Looking at the rules he uses Fly/Drive to move his speeder from Close range of the cantina to one range band away (Short) as he is at speed 1 and used the required 2 maneuvers.

The bad guys are a turn behind him and appear at the Cantina door, looking for their target. The hero is now at Short range. According to page 239 he is "several dozen kilometers away" and well out of sight, sound and reach. (say 36 or maybe 48 km away, you choose)

Wait wait, hold up. That reads like you're using Planetary Scale range in lieu of Personal Scale range. Short range in personal scale is still a conversational distance - you can converse without having to raise your voices. Certainly the Hero is well within blaster range for even the crappiest shot.

I agree that range bands are a little nebulous and require extra thought to wrap one's head around. Heck, I even asked one of our fancy graphic artists around here to make a first person view of range, which I cannot locate now of course.

I may be recalling incorrectly, but I believe that all Personal Scale range bands take place within Planetary Scale's "Close" range band.

Ok, thanks for the input guys but at the risk of sounding like a blockhead, there is still a fundamental disconnect in my opinion between how some things Mechanically work in the rules and therefor they foul up any reasonable interpretation. That same interpretation or narrative that is being stressed so heavily. BELIEVE me, I understand the concept and have played such games before but the rules should support such narrative not hinder it.

Ill try this one last time then let it go. When playing we use the rules of the game, interpretation of the dice and decisions of the players and GM to introduce a story line. So... what follows is a flow of events from the game in involving just one of the areas I believe are flawed. Feel free to provide an interpretation.

**Its the player's turn and they are in a speeder approaching a foritified camp. The GM states they come over a rise and there it is as medium planetary range. (The players, especially new ones, may ask about how far that is away. They glance at the book and see that is says under 50 kilometers which isn't extremely helpful but for purposes of this example the GM states its about 40 kilometers away but ok, whatever)

Two of the party jump out and set up a piece of equipment necessary for their mission. It will take several turns to assemble. They unload and begin assembly on the same turn the rest of the party proceed in the speeder.

They spend a turn assembling, approximately a minute as many of you claim, and make some progress. Meanwhile the speeder driver took one maneuver to increase to speed one and begins driving toward the camp. In the next turn he takes two maneuvers at speed 1 and moves from medium to short range and comes under fire. The next turn they do the same, and the speeder proceeds, still at speed 1, and then moves short to close range returning fire as it approaches. Since there is no closer planetary range, they come within Personal range and the rules state they can cross that distance easily, minutes to microseconds or something like that, so they arrive at the camp on the fourth turn, unload and begin a pitched small arms battle.

The GM can describe that scene in many ways but the fact of the matter is that in about 4 minutes the speeder traveled somewhere close to 50km, according to the descriptions in the book everyone is reminding me to read. (page 239) that's 750kph. (Perhaps more oddly, a sandcrawler full of Jawas would have made the trip just as fast)

But forget the numbers and the speeder still closed on a object that was originally on the horizon at way beyond many sensor and weapons ranges in under 5 minutes, the time it took some others to set up a tripod and camera or something.

How do you narrate that in a game and not have the players stare at you a little stunned?

Just like everyone here has said, you dont get so enamored with the numbers in the book that they make problems.

Everyone here has understood your problem perfectly, and has said, 'stop making it a problem!'

When you stop at medium range from the base, you are at medium range from the base, not some set distance. When you move to short range from the base you are at short range not some smaller set distance.

This is supposed to be a narrative game, not an exact simulation. The numbers dont matter. Quite frankly, if it gets in the way of the narration, the rules dont matter.

Ok, switch it to an air speeder, same applies. Speed 1, one turn, 2400kph. It gets way crazier if he makes medium range etc. The ranges either have an equivalent distance or they don't. Perhaps they should have multiple levels at the higher ranges, taking several maneuvers to traverse them. (like 10!)

Set this scenario up with a spacecraft and it goes off the deep end. Ships traveling a constant speed accelerate into the thousands of km per turn in the upper ranges.

You know, if the player runs out of a cantina, leaps into a landspeeder and races off his two maneuvers, I'm going to say that there's no way he can hit top speed in city traffic. You ever try and race your lamborghini at 190kph in rush hour? Not happening.

(or at the very least all the pedestrians, men carrying panes of glass, fruit carts, cardboard boxes and baby carriages in the way mean that his roll is ridiculously difficult and full of Red Dice)

A lot of this revolves around this point, that these encounters don't occur, or shouldn't occur, absent environmental issues. Plus the Speed itself is an abstract stat, just like the range bands, which represents both 'speed' or probably should say velocity, as well as, acceleration. Just because a vehicle is capable of moving a certain speed and acceleration, doesn't mean that it can.

The GM can describe that scene in many ways but the fact of the matter is that in about 4 minutes the speeder traveled somewhere close to 50km, according to the descriptions in the book everyone is reminding me to read. (page 239) that's 750kph. (Perhaps more oddly, a sandcrawler full of Jawas would have made the trip just as fast)

But forget the numbers and the speeder still closed on a object that was originally on the horizon at way beyond many sensor and weapons ranges in under 5 minutes, the time it took some others to set up a tripod and camera or something.

How do you narrate that in a game and not have the players stare at you a little stunned?

You keep clinging to those numbers, but you don't have to. Frankly you can use whatever range band intervals you want, and scale them according to the encounter at hand. I don't know why you keep translating range bands to "real distance" anyway, it's only going to do you and your players a disservice. All they need to know is if they're shooting someone at Extreme range, it's far enough that at minimum it will take the target 6 maneuvers to get close enough to worry about.

And if they keep asking you, or insist you provide and won't play without it, then maybe it's not the right game for them.

I have to ask though, when have ranges ever been "accurate"? I'm pretty sure D20/Saga didn't have an accurate representation of a sniper rifle according to your military-spec-quoting player.

This is why I enjoy using grid maps and minis!

That may be a solution for rgrove, and it's perfectly viable, but if the next thing he does is translate the grid to meters, he's back to the same problem.

I'm not clinging to anything. Those are the range equivalents as described in the rules, word forcword.

Looking at the rules he uses Fly/Drive to move his speeder from Close range of the cantina to one range band away (Short) as he is at speed 1 and used the required 2 maneuvers.

The bad guys are a turn behind him and appear at the Cantina door, looking for their target. The hero is now at Short range. According to page 239 he is "several dozen kilometers away" and well out of sight, sound and reach. (say 36 or maybe 48 km away, you choose)

Wait wait, hold up. That reads like you're using Planetary Scale range in lieu of Personal Scale range. Short range in personal scale is still a conversational distance - you can converse without having to raise your voices. Certainly the Hero is well within blaster range for even the crappiest shot.

I agree that range bands are a little nebulous and require extra thought to wrap one's head around. Heck, I even asked one of our fancy graphic artists around here to make a first person view of range, which I cannot locate now of course.

I may be recalling incorrectly, but I believe that all Personal Scale range bands take place within Planetary Scale's "Close" range band.

I am using planetary scale, it's a vehicle encounter. Guys in speeder exchanging fire with gum emplacement at camp.

I think there is also an issue where he is trying to use combat instead of chase. Combat implies two opponents that want to fight. If either doesn't, then chase rules should be in effect. What scale to use is driven by both story and environment imo, although in space it would typically be planetary scale.

I heard "rules don't matter" loud and clear above. If that's the case I have over $250 in useless books. I could have told a Star War bed time story to my players before without them.

Now you're just being pedantic. I'm done trying to teach poetry to a tape measure.

PS

and childish.

I am using planetary scale, it's a vehicle encounter. Guys in speeder exchanging fire with gum emplacement at camp.

Ah, sorry, I was operating off the OP, wherein The Hero just left a Cantina and hopped in a speeder and moved to Close range while the Baddies where just coming out of the Cantina.

I heard "rules don't matter" loud and clear above. If that's the case I have over $250 in useless books. I could have told a Star War bed time story to my players before without them.

I think what is wrong here is that this is a narrative game and some people want to treat it as a tactical miniature game, ala' Saga Edition.

Also remember that a round IS NOT one minute long. It CAN BE up to a minute long, but lasts enough to allow everyone to move and perform an important action. So a round can be mere seconds long as well. This is actually written in the ECRB that way. In this "Narrative" game, Rounds are not broken down into concrete time measurements like other systems.

Also remember that in "Combat" or "Rounds" each participant gets to act during a "Turn", all the "Turns" are happening almost simultaneously. (Per ECRB) So while Player A is acting, NPC A is acting just milliseconds afterward, if not actually during Player A's "Turn". So NPC A is not just standing there waiting for Player A to finish up running away before he will act. So in essence you will have two people each running towards their speeders are driving at the same time.

As far as Planetary Scale, I wouldn't use that scale unless I was in Orbit or above. To me that represents speeds and distances to great to worry about.

It's great that you have $250 in books. If you never open them, they are worthless.

"Planetary range" ECRB:

"The distances and range bands presented here are based on the personal scale for characters. Starships and vehicles may use these range bands, or much larger range bands, based on the needs of the story. On a planet's surface, these range bands may suffice, while in the depths of outer space in the midst of a heated starship battle, the range bands represent much larger distances and positions. See the starship section for more details on planetary and starship-based ranges and distances. A good guideline is that the close range on planetary scale picks up where the extreme range of personal scale ends-it's the next step in ranged bands. However, the scale is so much bigger that a single person could never use maneuvers to move next to a target that's "close" to him on a planetary scale-the distance may be up to several kilometers and take hours of walking Further range bands on a planetary scale would be even more extreme. Planetary scale ranges are explained further on page 238 in Chapter VII: Starships and Vehicles."

Not every RPG is for everyone. Maybe this system is not for you. I knew many people that loved the Saga Edition. I myself couldn't stand it.

I'm not clinging to anything. Those are the range equivalents as described in the rules, word forcword.

Exactly. You're clinging to it "word for word". I don't know why you feel you must, especially when the rules also specifically say that time and space are to be treated flexibly. Your approach is completely inflexible, and at odds with the intent of the rules. So of course it's not going to work for you, if you continue to fixate on the literal parts of the rules and ignore the rest.

You keep insisting you "get" the narrative aspects, but it seems pretty clear that you're missing out on how, in this game, you set the mechanical stage to resolve a conflict, which is all about building the dice pool to reflect the current situation. In a shooty situation, all that matters is range bands and terrain. Meters aren't part of it.

I heard "rules don't matter" loud and clear above. If that's the case I have over $250 in useless books. I could have told a Star War bed time story to my players before without them.

And you show that you are the one not understanding what is being said.

Yes, if that is the way you want to look at it, the books are useless. They are. You can play a star wars RPG with nothing but a few imaginations. No pens, no papers, just a just some imagination and a willingness to use it.

But that isnt really what we are trying to get through to you. The point you are rejecting is that rules that dont make sense should not be something that causes problems in a game. It is not that you are 50.924857285756 km from a base and they speeder flies at 783.87399573 km/hr. It isnt even that you are at medium range so at speed 1 I can get to close range in 2 turns even tho my speeder shouldnt be able to fly at mach 1.

Instead of getting caught up in the numbers, just have fun. If Bob wants to go shoot up a base while June and Fred set up the McGuffin, just let him do it. Just say it takes a little while to get to the base, not you have a speed of 1 so you have to do 4 move manuvers to get there. Say after travel he has 5 rounds before the McGuffin is set up, not well we have to have everyone track their manuvers and actions for the whole time. If you are in a chase, you are in a chase, so do a chase, not 'I did my move so I am kilometers away now'

I am using planetary scale, it's a vehicle encounter. Guys in speeder exchanging fire with gum emplacement at camp.

Which means the emplacement is also operating at the same range bands. So the people on the ground can shoot at the people in the air in the same manner as the ones in the air can shoot at the ground. I'm failing to see the problem.

Range bands and time scales are definitely two of the more nebulous parts of this game, and can be difficult to wrap your head around — both for the players, and for the GM.

In cases where things seem confusing, I would encourage you to try to take advantage of the fact that they are nebulous and not very tightly defined, and change the definition on the spot to fit whatever your story and plot requirements are. Make them make sense for you, in whatever are your current circumstances.

That takes practice, and it can take a lot of effort. But, just like narrating dice results, it is something that you can get better at over time, and as you get better at it, doing so can help you better tell a more interesting story — for both you and your players.

And encourage your players to do the same. Allow them the flexibility to add to the narrative by bringing their own explanations to the table. Have them tell you what they want to have happen, and then work out how it makes sense for the story and plot, and how difficult it might be for them to achieve that.

I confess that I’m not so good at these things myself. I hope to get better, and I hope that bringing these ideas here will help me remember and use them in my own games in the future.

I would also echo R2Builder’s comments about about everything in a given round of combat being virtually simultaneous. You resolve things in a certain order, but that’s just the resolution and not each and every aspect of whatever actions lead to that resolution.

You may be bobbing and weaving and ducking and rolling for an entire minute, and firing or being fired at the whole time, but the one sequence of blaster bolts that actually does the damage is resolved at one specific point — and all the rest of that round might be spent doing all the other actions association with that resolution.

I think the more you can focus on the narrative and not the mechanical aspects of the game, the better you will be able to tell a good story, and the more fun that will be had by players and GM alike.

At least, I sure hope so!

I'm not sure why anyone would be measuring time when all that's going on is two people set up a device and another is driving. None of that should be done in measured time.

Yeah, that's my takeaway from all this.

Ok, thanks for the input guys but at the risk of sounding like a blockhead, there is still a fundamental disconnect in my opinion between how some things Mechanically work in the rules and therefor they foul up any reasonable interpretation. That same interpretation or narrative that is being stressed so heavily. BELIEVE me, I understand the concept and have played such games before but the rules should support such narrative not hinder it.

Ill try this one last time then let it go. When playing we use the rules of the game, interpretation of the dice and decisions of the players and GM to introduce a story line. So... what follows is a flow of events from the game in involving just one of the areas I believe are flawed. Feel free to provide an interpretation.

**Its the player's turn and they are in a speeder approaching a foritified camp. The GM states they come over a rise and there it is as medium planetary range. (The players, especially new ones, may ask about how far that is away. They glance at the book and see that is says under 50 kilometers which isn't extremely helpful but for purposes of this example the GM states its about 40 kilometers away but ok, whatever)

Two of the party jump out and set up a piece of equipment necessary for their mission. It will take several turns to assemble. They unload and begin assembly on the same turn the rest of the party proceed in the speeder.

They spend a turn assembling, approximately a minute as many of you claim, and make some progress. Meanwhile the speeder driver took one maneuver to increase to speed one and begins driving toward the camp. In the next turn he takes two maneuvers at speed 1 and moves from medium to short range and comes under fire. The next turn they do the same, and the speeder proceeds, still at speed 1, and then moves short to close range returning fire as it approaches. Since there is no closer planetary range, they come within Personal range and the rules state they can cross that distance easily, minutes to microseconds or something like that, so they arrive at the camp on the fourth turn, unload and begin a pitched small arms battle.

The GM can describe that scene in many ways but the fact of the matter is that in about 4 minutes the speeder traveled somewhere close to 50km, according to the descriptions in the book everyone is reminding me to read. (page 239) that's 750kph. (Perhaps more oddly, a sandcrawler full of Jawas would have made the trip just as fast)

But forget the numbers and the speeder still closed on a object that was originally on the horizon at way beyond many sensor and weapons ranges in under 5 minutes, the time it took some others to set up a tripod and camera or something.

How do you narrate that in a game and not have the players stare at you a little stunned?

For the game that I GM, here is how I would narrate the above situation:

GM - "Okay, so you guys have been traveling for awhile but eventually come to a point, about Medium Planetary Range, and you can see the enemy base in the distance."

Player 1 - "I want to hop out and start prepping our equipment."

Player 3 - "Yeah, me too, I'll assist."

GM - "Okay, what do the rest of you want to do?"

Players 2, 4, 5 - "We will continue on to the base to draw their fire."

GM - "Sounds good. So player 1 & 3, you guys hop out of the speeder and unload your equipment and begin setting it up. Players 2, 4, & 5, you guys press forward toward the base. When you get to about short range from the base you hear the THOOM THOOM of cannons and the ground erupts around your speeder as you start to come under fire from the base's gun emplacements. Meanwhile, players 1 & 3, you guys have finished setting up your equipment and hear the sound of defense cannons in the distance."

Player 4 (Pilot) - "Oh boy! I want to get us as close as possible to the base so we can avoid those guns!"

GM - "No sweat, just make a Pilot (Planetary) check, let's say Easy cause its open terrain, but have a setback or two from trying to avoid the cannon fire."

Player 4 (Pilot) - "Pierce of cake! <rolls some dice> Awesome! 3 successes, 2 threat and a Triumph!!"

GM - "Nice! So you punch it and are darting the speeder across the battlefield skillfully avoiding the cannon fire, and you can position the speeder to whatever personal scale range you want to be in. Take 1 point of strain from the stress (personally as a GM I LOVE handing out strain), now what do you want to do with that Triumph?

Player 4 (Pilot) - "Um, I want to position us so we have the most advantageous position against their ground troops. Either, we are positioned such that we are completely out of line of sight of their cannons or player 5 can upgrade his next attack due to positioning? And put us at medium range? <Looks at players 3 & 5 for approval.>"

GM - "Excellent, sounds good to me and I'll actually let you do both! You speed up close to the base and come to a sliding halt angled just right that player 5 has a perfectly lined up shot against the bad guys!"

Player 5 - "Sweet! I open fire trying to take as many out as possible!"

Etc...

See, no need to worry about specific distances.

Now you're just being pedantic. I'm done trying to teach poetry to a tape measure.

PS

and childish.

Nice

Okay, as a fellow numbers person (as anyone who has seen my posts on the release schedules can attest), let me see if I can help explain this, using your example, in a way that makes sense. Because it does make perfect sense, you just need to alter your perspective a little.

So, here are my starting assumptions: the PC is in the door to the cantina, and his speeder is only a couple meters away [Personal scale Short range; Planetary scale Close range]. To avoid having to deal with the messiness of city maneuvering, this cantina is in the middle of an open field, kilometers of no real terrain in all directions.

So, to start, the actual actions the PC needs to spend to perform this is 5 maneuvers, as follows:

Maneuver 1: Move (Personal Maneuver) – This moves the PC from the door of the cantina into engaged range of the speeder;

Maneuver 2: Mount (Personal Maneuver) – This gets the PC onto the speeder, allows him to power it up, and do all the little things needed to get the bike operational and ready to go;

Maneuver 3: Accelerate (Starship Maneuver) – This takes the speeder from a stationary Speed 0 to Speed 1, able to make the escape;

Maneuver 4: Drive (Starship Maneuver) – This gets us moving away, but it doesn’t take us to Planetary scale Short range yet because;

Maneuver 5: Drive (Starship Maneuver) – This finally gets us to Planetary scale Short range, because as we see on page 232 of the EotE CRB, it takes 2 Drive maneuvers to go from Close range to Short range at Speed 1.

So just from this, your bad guys do have a chance to take some shots as our hero speeds away. Since our hero is spending his first turn getting to and on the bike before it even starts moving, they can move into the doorway and attack if they want. And even then, since it takes 3 starship maneuvers to get the bike going, that’s at least a round and a half to get to Short range, so with rough numbers, a minute and a half. And if the PC has a standard speeder bike, doing so is going to get dangerously close to burning it out, what with the average 3-4 System Strain such bikes can normally take. An average bike would need three rounds, up to three minutes(!!), to get there without straining itself.

Now, the obvious follow-up is, “Okay, but three minutes to go 24 kilometers is still an average speed of 480 km/h, and if the PC is gunning it, even if it damages the bike, he’s got a speed of up to 960 km/h! Not as extreme as what I had before, but still way too fast for ‘Speed 1,’ which is supposed to be slow!” Well, yes, it would be, but you’re not going 24+ kilometers in that time. But why not? Short range is, “Up to several dozen kilometers,” after all, so why aren’t I going that far?

Remember that a range band is just that, a BAND. “Planetary Scale Short” is anywhere from “several kilometers” to “several dozen kilometers.” Putting that in numbers, let’s say that it’s anywhere from 2 km to 24 km. Okay, that’s a wide range. But just because you’re in that range doesn’t mean that you’re automatically gotten all the way to the other end of it.

Let’s use an example from D&D 3.5/Pathfinder, since that seems like a system you may be familiar with. We have a guard on a tower with a composite longbow loaded with an epic arrow of PC-slaying +50, and our helpless PC is at the bottom of the tower, adjacent to the guard on the grid. Clearly, he wants to get as far away as possible, so he takes the Run action, moving four times his speed directly away from the archer. Now, a composite longbow has a range-increment of 110 feet, or 22 squares. If a target is between 1-22 squares, the archer takes no penalty on his attack. If the target is between 23-44 squares, the archer takes a -2 penalty. So in our example, our PC runs away, and ends up one range increment away from the archer. What you’re doing is saying, “Hey, that PC moved 220 feet in 6 seconds! That’s too fast!” But that’s not what happened. What happened is the PC ran 120 feet (4x30), getting him just into the archer’s second range increment. Mechanically, the game does not recognize a difference for that archer being 115 feet away, and 220 feet away.

The same thing is happening with the PC on the speeder bike. Yes, he got to Planetary Short range, but he’s just on the near edge of it, maybe between 2 and 5 km. If he was all the way to the far edge, 24 km away, why would it take him 2 additional maneuvers to get to medium range? Even if we’re generous and say he’s 10 km away, that’s still gets our maximum speed down to 400 km/h if the PC is gunning it and straining the be-geebus out of his bike. Yeah, it’s still fast. But is it as ridiculous as 24,000 km/h? Not by a long shot. And the bike can’t maintain that speed indefinitely. After that first round, if he doesn’t want his bike to stall out from the stress, our PC’s gonna have to cut it back.

And that’s all just from making sure we understand the rules and changing our perspective a little. We can cut back on the ridiculousness even more if we consider that range bands, especially Planetary scale range bands, are fluid. If we’re only including speeder bikes, why not say that short range in this particular encounter with just those bikes tops out at 10 km? That puts our friend at a max speed of 200 km/h when he’s gunning it, and 100 km/h otherwise while at Speed 1. Still fast? Yes, but it’s a speeder bike, they’re supposed to be fast. But this curbs the problem of insane speeds into something much more gentle to your verisimilitude.

Now, going back to the actual escape from the cantina, let’s look at something. Now, our PC took his first turn to get to and on his bike, ready to jet out. The bad guys can clearly use that turn to catch up and maybe fire off some shots. But what about that second round? The PC spends his maneuvers “Accelerate”-ing and “Drive”-ing, but he doesn’t change any range bands. So what, is he doing the equivalent of revving his engine at a red light, and when he’s at speed he goes shooting off? Can the bad guys just leisurely walk up to him and shoot him in the head at point blank range? No, he accelerated and moved, of course he’s not still right there. While that doesn’t affect anything on the Planetary scale yet, as a GM you would be perfectly within your rights to say that, on personal scale, those maneuvers do end up having an effect. Maybe the “Accelerate” maneuver takes him to Personal scale Medium range, and the subsequent Drive maneuver takes him to Personal scale Long range, or even Extreme. He’s still within Planetary Close so that has had no effect, but he has moved away from the bad guys. If they have a long-range rifle they can still try to hit him one more time before he’s too far away, but it’ll be tough.

So, does that help out with your ability to visualize it? I’ll admit, being used to D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder myself, I had a hard time making the leap myself. But trust me, once you learn to let go and trust your feelings, not your head, it’s well worth it!

I really appreciate that last post. It took some thought and time. I'm no Pathfinder fan but I get your point. I'm working hard to see all of your points. I really want to keep our game going.

I would simply go "Don't worry about it". Tell whatever story you're looking for and handwave the ranges. "Eh, across the room is - well, it's a pretty big warehouse, so we'll call it - oh, how about medium." or "That ship is about 300 meters away, so we'll go short range" or whatever. And then if the players say something, THEN you can worry about it. But if they don't care, why should you.

While that works fine for some of us, I do have a lot of friends who are very analytic and who have only ever played RPGs (for going on two decades now) that use concrete numbers for measuring distances. They've had a hard time with these same concepts, so helping to break it down is something well worth doing.

What you've said is the goal. But sometimes reaching the goal means taking baby-steps in between.

I'm not sure why anyone would be measuring time when all that's going on is two people set up a device and another is driving. None of that should be done in measured time.

Yeah, that's my takeaway from all this.

They were being shot at, combat rounds.

So, does that help out with your ability to visualize it?

Absol197, I get it and I feel like your post helped cement it even better for me. Thanks!

I would simply go "Don't worry about it". Tell whatever story you're looking for and handwave the ranges. "Eh, across the room is - well, it's a pretty big warehouse, so we'll call it - oh, how about medium." or "That ship is about 300 meters away, so we'll go short range" or whatever. And then if the players say something, THEN you can worry about it. But if they don't care, why should you.

Gee you make it sound like the actual distances do have a part in the game. Be careful, that opinion won't win you many friends. Laugh