So, with all this commotion with the Radical's Handbook I've been kicking around an idea for a radical campaign. It would be based around a radical Xenos inquisitor, who joins the Tau Empire, and he, along with his acolytes, becomes the personal agent, as well as pet project, of an Ethereal. My initial thought is that the Ethereal would be ruler over a planet, sept, or cadre, and is testing to see how effective such a system would work inside the Tau Empire. Probably in the beginning the Inquisitor wouldn't be trusted with any Tau resources, but as time passes, they would earn technology, and even new troops (career paths/races). Also, more than likely, the Fire Caste wouldn't terribly trust this new agent of The Tau'va. I'm curious as to what you guys think about this set up. What sort of unique missions/situations might the acolytes find themselves in?

Oh, and I'm aware that there are those of you out there who believe the Tau are nothing more then Japanese, space hippies, with no real internal problems, and no chance with external problems. I'd ask those of you who this applies to, to refrain from clogging the thread with your comments, as I'm trying to develop a campaign, not enter a pissing contest. Thank you.

Genestealer infestation could be real problem for the Tau - the Imperium has a lot of expereince in recognising and rooting these out.

We know that the Genestealers have infected Tau - for instance in the novel " For the Emperor " and the infected were taken back to Tau space.

Also given that they are trying to make/obtain better Warp drives - they could have some rather nasty accidents if they work too well............

There is also teh plot that the Tau think the Inquisitor is a radical renegade but actually he or she is infiltrating the empire (or one or more of his/her retinue are)

I think the last is very true. More than likely I'd had a Shas'O who thinks just that, and has it out for the inquisitor. Of course he would not disobey the Ethereal's orders but if one of the acolytes were approached by an inquisitor still doing his duty, and gets caught, that'd likely give the Shas'O a lot more reason to, take the initiative we'll say.

As for the genestealers, I think that's always a good territory to work with, ecspecially with the Tau since there's so little to go off of from the books. A GM could take a lot of liberty coming up with developements. Afterall, the Tau aren't psychicly immune, only extremely resistant. So a genestealer cult might need to come up with new methods to expand and develope.

Good ideas all. There is also the very real possibility of having to deal with the machinations of said Inquisitor's former allies in the Ordo Xenos. The acolytes might very well find themselves dodging assassins and kill squads, among other things. In fact, the big "I" might even use your Inquisitor's defection as an excuse to orchestrate a new crusade, right on top of his new Tau friends' heads.

Definately a good call. Old associates would be all the more reason for the Fire Caste to disapprove of the Inquisitor, and makes for great missions. It also makes for some good moral dilemas. (Is choice important enough to risk everything for?) Hated on almost all sides, fire coming from unexpected as well as the usual places...sounds like a good environement for a campaign to me. I'm really surprised I didn't remember the Inquisition's reaction to the defection. I repeat, good call.

I don't think Tau are manga-styled Space Communists, even if my Tau are painted in Communist green colors... but I would find it difficult to see how an Ethereal would deal with an Inquisitor, let alone need one for his cadre. Why would an Inquisitor, who carries the full weight of the God-Emperor of Mankind, choose to serve an Ethereal? Why would an Ethereal, who has almost complete mind-control over even the most battle-hardened Fire Warriors, have any need for a potentially threatening Human?

Would an Inquisitor accept the Greater Good as his or her salvation, and deny the God-Emperor of Mankind? Why? What does an Inquisitor stand to gain? Tau are basically blunts, and have no real interest for a psychic Inquisitor as compared to committing heresy with the Eldar or the Infernal powers. And in terms of techno-heresy, Mankind has forgotten far more technological wonders than the Tau currently possess, so why not pursue the techno-heresies of Mankind's past?

I think a renegade Shas'O is more likely of an ally for an Inquisitor. Surely Commander Farsight, with his renegade forces & Gue'vesa auxilia, would be more likely to treat an Inquisitor with due respect & more likely to find a real use for such a powerful ally. An Ethereal would be a far more likely enemy of someone with inquisitor-grade power.

Anyway, Farsight is more likely to need Commissar-style Inquisitors to weed out those who retain irrational fear of the Mont'au from the ranks of his Fire warriors. Farsight might need help with the Gue'vesa & any other auxiliary forces. And Farsight wouldn't necessarily require the Inquisitor to swear allegiance to the Greater Good, allowing an Inquisitor to be Radical without going full Heretic by denouncing the God-Emperor.

cliff racer said:

It should be remembered that Shas'O is the highest rank in the Tau military, equivalent to a Lord-General of the Imperial Guard in many ways; they aren't common by any stretch of the imagination (consider that their Water Caste equivalent, the Por'O, are essentially of equal rank to Lord Admirals of the Imperial Navy). Farsight's defection shouldn't necessarily be taken as precedent for such high-ranking Tau being likely defectors, but more as an exception to the rule. A Shas'Vre (junior officer rank, similar to Lieutenant, assuming Shas'ui is a sergeant-equivalent) or Shas'El (senior officer rank, close to Captain or Colonel by Imperial Guard standards) would be more likely by comparison, being more numerous and not having demonstrated decades of devotion to the Tau'va.

Milova said:

Glad I could contribute. And ... please pass on my condolences to the families of your player-characters.

Am I the only one that can't stand this idea?

First, no Inquisitor would join the Tau. I don't care how radical he might be, it just wouldn't happen. The only thing that might cause an Inquisitor to turn from the Imperium is the promise of power or knowledge greater than what he already has. The Tau can offer neither.

Second, the Tau, while possibly accepting the Inquisitor into their empire for the Greater Good, wouldn't give him any kind of real authority or power. They would happily take advantage of any knowledge he might have, but that's about the extent of it.

Finally, chances are, if he did join the Tau, he wouldn't survive very long. The Imperium wouldn't rest until he and his acolytes were dead. A steady stream of Calidus assassins would put a serious crimp in the campaign.

In general, I really encourage people to try and stick with the spirit of 40k when dealing with aliens. If you want the players to be buddy buddy with non-humans play Star Wars or something. If you want to play 40k roleplay then embrace the fluff and stop trying to make it into something it isn't.

Atheosis said:

IMO It is possible an Inquisitor could be involved with the Tau for any /all fo the following reasons:

He or she sees the Tau as a useful bullwark against the Hive Fleets, Orks and Necrons in their area of space and hopes to focuss their attention on these threats protecting the Imperium - perhaps some sort of Ordo Xenos liasion against the greater threat (of course its likely that he or she wil care little for the Xenos in reality but they could be a useful tool/weapon/sacrifice - even the remarkably pleasent Amberley Vail had no qualms about sending genestealer infected Tau home to try and divert the Hive fleet.)

A radical Inquisitor could seek sanctuary (hopefully having covered his tracks) exchanging his knowledge for security. It would also give him the opportunity to perhaps try out these new technology/rituals/weapons.............

Spying was a reason I mentioned earlier. As Sister Cat sugegsted - it could be that a new Crusade is planned and either the Inquisitor is preparing the way or consideres that Imperiums resources are better used elsewhere.

Whether the Imperium chase after him or her would depend on if they knew what he was doing, where he was and how much resources they wanted to expend..............

the outline camapign can still be "40K" by making the reasons and motivations murky on both sides, especially if the Retinue get dragged along to Xenos space for unknown reasons and have to interact with them on their Master's or Mistresses orders. It could be an interesting campaign.

The Imperium does deal with Xenos races on occassion if not through choice and a human "renegade" is likely ot get a better reception from the Tau than say the Eldar - although of course all Xenos have their own agendas................

Atheosis said:

I'm not going to argue with you over the validity of the idea. It is, and that will not change. I will however say that a degree of calm might be required in this istance. Afterall chief, it's a game. Just a game. The setting is great, and I love it, but it is still just a game. Plus, Dark Heresy is an iteration of that game that states very clearly, and you'll have excuse my paraphrasing, here's how things are, but feel free to change whatever you like to fit your needs. To this you might respond that there's a limit to how much to can stretch the setting. I respond to said hypothetical rebuttal, it's a game, get over it.

The great thing about the Warhammer 40,000 setting and the Dark Heresy rule set is that it's so open ended. There are limitless variations to the game and setting. In fact I recal a game master not to terribly long ago sharing his campaign of noir on a 1930's equivilent Imperial world that has all but forgotten anything having to do with the Imperium. And his players had a good time. If I so felt inclined, I could have my acolytes come across the Jedi Council, Dr. Who, or Kamen Rider Decade. To which you might respond, THAT'S NOT 40K! And I repeat, it's just a game. Get over it. Game masters can change whatever they like so that they and their players can have fun. That's how it is, that's how it's always been, that's how it shall always be. Get over it.

I would also like to take the time to point something out for your previous post. If one is to presume that you hold the purity of the background in such high esteem, I find it curious that you refer to it in such a derogitory term as "fluff", a term created by players of the table top games who felt that the game could be entirely enjoyed based soley on the strategic aspect of the game itself and all the inventive stories the creators came up with were uneccesary "fluff".

Lastly, if you must do try to be constructive, and help find ways that I can achieve the atmosphere I'm going for. If you find yourself incapable to doing this, I would have to ask that you use self constraint and refrain from dragging down my post with pointless arguing. Thank you.

*a warm applaud for Milova* It's your story, you tell it as you and your players like it.

Milova said:

I'm perfectly calm. I'm simply voicing my dislike for the concept. You're free to do what you want, but certain ideas really start moving away from the spirit of 40k and this is one of those. Personally I don't care if you have the whole party paint themselves green and join a Waaagh, but if you're going to post something like this on a public forum you should expect criticism. That's the way these things work. As far as me being constructive I was trying to be. As in I was trying to explain that you were going against the spirit of the setting. Obviously in the end you can do whatever you want. By the way, the term fluff really isn't derogitory anymore.

Atheosis said:

Then I disagree with your definition, and would ask you not to attempt to coerce me futher.

Atheosis said:

I've always preferred the term "lore" myself.

At any rate perhaps this little sidetrack does open up some valid questions. Originally I didn't intend to give a reason for the inquisitor's defection, as I was more testing the waters to see what sort of adventures the acolytes would be able to have in that set up. Yet, I suppose the conditions in which the Inquisitor arrives in the Tau Empire would likely affect what sort of adventures could be had afterward.

The idea was already presented that he's putting up a front, only laying the groundwork for the Emperor's wrath which is on it's. This is certainly a viable option, as it requires the least amount of explanation, at least on the human side of it. This would mean much less interference from the Imperium, but would require at least some to keep up appearences.

Another option that I thought up, was a situation that would be a fusion of Eisenhorn and Robert E. Lee. An Inquisitor who has spent his whole life and career helping to purify his homeworld grows to love it far more than an Inquisitor should. So much so in fact, that his first step down the road of the radical was when he learned of a Xeno-tolerant noble who was in-line to become the Planetary Governor. By all means he should have been executed, however, the man was quite competant and would indeed solve a great many problems on the planet. Our inquisitor made the mistake of choosing his homeworld over the Emperor, and allowed the man to take power. Thus began a long trail, of similar choices, in which the inquisitor chose to defend his people rather than dispense with the harsh justice of the Golden Throne. Yet, all the while, he justifies it to himself. Deluding himself to believe his every choice is correct and pious. Until the day comes that the world stands on the brink. The Imperium all but turns its back on the insignificant ball of rock that can't meet its tithe, but the Tau are more than happy to turn their trading partnership into something more permanent. The world aligns with the Tau, leaving the inquisitor with a choice. Destroy everything he loves dear, or turn his back on everything he's sworn to uphold? He choses the prior. The resulting conflict brings about the unquestioning destruction of the planet. Perhaps as extreme as Exterminatus. This leaves our inquisitor very confused and full of hate. The Imperium, crushed his beloved homeworld, which was so fragile and bretrayed. He is homeless say for the Greater Good that the Ethereal offers him. Salvation through the greater good, or self-destruction through despair...

Atheosis said:

Depends on who you ask. I'm reliably informed that it remains a banned term in the Games Workshop Design Studio, for example.

Milova said:

Coerce:

1. to compel by force, intimidation, or authority, esp. without regard for individual desire or volition: They coerced him into signing the document.
2. to bring about through the use of force or other forms of compulsion; exact: to coerce obedience.
3. to dominate or control, esp. by exploiting fear, anxiety, etc.: The state is based on successfully coercing the individual.

How exactly was I doing any of the above?

N0-1_H3r3 said:

All the more reason to keep using it.

*hand to face*

Very well, convince. Dropping not related conversation now...

As I said last:

At any rate perhaps this little sidetrack does open up some valid questions. Originally I didn't intend to give a reason for the inquisitor's defection, as I was more testing the waters to see what sort of adventures the acolytes would be able to have in that set up. Yet, I suppose the conditions in which the Inquisitor arrives in the Tau Empire would likely affect what sort of adventures could be had afterward.

The idea was already presented that he's putting up a front, only laying the groundwork for the Emperor's wrath which is on it's. This is certainly a viable option, as it requires the least amount of explanation, at least on the human side of it. This would mean much less interference from the Imperium, but would require at least some to keep up appearences.

Another option that I thought up, was a situation that would be a fusion of Eisenhorn and Robert E. Lee. An Inquisitor who has spent his whole life and career helping to purify his homeworld grows to love it far more than an Inquisitor should. So much so in fact, that his first step down the road of the radical was when he learned of a Xeno-tolerant noble who was in-line to become the Planetary Governor. By all means he should have been executed, however, the man was quite competant and would indeed solve a great many problems on the planet. Our inquisitor made the mistake of choosing his homeworld over the Emperor, and allowed the man to take power. Thus began a long trail, of similar choices, in which the inquisitor chose to defend his people rather than dispense with the harsh justice of the Golden Throne. Yet, all the while, he justifies it to himself. Deluding himself to believe his every choice is correct and pious. Until the day comes that the world stands on the brink. The Imperium all but turns its back on the insignificant ball of rock that can't meet its tithe, but the Tau are more than happy to turn their trading partnership into something more permanent. The world aligns with the Tau, leaving the inquisitor with a choice. Destroy everything he loves dear, or turn his back on everything he's sworn to uphold? He choses the prior. The resulting conflict brings about the unquestioning destruction of the planet. Perhaps as extreme as Exterminatus. This leaves our inquisitor very confused and full of hate. The Imperium, crushed his beloved homeworld, which was so fragile and bretrayed. He is homeless say for the Greater Good that the Ethereal offers him. Salvation through the greater good, or self-destruction through despair...

Milova said:

Nice. But here's my problem with that scenario. When it became apparent that an entire Imperial world went over to the Tau ... to Xenos ... I would think that in addition to punishing/purifying the planet, that there would likely be a full Inquisitorial investigation. And, I would think that if they were worth their salt, they would uncover your Inquisitor's complicity. At that point, unless he and his acolytes are far, far away, I expect there would be extreme retribution on a more individual scale.

Of course, if that's the road you want this campaign to travel, then by all means do. But the Inquisition and the Empire of Man have resources that don't normally even appear in Dark Heresy, because of the insane power level - like Temple Assassins, as someone else mentioned in another thread. Such a campaign would, and probably should, be extremely lethal. Hmmm ... however, once we see Ascension, that might be a more appropriate setting, or at least rules-set, for such a game.

In any case, these are just my thoughts on it. Have fun with it any way you like.

I've skipped over all but the first few posts here, hope that doesn't cause too many problems for anyone. Feel free to ignore these words if they're too irritating.

Okay, the Tau and the Inquisition. Well, less-see....

- Each having a fascination for the other, and the problems/suspicions this would arouse.

Inquisition on Tau; these aliens are all but without internal problems or power struggles, are a race apparently completely lacking in psychic potential, with a history of succesful integration of Alien races.

First Tau codex, I believe, detailed some attempts to capture an Ethereal for dissection, in order to find out how he/they manipulated the race. Imagine being able to harness that power! Not only the eventual ability to this within thier own race, but the ability to take over and suborn the Tau and all allies of such, possibly covertly.

Lack of psychic/psykers: is this a strength or a weakness? How is this possible? Have they become tools of those not similarily lacking, and/or are these 'Ethereals' a sub-race of psykers bound to some higher power ala Imperial soulbinding, using thier now 'safe' powers to control the rest of thier species?

Integration of (other) Xenos: How can we learn from this? Are they harbouring any races deemed to be too dangerous to let live, or those with distinct anti-Imperial leanings?

The Greator Good: How can we take elements from this apparently succesful concept and incorperate it into the Imperial Faith? Is it possible to convert them through said incorporation, as we the Imperium have done with countless other cultures?

Tau on Inquisition; this race/Empire continues to exist and occasionaly thrive. seemingly in spite of itself. Are these 'daemons' we hear of real, or mere rumoured threats to keep us from harnessing this 'Warp' resource? Do we require a similar organisation to this Inquisition to police those under our rule that do not accept the way of the Greator Good?

Whoa, crap. Work's almost out, and I've got many RL things to be taking care of before then. Sorry, will pop in again later!

For starters I must say that I'm not a great fan of Tau race and would have lived happily if it was never developed at all... However, speaking on broader concept I do not find it impossible that an radical Inquisitor could, with his cadre, join forces with xenos and live to tell the tale. Simply the Empire is too large, too fragmented and communications are too unreliable for Empire to react instantly to every Inquisitors strange ideas. Thats part of the setting.

I'll illustrate:

Mr. Radical Inquisitor (Mr. RI hereafter) decides to join forces with xenos... How long does it take before it is noticed? Well, Inquisitors have a huge leeway in their actions. If Ordo Xenos Inquisitor wants to go to Xenospace no-one will question him. The first warning that something is "not right" with Mr. RI might come several months or even years after he has already joined xenos. After all, its not like Empire has a real-time omniscient spy-network in xenospace. Lets assume that a Rogue Trader notices Mr. RI 6 months after and decides to report it to Imperial authorities.

The Rogue Traders ship happens to have access to astropath (almost miraculously they have one) and sends a message to Inquisitor high lord. The message is instant, but interpreting it takes several weeks. Inquistor High Lord pulls all recent iformation on Mr. RI and starts his own investigation. After six months he comes to the conclusion that Mr. RI has stepped out of line and must be excommunicated and terminated. However, Mr. RI location in xenospace is not known and last information on it is several months old. Inquisitor High Lord uses his astropath to send a message to Officio Assassinorum, asking them to send an assassin to track Mr. RI and do preliminary intelligence on possible hit. It takes Officio Assassinorum two weeks to interpret the message and another two to get hold of the nearest Callidus assassin who has previous experience on this particular xeno species.

Callidus assassin spends two months to get him/herself up to date with the latest intel on the xenos and another three to get to the area of operation. It takes him/her three months to infiltrate high enough into xenos to start tracking and maybe another three to find Mr. RI. At this point Mr. RI has been working with xenos for over two years but Imperium has managed to set up a Callidus assassin near Mr. RI watching his every move.

The first reports from Callidus assassin arrive to Inquisitor High Lord, making it absolutely sure that Mr. RI has stepped over the line. Inquisitor High Lord contacts High Lords of Terra with application to use the set up assassin to terminate Mr. RI... Now High Lords have several options:

1) Feed wrong information to Mr RI and his xeno xompanions by strating to regulate the information he gets from Imperium

2) Contact Mr. RI, tell him that he is under the gun and try to coerce him to spy on his xenos to save his life

3) Pull the plug on the fun, give the kill command and pray to emperor the Callidus assassin succeeds because they really have only one chance... If it fails the xenos will certainly make sure Mr. RI vanishes from their sights again and finding him in xenospace once he knows he is hunted by Temple Assassins might take literally decades.

Once High lords make their decision there is still the little problem of actually communicating the kill-command to the assassin in site... After all s/he is deep undercover in xenospace.

No matter how fast Imperium acts and how serious threat they consider Mr. RI to be the huge distances, the sparcity of communication between xenos and Imperium and the peculiar nature of astropath communications together with the inertia of the Imperial bureaucracy would guarantee that it will take years before there is a realistic chance of Mr. RI meeting an imperial Assassin in person for the last time in his life. Even if the Imperium would decide to use their best resources to kill Mr RI (which IMO is nowhere near certain) there is still enough time for GM to play out a full-scale DH campaign set in xenospace.

Polaria said:

And I agree with you. However, in the latest iteration of Milova's plot, the Inquisitor in question isn't going to Xeno-space to work with the aliens. Rather, he is working within Imperial space, on an Imperial planet that ends up getting handed to the Tau without a single shot fired or alarm sounded. I assume this planet does not exist in a vaccuum, that it is one planet in a system, or sub-sector, and has various merchant and transport ships coming and going on a regular basis. Someone is going to notice and report it, possibly quite a few someones. So, while I grant you, this RI and his acolytes will have a few months, maybe even a few years, and that is more than enough time to run the campaign ... we all like to think on the basis of the continuity of our characters and campaigns. And while there is a good chance that any DH campaign ends in bloody smears, this one just seems set up to do so. I'm not even saying that it is a bad thing. Only that I and my players likely would not enjoy it as much as some others. But as I already told Milova, if that's the kind of campaign he and his players want, then I'm all for it. In the end, it's all about you and your fellow players having fun with it.

Sister Cat said:

Well, in his own campaign every GM is well above all gods and can do whatever he likes with the world, settings and characters. So, if Tau handled Inquisitor is what he wants, then thats what he does. I just find it hard enough to fit the whole concept into my mind as a working idea, but that is mostly because I hate Tau. They are just too hello-kitty-anime-aliens to fit into my vision of the WH40K. Anyway, reading again a bit on the minutes of Tau (yes, it hurts me) a few scenario ideas come into mind:

- As a non-psychic race with extremely limited contact with Warp the Tau must be considerably ignorant on the warp-spawns, demons and such. Still, even their method of of warp-skipping travel isn't absolutely safe and when a demonic presence or a warp creature does get aboard of their craft they aren't usually prepared to identify or combat such a menace. True, Tau, themselves seem immune to possession and demonic influence, but that doesn't mean the pincer-claws of a Demonette or the hellblades of Bloodletters wouldn't cut through their armor... Actually even better than human equivalent, since Tau don't have warded, ancinet artifact armors and faith to protect them.

- Genestealers are always a threat and as Tau are still certainly biological organisms the Great Devourer will find a way to corrupt them somehow... and unability to detect psykers also means unability to detect when and where a hivemind has set its eyes.

Polaria said:

I understand. Even though I am relatively new to the WH40K universe, I also find the Tau somehow ... un-40K-ish.

But, to each his own, I guess.

Sister Cat said:

In universe where all other races are either straight-out corrupted pawns of demons or simply fighting tooh and nail to survive against increasingly hostile universe filled with demonic forces a "too-holy-for-hat", altruistic race somehow completely immune to all warp-influences just seems... lame.

I guess a good GM could still make it work in Dark Heresy setting, though... In some really creepy, Paranoia-Prisoner-Communist-Brainwashers kind of way

Which gives me yet another scenario idea:

- Acolytes run into a battalion of Gue'vesa Auxiliary troops and find out that they have been literally brainwashed (think Branch Davidian cultists) into submissive state, completely lacking free will and intent on "converting" the acolytes next. Now thats something to bake their noodles... As inquisitorial agents and human beings their first reaction would probably be very negative towards the Gue'vesa cultists and their brainwashers, but what if that is the real secret how Tau inspire such loyalty in their human helpers and the Tau masters the acolytes themselves are wolrking for find nothing wrong with it? Now that would be some real DH-style horror