In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

What are all your thoughts on Ion Torpedoes in this slot? You probably have a mod free for Guidance Chip so it's providing damage as well as control.

My favorite part about the rear torpedo arc, is that it is an arc. Even if your primary isn't functional and you never use the arc to shoot, tactician does so love being in r2 in arc. Turret + Tactician front or back arc.

In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

I'll quote the special firing arc rules for you so you don't have to look it up yourself:

"The VCX100 has a special firing Arc identified by dotted lines and a torpedo symbol printed on it ship token. When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon a ship with this icon May attack an enemy ship that is at range one-three and inside its standard or special firing Arc.

When attacking with its primary weapon the ship must still Target an enemy ship inside its standard firing Arc ( unless otherwise specified on an upgrade card)."

Holy hell, that is quite a thing to overread! Now I might have to give some thought to using that.

In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

I'll quote the special firing arc rules for you so you don't have to look it up yourself:

"The VCX100 has a special firing Arc identified by dotted lines and a torpedo symbol printed on it ship token. When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon a ship with this icon May attack an enemy ship that is at range one-three and inside its standard or special firing Arc.

When attacking with its primary weapon the ship must still Target an enemy ship inside its standard firing Arc ( unless otherwise specified on an upgrade card)."

You are correct that the ship has the option of firing a r1 to r3 torpedo, but not all torpedoes can cooperate. You still need to follow the torpedo rules on the individual card.

What are all your thoughts on Ion Torpedoes in this slot? You probably have a mod free for Guidance Chip so it's providing damage as well as control.

Ion torpedoes would seem very helpful against generic swarms, hard to use but could be very effective.

In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

I'll quote the special firing arc rules for you so you don't have to look it up yourself:

"The VCX100 has a special firing Arc identified by dotted lines and a torpedo symbol printed on it ship token. When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon a ship with this icon May attack an enemy ship that is at range one-three and inside its standard or special firing Arc.

When attacking with its primary weapon the ship must still Target an enemy ship inside its standard firing Arc ( unless otherwise specified on an upgrade card)."

You are correct that the ship has the option of firing a r1 to r3 torpedo, but not all torpedoes can cooperate. You still need to follow the torpedo rules on the individual card.

Why would the rules say you can fire them at range 1-3, if you had to follow range rules on the cards. In that case they wouldn't need to make a rules exception and simply say "you can make torpedo attacks with the rear arc". It's also the whole reason APT are included in the pack. As you can shoot them range 3 in front arc too if you wanted, once again making RHYMER look even worse, lol!

Because in some parts of the world that's not even legal.

...

...

Oh wait, torpedoes being fired out the rear arc of a ship!

Whoops.

nvm.

I'm always intrigued by APTs when you got the system and torpedo slot. FCS can give you the TL the prior turn and all you need to do is position and focus. However, with the Ghost it gets expensive quickly. I was thinking about a bare bones Lothal Rebel build, but its nearly 50 points Lothal Rebel (35)Fire-Control System (2)Advanced Proton Torpedoes (6)Extra Munitions (2)"Zeb" Orrelios (1)Ion Projector (2)Total: 48View in Yet Another Squad Builder Yeah... just stick with the 4 dice primary.

Don't forget chopper crew! Use those reds on dial and still get focus!

In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

I'll quote the special firing arc rules for you so you don't have to look it up yourself:

"The VCX100 has a special firing Arc identified by dotted lines and a torpedo symbol printed on it ship token. When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon a ship with this icon May attack an enemy ship that is at range one-three and inside its standard or special firing Arc.

When attacking with its primary weapon the ship must still Target an enemy ship inside its standard firing Arc ( unless otherwise specified on an upgrade card)."

You are correct that the ship has the option of firing a r1 to r3 torpedo, but not all torpedoes can cooperate. You still need to follow the torpedo rules on the individual card.

Why would the rules say you can fire them at range 1-3, if you had to follow range rules on the cards. In that case they wouldn't need to make a rules exception and simply say "you can make torpedo attacks with the rear arc". It's also the whole reason APT are included in the pack. As you can shoot them range 3 in front arc too if you wanted, once again making RHYMER look even worse, lol!

I'm not sure that means you ignore the range on the torpedo card. Maybe I'm wrong, but it just seems to say you can attack out the rear arc with a torpedo. It would be interesting if that were the case that it ignores range requirements. I can see using Zeb and firing a torp out the rear, then. *Bump*...then *Boom*!

Why would the rules say you can fire them at range 1-3, if you had to follow range rules on the cards. In that case they wouldn't need to make a rules exception and simply say "you can make torpedo attacks with the rear arc". It's also the whole reason APT are included in the pack. As you can shoot them range 3 in front arc too if you wanted, once again making RHYMER look even worse, lol!

I'm not sure that means you ignore the range on the torpedo card. Maybe I'm wrong, but it just seems to say you can attack out the rear arc with a torpedo. It would be interesting if that were the case that it ignores range requirements. I can see using Zeb and firing a torp out the rear, then. *Bump*...then *Boom*!

You're being nice. It absolutely doesn't mean you ignore the range requirement on the secondary weapon card.

In that case, I don't know if APT is the best.

The special firing arc also doesn't require range. Making APT 1-3 range. With FCS just shoot primary aND fly right past someone who hopefully k turned to follow and shoot APT with target lock and focus.

Where did you get that impression? You do have to follow the rules on your torpedoe card.

I'll quote the special firing arc rules for you so you don't have to look it up yourself:

"The VCX100 has a special firing Arc identified by dotted lines and a torpedo symbol printed on it ship token. When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon a ship with this icon May attack an enemy ship that is at range one-three and inside its standard or special firing Arc.

When attacking with its primary weapon the ship must still Target an enemy ship inside its standard firing Arc ( unless otherwise specified on an upgrade card)."

The first part is "when attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon." You have to pay attention to the range requirements at that point.

The special firing arc text allows you to fire in the window of r1-r3 of the rear arc.

Torpedoes are still pricey and when you stick them on you're bringing it to at the very least a brobot price point. I'm not sure I trust the double rebel no help build yet.

While I agree that you have to follow the range restrictions on the Torpedo cards (cards override rules, generally), I find them mentioning the "range 1-3" thing in there is awkward, confusing, and unnecessary.

While I agree that you have to follow the range restrictions on the Torpedo cards (cards override rules, generally), I find them mentioning the "range 1-3" thing in there is awkward, confusing, and unnecessary.

So why would they go out of their way to say you can fire them at range 1 to 3 if you in fact could not shoot them range 1 to 3.

It would be necessary to say that the ranges as you can make all torpedo attacks in range 1 to 3. Protons at range one and APT at ranges 2 and 3.

The special firing arc is literally an aux arc for torpedoes. It doesn't make them magically rangeless from the back.

While I agree that you have to follow the range restrictions on the Torpedo cards (cards override rules, generally), I find them mentioning the "range 1-3" thing in there is awkward, confusing, and unnecessary.

So why would they go out of their way to say you can fire them at range 1 to 3 if you in fact could not shoot them range 1 to 3.

It would be necessary to say that the ranges as you can make all torpedo attacks in range 1 to 3. Protons at range one and APT at ranges 2 and 3.

If it hadn't been included, someone could use precisely the same logic you're using now to argue that you could make torpedo attacks with the VCX's special arc at any range.

The language for the special firing arc is a mirror of the language used for the auxiliary firing arc. Check the Rules Reference:

When attacking with its primary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or auxiliary firing arc.

Compare that to the language describing the special arc (emphasis in the original):

When attacking with a [torpedo] secondary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or special firing arc.

They're using parallel structure to emphasize the point that you can make attacks with torpedoes against a ship in your special firing arc. They are not providing a rule which overrides the range limitation provided on every secondary weapon card. In fact, the rules can't do so, due to one of the Golden Rules of X-wing:

Card abilities can override the rules listed in this guide

So not only does the text in the Ghost rulesheet not mean what you think it means, but even if it did, it would still be overruled by the range limitation of the secondary weapon itself.

The special firing arc is literally an aux arc for torpedoes. It doesn't make them magically rangeless from the back.

I don't think they could make it any clearer. I'll shoe you the rules for about the 4th time this thread.

"When attacking with a torpedo secondary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at range 1-3 and inside it's standard or special firing firing arc."

Declare weapon: APT

Declare target: enemy ship behind ghost

Check range and arc: range 3 in special arc

Attack: requires a TL to be spent then follows rules for attacking.

While I agree that you have to follow the range restrictions on the Torpedo cards (cards override rules, generally), I find them mentioning the "range 1-3" thing in there is awkward, confusing, and unnecessary.

So why would they go out of their way to say you can fire them at range 1 to 3 if you in fact could not shoot them range 1 to 3.It would be necessary to say that the ranges as you can make all torpedo attacks in range 1 to 3. Protons at range one and APT at ranges 2 and 3.

If it hadn't been included, someone could use precisely the same logic you're using now to argue that you could make torpedo attacks with the VCX's special arc at any range. The language for the special firing arc is a mirror of the language used for the auxiliary firing arc. Check the Rules Reference:

When attacking with its primary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or auxiliary firing arc.

Compare that to the language describing the special arc (emphasis in the original):

When attacking with a [torpedo] secondary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or special firing arc.

They're using parallel structure to emphasize the point that you can make attacks with torpedoes against a ship in your special firing arc. They are not providing a rule which overrides the range limitation provided on every secondary weapon card. In fact, the rules can't do so, due to one of the Golden Rules of X-wing:

Card abilities can override the rules listed in this guide

So not only does the text in the Ghost rulesheet not mean what you think it means, but even if it did, it would still be overruled by the range limitation of the secondary weapon itself.

Dam you and your logic. LOL. Good catch on the aux arc rules comparison. I'm still hoping but for the time being I guess it's the way to go.

The language for the special firing arc is a mirror of the language used for the auxiliary firing arc. Check the Rules Reference:

When attacking with its primary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or auxiliary firing arc.

Compare that to the language describing the special arc (emphasis in the original):

When attacking with a [torpedo] secondary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or special firing arc.

They're using parallel structure to emphasize the point that you can make attacks with torpedoes against a ship in your special firing arc. They are not providing a rule which overrides the range limitation provided on every secondary weapon card. In fact, the rules can't do so, due to one of the Golden Rules of X-wing:

I'm almost disappointed that mirroring for consistency is the reason. I was just starting to imagine Epic Play Only ordnance with ranges up to 5 that couldn't be fired out the Ghost's butt. Ordnance Tubes would become... epic.

While I agree that you have to follow the range restrictions on the Torpedo cards (cards override rules, generally), I find them mentioning the "range 1-3" thing in there is awkward, confusing, and unnecessary.

So why would they go out of their way to say you can fire them at range 1 to 3 if you in fact could not shoot them range 1 to 3.It would be necessary to say that the ranges as you can make all torpedo attacks in range 1 to 3. Protons at range one and APT at ranges 2 and 3.

If it hadn't been included, someone could use precisely the same logic you're using now to argue that you could make torpedo attacks with the VCX's special arc at any range. The language for the special firing arc is a mirror of the language used for the auxiliary firing arc. Check the Rules Reference:

When attacking with its primary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or auxiliary firing arc.

Compare that to the language describing the special arc (emphasis in the original):

When attacking with a [torpedo] secondary weapon, a ship with this icon may attack an enemy ship that is at Range 1–3 and inside its standard or special firing arc.

They're using parallel structure to emphasize the point that you can make attacks with torpedoes against a ship in your special firing arc. They are not providing a rule which overrides the range limitation provided on every secondary weapon card. In fact, the rules can't do so, due to one of the Golden Rules of X-wing:

Card abilities can override the rules listed in this guide

So not only does the text in the Ghost rulesheet not mean what you think it means, but even if it did, it would still be overruled by the range limitation of the secondary weapon itself.

Dam you and your logic. LOL. Good catch on the aux arc rules comparison. I'm still hoping but for the time being I guess it's the way to go.

Bit insane to cook Rhymer's ability into even the Generic ghost, after all

Ignoring range requirements for any non-standard arc would make for an interesting pilot ability, or even a modification.

(probably would be better as a modification, so it forces you to sacrifice Guidance Chimps in return for the extra range).

Rear firing arcs don't really help the Firespray

Wha... You realize that is the single strongest aspect of the ship, right?

The more Marinealver posts I read, the more convinced I am he owns his own completely different version of X-Wing.

Indeed. The rear firing arcs on the Firespray are literally the entire point of the ship. You force your opponent to chase you - if they want to shoot you, they have to follow you. Then you drop bombs in their face and shoot them back.

It's a hell of a lot of fun.

And when an arc dodger like Soontir comes along and says hi, you get to watch your firespray die.

You can have your pet favorite ship. That is fine, sure who wouldn't want Boba Fet's ship? It gets to do all sort of cool tricks like drop multiple bombs and carry an assortment of weapon load-outs, it is the coolest gunship in X-wing. But do you see any Boba Fet is so OP or The Firespray needs a nerf threads? Of course not, sure the Firespray is not Scyk levels of weak but it is no where near the power levels of Soontir or TLT Y-wings. There was dozens of nerf Han but no one worries about Boba Fet as if he is still stuck inside the Salarac.

Perhaps I am playing a different game of X-wing than you, but it is not different X-wing than anyone else is playing. I don't know what new players you decide to beat up on because experience players won't get behind a firespray (especially not Kath). They would pull up to it side outside of BOTH firing arcs and destroy your precious Boba Fet.

Boba fett can be PS 10, so only 1 ace (Vader) is usually able to move after him, and even then I would take poor piloting on the Firespray player's part to let Vader get on his flank without a wingman covering it. I flew a Boba/Bossk list to victory over every Palp Aces list I've ever gone against, it eats them like candy, and these were good players who went to win the SC in my area.

Though to the OP, I think the ghost is expensive enough with enough punch without the addition of torpedoes, personally.