14 pages? Are you kidding me?

14 pages? Are you kidding me?

Yeah......

And yet, FFG encourages a competitive tournament circuit, with Regionals and Worlds.

And it doesn't matter that you view it as a casual game. The size of the game has far outstripped a "keep it casual" approach.

But the variable aspects of the game have not.

Also... what's top prize at Worlds? A play mat, a trophy, and the chance to design a card? Sounds pretty casual to me...

Same as Netrunner. Doesn't change the fact that the game has outgrown a casual approach to tournaments due to the size of the tournaments.

And yet, FFG encourages a competitive tournament circuit, with Regionals and Worlds.

And it doesn't matter that you view it as a casual game. The size of the game has far outstripped a "keep it casual" approach.

But the variable aspects of the game have not.

Also... what's top prize at Worlds? A play mat, a trophy, and the chance to design a card? Sounds pretty casual to me...

Same as Netrunner. Doesn't change the fact that the game has outgrown a casual approach to tournaments due to the size of the tournaments.

Size has nothing to do with whither it is a casual event or not. I go to the springs every summer, where thousands of people are swimming. Are we serious/pro swimmers now because of our numbers?

No, but clearly, as this situation shows, judges may need a little bit more guidance.

And yet, FFG encourages a competitive tournament circuit, with Regionals and Worlds.

And it doesn't matter that you view it as a casual game. The size of the game has far outstripped a "keep it casual" approach.

But the variable aspects of the game have not.

Also... what's top prize at Worlds? A play mat, a trophy, and the chance to design a card? Sounds pretty casual to me...

Same as Netrunner. Doesn't change the fact that the game has outgrown a casual approach to tournaments due to the size of the tournaments.

Size has nothing to do with whither it is a casual event or not. I go to the springs every summer, where thousands of people are swimming. Are we serious/pro swimmers now because of our numbers?

Oh boy! Free dice!

And yet, FFG encourages a competitive tournament circuit, with Regionals and Worlds.

And it doesn't matter that you view it as a casual game. The size of the game has far outstripped a "keep it casual" approach.

But the variable aspects of the game have not.

Also... what's top prize at Worlds? A play mat, a trophy, and the chance to design a card? Sounds pretty casual to me...

Same as Netrunner. Doesn't change the fact that the game has outgrown a casual approach to tournaments due to the size of the tournaments.

Size has nothing to do with whither it is a casual event or not. I go to the springs every summer, where thousands of people are swimming. Are we serious/pro swimmers now because of our numbers?

Maybe a lifeguard would require additonal training in what to look for in a crowd like that. I'm saying this independent of my experience, just playing devil's advocate to the metaphor!

If I'm not mistaken, FFG does require more from the TOs at Worlds.

As a TO, I personally love the idea of a field guide for TOs from FFG. There is only so much they will be able to do because of the varied nature of this game. There are only so many ways you can play a card in a card game. The moving parts of this game, however, are not precise. Because of this, things MUST be kept at a casual level and TOs must be able to handle unique issues that no FAQ or Rule Book could ever cover. The TO isn't even needed in the game of X-wing. There is already a mechanic in place to solve disputes among players. The TO is there for the occasion that players cannot solve problems themselves and they wish to give all mediation authority to an outside judge.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying get rid of the TOs. I'm just stating they should be looked at for what they are. And this game should be playing inside of its limitations. Which is why the community suggests to...

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

lol - what are the prizes at those tournaments?

Must be really good to waste that many resources on a game.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

And if this every happens in the areas I play X-wing...

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

that sounds incredibly boring... have you tried using FFG's auto dice simulator? I bet it would be like that.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

And if this every happens in the areas I play X-wing...

You're one of those players that turns into a pouty baby when the TO is called over or he's denied a missed trigger, right?

TO: "Please just use these new dice. It isn't that we're saying that we believe you're cheating; we simply need to get the tournament back on track as quickly as we can, and this is the fastest way to do it."

At this point, if there's a bad guy, it's the accuser.

PLAYER: "I am being singled out, and I feel insulted. I refuse to use your dice, because I'm not a cheater and I shouldn't have to prove that."

At this point, and only at this point, would it cross my mind, " ... Huh. Maybe there's something to this. 'Cause that's a strange reaction."

This isn't a criminal situation. The stakes are minimal. You don't have the right to due process, including the right to an attorney. Acting like it's a bigger deal than it is is weird. It started out weird just on the accuser's side, and a reasonable player would behave in a way that kept it there. An unreasonable player ... wouldn't.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

And if this every happens in the areas I play X-wing...

You're one of those players that turns into a pouty baby when the TO is called over or he's denied a missed trigger, right?

So.... you haven't read anything, have you? lol

It's been made clear that OP was given three choices: keep using his own dice, use new ones, or share dice with his next opponent. This seems pretty fair to me. I would have said **** the haters and kept using my dice instead of complaining about it afterwards.

It does not take very many over competitive, obsessive players to degrade the tournament experience for everyone. I am already seeing stuff at local tournaments that reminds me of very early days Magic the Gathering tournaments and 40K tournaments with controversies and players having emotional meltdowns.

The fact that a TO can actually compete in a store tournament really shows that x-wing tournaments are based on a very strange philosophy of how a competition needs to be run.

My own, anecdotal, but long term observations of two decades of playing in 40k and whfb tournaments has led me to conclude that the 40k tournaments were always more fractious because the 40k players were much more invested in the 40k background and hyper interested in it compared to the fantasy background. Based on what you can hear on podcasts and what is written in abundance here there is a segment of the player base that is obssessed with star wars, x wing, and with tournament play and worried about all manner of scheduling details, store limits on participation due to size, scheduling etc.

I think some people are taking x-wing, far, far too seriously and devolving what should be a fun tournament experience into a chore.

TO: "Please just use these new dice. It isn't that we're saying that we believe you're cheating; we simply need to get the tournament back on track as quickly as we can, and this is the fastest way to do it."

At this point, if there's a bad guy, it's the accuser.

PLAYER: "I am being singled out, and I feel insulted. I refuse to use your dice, because I'm not a cheater and I shouldn't have to prove that."

At this point, and only at this point, would it cross my mind, " ... Huh. Maybe there's something to this. 'Cause that's a strange reaction."

This isn't a criminal situation. The stakes are minimal. You don't have the right to due process, including the right to an attorney. Acting like it's a bigger deal than it is is weird. It started out weird just on the accuser's side, and a reasonable player would behave in a way that kept it there. An unreasonable player ... wouldn't.

This. Dice are dice are dice. Who cares if they are the dice you brought to a tournament?

It does not take very many over competitive, obsessive players to degrade the tournament experience for everyone...

...or people with an axe to grind, for that matter.

That kind of stuff is way easier to say on the internet.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

This is only somewhat surprising. The Chinese culture emphasizes values and virtues differently (as all cultures do), but honesty is not viewed in the same way as it is in other typically Western cultures. Knock-Off product manufacturing (and, in gaming, counterfeit gaming card printing like Pokemon and MtG), scientific retractions, alleged cheating in the Olympics, and plagiarism scandals involving university elite have a slightly higher incidence. Chinese students abroad often struggle with plagiarism. There is a lot of cultural-comparison literature out there, including lay sources like Forbes.

Thus, it's perhaps not as surprising that a tournament in China would have a more vigilant method in place to prevent against untrue dice. I'd be far more surprised to hear about such a practice in another country, anyways. It is surprising that tournaments can apparently afford dice towers and dedicated third-party dice-rollers, as that part sounds a little-far fetched and raises some questions.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

Screw that noise. I would refuse to participate in such a goofy tournament scene.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

And if this every happens in the areas I play X-wing...

You're one of those players that turns into a pouty baby when the TO is called over or he's denied a missed trigger, right?

Annnddddd.....Welcome to my ignore list, Para Goomba!

It's been made clear that OP was given three choices: keep using his own dice, use new ones, or share dice with his next opponent. This seems pretty fair to me. I would have said **** the haters and kept using my dice instead of complaining about it afterwards.

Personally I would have opted to share dice. I might have chosen to use provided dice if I got to keep them afterward for my trouble though.

I once met a Chinese guy at a store tourney in Scotland wo told me that at the tournaments he attends in Shanghai, they don't even let you *roll* the dice let alone use your own. Apparently each table has someone who observes and uses a dice tower on behalf of both players.

And if this every happens in the areas I play X-wing...

You're one of those players that turns into a pouty baby when the TO is called over or he's denied a missed trigger, right?

Annnddddd.....Welcome to my ignore list, Para Goomba!

Works for me. As more of my opponents don't hear my arguments, the easier it is for me to rant unopposed.