a good topic of discussion at every table. Something to talk about during rest room breaks or dinner break, just a casual "Hey guys I think the game could be even more fun if we use these things more often. So try to trust me that I won't ruin your night at the first chance I get"

It's probably a good topic of discussion at every table. Something to talk about during rest room breaks or dinner break, just a casual "Hey guys I think the game could be even more fun if we use these things more often. So try to trust me that I won't ruin your night at the first chance I get"

That's the trick though, convincing some players that you're not trying to just screw them over. I mean, the 2 guys I play with, we've been playing together for over 15 years, and I've repeatedly told one of them "look, I'm not trying to kill you off! You are the star of this movie, if I kill you off in act 1, well then the movies over! and where's the fun in that?!" He knows this, but he still has the knee jerk reaction that I'm trying to torture his character, for some nefarious reason, other than just, you know, giving him challenges to face and overcome.

And the other side of it, is I try to be fair to the difficulty of the roll. To me, the dice pool I set is reasonable, yet challenging most times. To suddenly go "oh, wait I'm going to make it even harder does feel like a jerk move a lot of the time.

Plus I don't have any qualms about just assigning a red, given the severity of the situation. So in a lot of ways, the DP's are redundant to me.

I use Destiny points a lot, but thats namely because my PC is force sensitive and has at lessions, thus often during Tobin's short fights he tends to burn through them. That and it saves making a catalogue of equipment as I can usually spend them for things I would reasonably have on my person. Most players like triumphs and will spend them if a interesting narrative result is available.

Prior to the last session, our group used destiny points sparingly, if at all. Last session, though, we rolled all light side destiny points. Deciding that I couldn't just leave the GM with nothing to play with, I reminded the other players of how we could use destiny points and started using them liberally, and everyone else followed suit. It helped that we had a vehicle chase and a combat immediately after, both of which have obvious applications for triumphs or despairs.

Prior to the last session, our group used destiny points sparingly, if at all. Last session, though, we rolled all light side destiny points. Deciding that I couldn't just leave the GM with nothing to play with, I reminded the other players of how we could use destiny points and started using them liberally, and everyone else followed suit. It helped that we had a vehicle chase and a combat immediately after, both of which have obvious applications for triumphs or despairs.

I don't know, I just, feel that the Destiny Point mechanic is limiting for the GM for no real reason. I can do things how I wish, but I have to flip this token to increase the difficulty? If the players are using the resource to try and make the game better, I'm equally forced to make the game more difficult, just so they can keep trying to make things better. I don't know, I just, find it somewhat, meh.

First (beginning over two years ago) we conserverd them too much and often had none switched each session.

Now we are using them but not too much, we mostly use them for very important checks (last time is used on for a daunting coercion check to scare away of robbers that we -due to another PCs dumb fault- were going to shoot us into pieces: it was an live or die check). We had a GM that almost nver used them, so we had mostly just to use what ever light side points we got at the start. Luckily the new GM uses them.

We almost never use them to "create" an item, but try to buy stuff to be prepared.

Prior to the last session, our group used destiny points sparingly, if at all. Last session, though, we rolled all light side destiny points. Deciding that I couldn't just leave the GM with nothing to play with, I reminded the other players of how we could use destiny points and started using them liberally, and everyone else followed suit. It helped that we had a vehicle chase and a combat immediately after, both of which have obvious applications for triumphs or despairs.

I don't know, I just, feel that the Destiny Point mechanic is limiting for the GM for no real reason. I can do things how I wish, but I have to flip this token to increase the difficulty? If the players are using the resource to try and make the game better, I'm equally forced to make the game more difficult, just so they can keep trying to make things better. I don't know, I just, find it somewhat, meh.

A GM should be reasonable. The difficulty of a check should be made fair. You think its hard? 3 purple then. You think the shop owner has Pre / Negotiatioon 2-3? two red then.

The Dark side point is in my view to spice things up. Not to make things unfair, but just add some more difficulties that are also benefitting the players: They get a harder check BUT also a light side point.

Prior to the last session, our group used destiny points sparingly, if at all. Last session, though, we rolled all light side destiny points. Deciding that I couldn't just leave the GM with nothing to play with, I reminded the other players of how we could use destiny points and started using them liberally, and everyone else followed suit. It helped that we had a vehicle chase and a combat immediately after, both of which have obvious applications for triumphs or despairs.

I don't know, I just, feel that the Destiny Point mechanic is limiting for the GM for no real reason. I can do things how I wish, but I have to flip this token to increase the difficulty? If the players are using the resource to try and make the game better, I'm equally forced to make the game more difficult, just so they can keep trying to make things better. I don't know, I just, find it somewhat, meh.

The way I see it, the give and take is a way to mitigate the feeling that you are being a "jerk GM" and have it out for the players. Could you just set the difficulties however you want? Sure, but using the destiny point mechanic creates opportunities for the players down the line which makes it easier to accept the nail-biting Piloting roll you just put in front of them. It says "Yes, I'm making this harder on you, but I'm also giving you permission to nudge things in your favor later on when you really need it."

If a player says they are walking a tightrope between the top of two sky scrapers I'm upgrading that Coordination check with out flipping a DP, in fact I may upgrade it twice. Once for the risk of falling and another for the risk of dropping something. But the difficulty is still only a Hard check because that's what I would make it if it was at ground level.

If weather or time is a factor then I would be adding setback dice to the check as well.

Then finally if I knew the rope was frayed but the player did not then I would flip a DP to upgrade it 1 more time. It could be that I don't have a specific reason for this final upgrade too, other than I really want something disastrous to happen, to me that's when I flip a DP.

OK, follow-up question - what do other GMs use destiny points for? Do you ever use a Destiny Point for something other than upgrading a die? I've not ever done this in my games, since there doesn't seem much point - I can introduce facts without a mechanism to do so!

I use them mostly to introduce something bad happend that the players would not be aware of like a squad of Stormtroopers in a City that willl engage them.

Or Reinforcements for the enemyforces during a fight.

Or to let the hyperspacegenerator overheat in an critical Situation,

or make any of the instruments or Tools disfunctional.

then of course also for darkside users to use white plips

Or to giv the final encounters a new Edge like: "Ups this Inquisitor calls upon the darkside and somehow seems to be transforming losing his mind but gaining strengh... Guys he´ll roll his FR now with every attack to gain additional succsess or advantages... good luck guys" (as mentioned befor my players are MMORPG verterans they like this kind of stuff... well and I do so too ^^)

And everything that players can use the DP for.

The enemy has an instrument that helps him but wasn´t describe before like "oh I didn´t mentioned his second blaster? well you must have overseen it... that a bad turn on your destiny it seems"

Giving the enemy the opportunity to find cover if there wasn´t any before

and so on