Both Dengar's ability and R5-P8 trigger "after defending".

So if Dengar (or any other ship equipping R5-P8) takes enough damage to be destroyed, does this happen before these abilities trigger?

This is still under debate, but my understanding is that the ship is destroyed when the number of damage cards equals it's hull (Rules Reference, pages 9-10, under Damage and Destroying Ships), so during the Deal Damage step of the attack, before "After defending" abilities trigger (an exception made for Simultaneous Attack Rule).

I know that some disagree, they believe that these abilities are triggered even if the ship is destroyed.

Hopefully we'll get an official ruling on it before long.

You fully resolve the attack before FCS kicks in, or Tactician, or Gunner etc... You wouldn't trigger these effects straight after rolling your attack dice.

So, why would 'After defending' effects trigger straight after rolling defence dice (as some are claiming) or at any other point during the attack?

'After Defending' effects are resolved after all steps of 'attack' have been completed. We really don't need a FAQ for this.

Both Dengar's ability and R5-P8 trigger "after defending".

So if Dengar (or any other ship equipping R5-P8) takes enough damage to be destroyed, does this happen before these abilities trigger?

Damage cards are dealt during the Deal Damage step, and the ship is destroyed when it has an amount equal to, or exceeding its hull value. So a ship is destroyed during the steps of the attack. Effects that happen "after" such as that of Dengar and R5-P8 are covered by the section on Card Abilities on page 8:

When a ship is destroyed, its card abilities are no longer active. The exceptions to this rule are card abilities whose effects have already been triggered and specify a time when the effect ends, such as “until the end of the Combat phase.”

The ship's destruction takes place before it can trigger it's special ability or effect.

^ That. Nice and clear.

Cheers thanks

This raises an interesting question for me then. First I agree that if Dengar is dead he doesn't get to retaliate. In order to do something "after defending" he needs to be alive after defending.

However, what about in the case of simultaneous attack? Specifically if the opponent has the initiative. It seems logically they would shoot, destroy Dengar, but he doesn't leave play yet, so he retaliates "after defending" and then performs his usual attack due to the simultaneous rule and is then removed from play.

Now, you could argue due to the above referenced rule that he has already been destroyed so despite getting to shoot back his abilities are gone so he can't trigger them. The problem with that is that based on that interpretation, someone returning fire with simultaneous attack shouldn't be able to use things like Gunner and Predator and I'm pretty sure that has never been how it's played.

It seems slightly contradictory, but I will say we're I "King of X-Wing" I would say Dengar does not get to retaliate after he is destroyed EXCEPT in the specific case of firing second during a simultaneous attack, due to his remaining in play until after his attack. The reasoning being that in other cases a destroyed ship is immediately removed from play but in this case they remain in play until after their attack no matter how much damage they receive.

Based on similar rulings regarding postmortem effect triggers, I believe simultaneous attack rules would allow Dengar to trigger.

However, what about in the case of simultaneous attack? Specifically if the opponent has the initiative. It seems logically they would shoot, destroy Dengar, but he doesn't leave play yet, so he retaliates "after defending" and then performs his usual attack due to the simultaneous rule and is then removed from play.

If he's kept alive my the Simultaneous Attack Rule, then his ability still works. See the second bullet:

During the Combat phase, all ships with a pilot skill value equal to the active ship have the opportunity to attack before being destroyed. If a ship would be destroyed and it has the same pilot skill value as the active ship but has not had an opportunity to attack yet, it is not destroyed. Instead, it retains its Damage cards and continues to function as normal, suffering any effects on its Damage cards. After it has had its opportunity to attack, it is destroyed and removed from the play area.

• Even if the ship did not have a valid target for an attack, it is removed after its opportunity to attack passes.
• While the Simultaneous Attack Rule keeps a ship in the play area, that ship’s abilities and Damage cards remain active.
• After a ship has resolved its opportunity to attack, before it is destroyed, it can resolve any abilities that trigger after performing an attack.

There is some debate though as to whether Denger's ability constitutes "an opportunity to attack" (if it does, he'll only get one attack the round he's destroyed), or if that refers specifically to the ship's normal activation in the combat phase.

Simultaneous fire is pretty clear too. The ship and all it's abilities and effects (including critical damage effects) remain in play and active.

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P17 of the Rules Reference.

While the Simultaneous Attack Rule keeps a ship in the play area, that ship’s abilities and Damage cards remain active.

After a ship has resolved its opportunity to attack, before it is destroyed, it can resolve any abilities that trigger after performing an attack.

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A Simultaneous fire situation does indeed allow Dengar and R5-P8 to trigger even if they are destroyed.

The game does not differentiate between a ship's standard attack and extra attacks triggered by abilities. In thus regard, an attack is an attack.

Dengar's ability therefore satisfies the requirements of the Simultaneous Attack Rule as written, and cannot perform another attack.

The game does not differentiate between a ship's standard attack and extra attacks triggered by abilities. In thus regard, an attack is an attack.

Dengar's ability therefore satisfies the requirements of the Simultaneous Attack Rule as written, and cannot perform another attack.

That's exactly the way I see it to. He's kept in play until he's had his "opportunity to attack". So he can use his ability or his regular attack, but not both. As soon as he's had an opportunity to attack, he's satisfied the SAR, and is removed.