Hey guys! So this thread about the salvation AND yavaris combo. Both have their specific roles, but I'm enamoured with the idea of using this combo in a list effectively. So:

Core force:

Nebulon-B support refit(51)

Salvation(7)

Nebulon-B escort frigate(57)

Yavaris(5)

So the idea is to fly them together, yavaris's squadrons protect their flanks from sidestabs(demolicious) and squadrons and combined aa protect against squadrons. Can try to fly along the edge to expose only one flank. Firepower multiplier with two pointy front arcs and 3 shield front hull zones allow them to play as support or lead in a fleet. A weakness is that salvation would often be spamming c.f. commands and yavaris squadron commands, hence repairs and shield movement are difficult to manage.

What will you use it for/in? What kind of objectives do they excel in(first/second player)? What commander(s) work well? What ships can join this task force in a fleet build? How will you build them? What/how many squadrons should fly with them? How else will you fly them?

That would be a Mon Mothma build your looking for. Give them some MC30 torp frigates to distract.

The problem I have is that either Yav is too far from the fight, or Salvation is too near the fight if you fly them together like that.

Salvation loves Advanced Gunnery, and opponents often forget this and just pick it whilst seeing that you have no assault frigates or Mc80's to enjoy it. Fire lanes and Minefields/superior positions, tend to be good for these types of fleets.

I'd go for a 2 X Wing, Luke, Jan and Tycho build personally for squadrons, but to be honest you can go for more if you want too. Yav is a force multiplier not a limiter.

Finally, Sange and yasha are inherently stronger together, this isnt necessarily the case with Yav and Salv, so its a bad name from that point of view. Plus I am not sure how many people will realise your talking about Dota with that name.

I regularly use Salvation with Slaved turrets as a slow plodding fire support vessel. It went toe to toe last night with a VSD-II with Intel, XI7 and Screed on board. Salvation died but left the VSD on 1 hull with only a 3 red dice pot shot from a passing AFII helping out on a flank shield. On one volley it did 9 damage on 5 red dice, braced down to 5 but still deadly.

I also Love Yavaris with Raymus and a few B-wings either covering the front against high speed gate crashers or watching the flanks. 3 B-Wings have done 12 damage to an ISD who landed on them on one occasion. I usually use the Yavaris as a slow Speed 1-2 plodder so it would work well with Salvation nearby. You can use it (and Salvation) as a fast flanker taking advantage of the Neb-B's double yaw at the end of speed 3, with a Nav command it can really turn on a dime once you are out of the Imperial front arc but this won't work well with B-wings as you tend to outrun them and can't take boosted comms. Scrugs could work or X-Wings and those become rather deadly against large fighter swarms once a multi-turn dogfight ensues and Yavaris can tip it in your favour.

Both ships work well with initiative since Nebulons' positioning can be something of a delicate matter (unless you're going for a Rieekan list). Mothma, Garm, or Rieekan would be your best bets. Be very aware that S&Y are both essentially glass cannons that punch way above their weight class, but can have a hard time weathering the counterattack.

Mothma - This works for a swarm, with 1-2 MC30s and Corvettes/YT-2400s filling out whatever points are left over after S&Y + a small bomber wing for Yavaris. Use the MC30(s) to keep the opponent focused on more immediate problems, or, if you lose the initiative bid, try to ram Yavaris and an MC30 into their fleet simultaneously.

Garm - Garm generally provides slight advantages to either early-game positioning, offense, or defense, though with AF2s and MC80s he can provide all 3. S&Y can work with a single larger ship, in which case I'd err on the side of a carrier list; the extra Squadron token is generally more effective than a spare CF token on a gunship. Garm is very versatile, so this is only one of many possibilities; MC30s still work here, as do Engine Techs aplenty on Corvettes/Neb-Bs for an early alpha strike.

Rieekan - I often see Rieekan fleets take a very aggressive approach, forcing opponents to choose between a rock and a hard place. This has the potential to work great with your glass cannons, so long as you provide a multitude of threats. Again, whether you bring a swarm of ships or a swarm of bombers, keep the pressure up.

As for Objectives, the only ones I'd almost definitely go for are Advanced Gunnery, Opening Salvo (both for Salvation), Hyperspace Assault, or Contested Outpost (for either Neb-B). Advanced Gunnery doesn't work with Slaved Turrets, but if you've got, say, XI7s on your salvation (along with similarly equipped fire support or a slew of bombers that make redirecting damage difficult), the double-tap potential of an AG Salvation makes it great for space control / area denial. Opening Salvo can work great since you can add black dice, and any lucky Hit / Crit rolls result in 3 damage apiece. Not exactly the most reliable plan, but it can unexpectedly cripple a large vessel straight away, or blow medium-sized ones right out of the water.

However, keep an open mind with Objectives until you have the rest of your fleet figured out. If you go for a bomber list with Salvation as support, Precision Strike could easily provide way more points, and certain defensive strategies heavily favor Fire Lines over Hyperspace Assault (again, for the points margin). Always remember that these two ships are very strong with Initiative, but you won't be able to combine that with whatever Objectives you're running.

My 2 lists that use both Yavaris and Salvation are

1. A Nebulon archer list.

393/400

Neb-B(Support) Mon Mothma

Neb-B(Support)

Neb-B(Support)

Neb-B(Support) Salvation & slaved turrets

Neb-B(Escort) Yavaris & Raymus

3 B-Wings, Dutch, Wedge

I have also tried a variant swapping out 2 basic Neb-B for Admonition and Han Solo to give me a solid punch ship but you end up splitting your forces somewhat and I think I prefer the 5 Nebs together.

2. B-Wing Carrier Heavy

394/400

MC80c Tallon, Dodonna, ECM, Boosted Comms

Neb-B(Escort) Yavaris & Raymus

Neb-B(Support) Salvation & Slaved Turrets

4 B-Wings, Dutch, 2 X-Wing, YT2400

I currently have Yavaris and Salvation added to Independence under Ackbar with flights of B & A-wings.

It is an experiment. I know, Neb Bs don't like Ackbar, but the way I see it, they make that big forward push, but are able to slash hard passing through the enemy line.

I like your Phantasy Star Online reference, guy. I loved those blades in that game. Cool idea, too.

It was a small scale scenario battle (300 pts, small ships & fighters only). But my opponent ran ackbar with a Neb & 2 vettes, and we were both shocked at the damage output out the side. 3 reds, 2 blues (ackbar and concentrate fire). While I don't think it works in a full 400 standard fight, I wouldn't discount it entirely.

I'm liking Nebulon B lists more and more and more...I mean I bought a fair few due to the X17 lock down...so time to use em!

TRC's greatly increase the pew-pew power of your neb-b's. TRC's are also really great with Dodonna (a lot of people automatically go for the double hit- sometimes, especially vs a big ship, you might want to do a crit!) If running garm, don't underestimate the power of a CF token- those things can swing a very important attack. CR90's can double tap the TRC, I know, but neb's are a lot harder to one shot with the double braces and don't require as much finesse and aren't generally as constrained by obstacle placement (just remember, the great m18 lesson: "FRONT TOWARDS ENEMY."

I have run this one a few times:

Ships:

Neb Esc Yavaris

TRC Neb Esc

TRC Neb Sup

TRC Neb Sup Salvation

TRC Neb Sup + Dodonna

Fighters:

XX, BB, Jan

If you face squadrons, the double-tapped X's + double escort flak takes care of business in a real nasty way. If you've got ships in range, double-tapping B's is delicious. Sometimes I drop two of the TRC's for an extra B, but they're just so durn hard to position I don't get as much utility from that. Against ships, which you should save your 1st turn squad token for, double tapping jan is more consistent with her non bomber black than using the X's (just do her first before the B's and you won't really miss having crit ability.)