Bossk + VI/Adaptability: the modified PS is kept once the Hounds' Tooth is destroyed and Bossk is piloting the Nashtah Pup...

Technically, this means Bossk keep those upgrade cards.

Which is fair, because the Elite Pilot Skill is modifying the pilot and not the ship, so to speak.

But why stop here?

Why it was decided that he can't keep any other EPT?

Needless to say if Bossk could transfer an EPT that would help him generating crits, the Nashtah Pup would be useful after all?!

I don't get it.

Don't get me wrong.

Basically thats a start into the right direction.

I really want to want to use the title. Usually when starting lists with Bossk, my first upgrade card is the title - but then this is the first card to ditch because the tought that Bossk can't generate crits in the Nashtah Pup turns me down. This and the rules about the scoring.

TLDR:

Why we are not allowed to keep just any EPT upgrade card effect with the Nashtah Pup?

Because you're not really keeping the EPT in the case of VI or Adaptability.

I think (since I can't read the dev's minds I don't know for sure) that the logic is that the Pup looks at its "mothership" when it is destroyed and reads the Pilot Skill as it stands with modifiers. So in the example of Bossk, the Pup looks at Bossk, reads the Pilot Skill as 7 + 2, and runs with that. The actual EPT card itself is not transferred.

Because you're not really keeping the EPT in the case of VI or Adaptability.

...err, yes you are.

If Bossk draws an "Injured Pilot" crit, he'll lose the effects of the EPT card, and his pilot skill will revert to normal.

Which also begs the question - if Bossk draws an "Injured Pilot" crit while in the Hound's Tooth and loses his EPT, would that effect carry over to the Nashtah Pup?

(opens fresh can of worms, wriggling everywhere)

Because you're not really keeping the EPT in the case of VI or Adaptability.

I think (since I can't read the dev's minds I don't know for sure) that the logic is that the Pup looks at its "mothership" when it is destroyed and reads the Pilot Skill as it stands with modifiers. So in the example of Bossk, the Pup looks at Bossk, reads the Pilot Skill as 7 + 2, and runs with that. The actual EPT card itself is not transferred.

Keeping the modified pilot skill means you keep the card effect of VI or Adaptability.

This could have been done with any EPT upgrade card.

The upgrade card itself stays with the Tooth but Bossk could use the effect with the Pub.

I can understand that FFG want to push the title a bit because there is zero use for it. But thats just a bit too less.

Bossk need to be allowed to keep the effect of Calculation or Markmanship as well to make his ability trigger.

If he could keep the effect of any card I would consider:

Bossk, title, Predator: 44 points

Yeah, I honestly think that the Pup should keep the whole EPT, not just the PS effects. It's super lame that it doesn't, it's also super lame that you can put any mods on it.

It might have been worth taking if it worked like the Ghost/Phantom, but clearly they learned a lesson there.

Simply - Adaptability and VI raise the P.S. on your ship card - when you die - the P.S. that transfers to the Pup is the P.S. on your ship - that's why it stays...

As for damaged cockpit / injured pilot crits - I think somewhere in the rules it talked about discarding damage cards when a ship is destroyed - so those are likely discarded before the pup is deployed. At least - that would seem to be consistent with what we know.

Because you're not really keeping the EPT in the case of VI or Adaptability.

I think (since I can't read the dev's minds I don't know for sure) that the logic is that the Pup looks at its "mothership" when it is destroyed and reads the Pilot Skill as it stands with modifiers. So in the example of Bossk, the Pup looks at Bossk, reads the Pilot Skill as 7 + 2, and runs with that. The actual EPT card itself is not transferred.

In other words, it's not Bossk, it's a droid that thinks it's Bossk!

Or bossk forgets his Medal "High school Predator #1" on the control panel in a hurry xD

P.S. Actually Pup wasn't a Z in a sense-it was a two-man craft!

I agree pilot based ept should be transferable.

And the scoring rules hurt this ship too.

The ship shouldn't count for mov until after the pup is destroyed.

It's one of those edge-case buffs where you're keeping the PS, even if not the EPT that let it stay. It's a bit can-of-worms, but hey ho, it's an improvement, even if a lousy one.

I'd personally go for errata'ing the EPT to go with the pilot entirely - it'd make Bossk actually kinda tempting. Moreso if they patched the 'last ship on the table counts as a full win', but I get why they haven't.

Tricky, the spawnling is.

Everything hurts that ship

PS7 hurts

Big base hurts

red 2turns hurt!

no K-turn hurts!!11

TLTs HURT LIKE HELL!

P.S. Actually Pup wasn't a Z in a sense-it was a two-man craft!

This is why the Pup should be able to rescue a crew slot upgrade card in addition (to the EPT upgrade card)

So, what about Damaged Cockpit...

So, what about Damaged Cockpit...

as i said above - you discard damage cards when your ship is destroyed...

It's one of those edge-case buffs where you're keeping the PS, even if not the EPT that let it stay. It's a bit can-of-worms, but hey ho, it's an improvement, even if a lousy one.

I'd personally go for errata'ing the EPT to go with the pilot entirely - it'd make Bossk actually kinda tempting. Moreso if they patched the 'last ship on the table counts as a full win', but I get why they haven't.

Tricky, the spawnling is.

P.S. Actually Pup wasn't a Z in a sense-it was a two-man craft!

This is why the Pup should be able to rescue a crew slot upgrade card in addition (to the EPT upgrade card)

Yeah, I honestly think that the Pup should keep the whole EPT, not just the PS effects. It's super lame that it doesn't, it's also super lame that you can put any mods on it.

It might have been worth taking if it worked like the Ghost/Phantom, but clearly they learned a lesson there.

honestly, it doesn't matter what the pup keeps

its a 6 point card that does nothing until you die

in which case it poops out a sh*tty Z

so it still does nothing

honestly, it doesn't matter what the pup keeps

its a 6 point card that does nothing until you die

in which case it poops out a sh*tty Z

so it still does nothing

However I'm less concerned about that and I would rather see a change in mov for the pup upgrade.

The pup is 6 points for nothing unless your ship dies and even then it doesn't provide much. The rules should be amended so that the total hull of the pup is included for mov purposes at least then the 6 points are worth it.

Is it just bossk or any YV-666 pilot?

trick question (stupid question) none others have EPTS....

never seen em on board didnt know had to look.

Because you're not really keeping the EPT in the case of VI or Adaptability.

I think (since I can't read the dev's minds I don't know for sure) that the logic is that the Pup looks at its "mothership" when it is destroyed and reads the Pilot Skill as it stands with modifiers. So in the example of Bossk, the Pup looks at Bossk, reads the Pilot Skill as 7 + 2, and runs with that. The actual EPT card itself is not transferred.

Mux, Decoy, and Squad Leader should all probably cause the Pup to modify those PS modifications as well.

I'm for any buff to the Pup. I've never actually seen it used effectively. The one time I did run it I never lost Bossk. Haven't run it since.

I'm for any buff to the Pup. I've never actually seen it used effectively. The one time I did run it I never lost Bossk. Haven't run it since.

Same here. I even pulled a full stop in the last round, hoping my opponent would finish the Tooth off and I could deploy the Pup. Instead, he overshot, and got 4 dice in the rear.

So, what about Damaged Cockpit...

as i said above - you discard damage cards when your ship is destroyed...

(Rules Reference, "Destroying Ships")

The Nashtah Pup Pilot is deployed after you are destroyed, but before you are removed from the play area.

This therefore implies that Damaged Cockpit (PS 0) transfers its effect to the Nashtah Pup, because when the Pup is deployed, the PS of the Hound's Tooth pilot is still 0.

Likewise, Injured Pilot from the old deck would mean that when the Pup deploys, the corresponding Hound's Tooth pilot has no pilot ability to speak of.

Unless there's a ruling otherwise that I'm not seeing in the FAQ, this is an open-and-shut case of "the title isn't that great".

I agree it defiantly should transfer ANY pilot modifier, EPT, damage card, etc. However, that still doesn't 'fix' the pup. It is really just way too expensive right now. For half the price of a permanent Z it is really hard to ever drop into a build now, even though I always WANT to.

To fix the pup have it so any pilot modifier transfers and have it so the hounds tooth includes the pup for mov and shop destroyed purposes. That will make the ship more competitve not amazing but much more viable. I'm ok with pilot damage cards transferring as well since that gives the damage deck more relevance. It will still be a limited ship with the best thing going for it being a tank with a large forward arc.

I legitimately hate that FFG has done everything in their power to make The Hound's Tooth as un-viable as possible in competitive play. It's a fun card, it's a card that can actually help win games, but the MoV ruling on it alone completely neuters it.

If:

• Bossk could keep any EPT
• MoV demanded you finish off the Pup to get the final half of the YV-666's points

Do that, and The Hound's Tooth is now worth considering for more than fun, casual games with friends.

Agree with the above. It's not a bad ship just bad rules regarding its title.