23 points ouch. I was hoping 20-22 you know B-wing range but this is a lot more than a B-wing. Sorry Scum players, you are getting jipped.

How is 20 points "B-Wing Range" but 23 points isn't? The generic Mist Hunters are only a point higher than the equivalent B-Wing and have an extra point of PS. The higher PS generic Mist Hunter even gets an EPT slot.

So if I'm reading the Dual Upgrade rules correctly, there's nothing stopping me from changing which side I use between games in a tournament, is there? It's the same point cost and name, so I'm not changing my build at all. These types of upgrades could act as a sort of sideboard. Shooting first going to be important? Use the +1 PS side. Want to position first? Use the -1 PS side.

23 points ouch. I was hoping 20-22 you know B-wing range but this is a lot more than a B-wing. Sorry Scum players, you are getting jipped.

I'm just going to go ahead and assume this is a joke.

So if I'm reading the Dual Upgrade rules correctly, there's nothing stopping me from changing which side I use between games in a tournament, is there? It's the same point cost and name, so I'm not changing my build at all. These types of upgrades could act as a sort of sideboard. Shooting first going to be important? Use the +1 PS side. Want to position first? Use the -1 PS side.

This is potentially a really big deal. Vader at 8 to shoot after his friends to land that crit or at PS10 to hunt Soontir.

And it's a meaningful plus to PS over the B-wing. (And because of the EPT, it can be +2 to PS!)

This ship (generics and otherwise) is completely viable out of the gate.

Sometimes I just don't understand folks ...

And it's a meaningful plus to PS over the B-wing. (And because of the EPT, it can be +2 to PS!)

This ship (generics and otherwise) is completely viable out of the gate.

Sometimes I just don't understand folks ...

I'm really looking forward to seeing the effect that the range one circle of stress around 4-LOM has.

And it's a meaningful plus to PS over the B-wing. (And because of the EPT, it can be +2 to PS!)

This ship (generics and otherwise) is completely viable out of the gate.

Sometimes I just don't understand folks ...

I'm really looking forward to seeing the effect that the range one circle of stress around 4-LOM has.

A little like an automatic Mara Jade, I think. It matches up pretty well against anything with PTL, and against anything that depends on maneuvering but doesn't have an A-wing/Interceptor/Adv Prototype dial.

And it's a meaningful plus to PS over the B-wing. (And because of the EPT, it can be +2 to PS!)

This ship (generics and otherwise) is completely viable out of the gate.

Sometimes I just don't understand folks ...

And it's a meaningful plus to PS over the B-wing. (And because of the EPT, it can be +2 to PS!)

This ship (generics and otherwise) is completely viable out of the gate.

Sometimes I just don't understand folks ...

Today's ships are not considered viable unless they have three attack dice, three evade dice, five hull, five shields, boost, barrel roll, focus, evade, a turret slot, an EPT, and extra large cup holders for 25 points.

All I said was I don't think the generics will catch on for a while. And I could be totally wrong! But right now generics are struggling across the board, and these can't carry TLT or ordnance.

I like the ship! I'm buying three! I just doubt we'll be seeing them spammed the way Daggers and Blues were in Wave 3.

It has a crew slot so GONK! Scum shield regen.

Yes!!! 2x Freelancer+FCS and 2x BS Enforcer here I come!

All I said was I don't think the generics will catch on for a while. And I could be totally wrong! But right now generics are struggling across the board, and these can't carry TLT or ordnance.

I like the ship! I'm buying three! I just doubt we'll be seeing them spammed the way Daggers and Blues were in Wave 3.

I think the big thing going on for these guys in the ability to take an Evade. Even with only 1 Agility, that evade means (a) it is unlikely Spam-TLT can kill one before they shoot twice; (b) it is unlikely that two hard-hitting missiles take one out, even if it rolls no evades.

I think we'll see generics right from the get-go. The comparison with B-wings is apt ... right up until the really important stuff.

All I said was I don't think the generics will catch on for a while. And I could be totally wrong! But right now generics are struggling across the board, and these can't carry TLT or ordnance.

I like the ship! I'm buying three! I just doubt we'll be seeing them spammed the way Daggers and Blues were in Wave 3.

I think the big thing going on for these guys in the ability to take an Evade. Even with only 1 Agility, that evade means (a) it is unlikely Spam-TLT can kill one before they shoot twice; (b) it is unlikely that two hard-hitting missiles take one out, even if it rolls no evades.

I think we'll see generics right from the get-go. The comparison with B-wings is apt ... right up until the really important stuff.

My favorite difference is the dial. White 3 banks and 4k vs 2k. This thing can hustle a little better than the B.

Holy ****

Finally a 2 points for 2 PS + ept

Damnit ffg, you could've learned that for the TAPs too

It's a B-wing when no one is playing B-wings. I don't see this ship getting much usage with the new meta upcoming.

Sable Gryphon said exactly the same on the latest podcast. Basically dead on arrival. I find that sad as it's such a unique looking ship. But then I've been flying a dual Black 8 Punisher list in league lately, so I'll probably love it.

It kills me that SableGryphon, noted advocate of chalky star elephants and TIE Bomber squads at Worlds, is already naysaying a ship before it's even officially released.

I heard this from the Scum and Vil Podcast that all the kids dislike it. I know its poo pooing but its still the truth.

So it appears Dual Upgrade cards don't change during the game, but only kick into effect when you deploy your ship. So you can, sort of, surprise your opponent how you might use it. In the case of Adaptability, are you going to boost your ship's PS to move later, shoot sooner? Or are you going to drop it to run as a blocker?

I expect to see Vadar with Adaptability a lot. Sometimes you're going to want to shoot first; other times you might want to shoot after the rest of your aces so that there are no shields to stop your crit.

Now I'm curious what other kinds of Dual Upgrades we'll see. +1 Attack, -1 Agility / -1 Attack, +1 Agility? Gain an upgrade slot for a cost / lose an upgrade slot for a gain? Or maybe even ones that aren't exact opposites of each other. All kinds of fun to be had.

It's a B-wing when no one is playing B-wings. I don't see this ship getting much usage with the new meta upcoming.

It's a B-wing when no one is playing B-wings because TLTs exist. Alex has already stated that their popularity being quite so high was unanticipated. He'd stated previously (before release, so YMMV) that if it proved too much, they could handle it.

I strongly suspect that the idea here is much like ordance - balance the new ships against the old ships, let the bigger issues be solved specifically. That way once TLTs die down (throough whatever means Alex comes up with), B-wings, X-wings, and Mist Hunters will all be comfortably balanced after all.

... well, except for x7 Defenders. Oh well.

I'm not sure I agree with Sable that its dead on arrival. But I will say I don't think it is a ship that will be used in multiples. I think the ship has a bunch going for it that the standard B doesn't.

• +1 PS to place it above other generic and prevalent PS2 ships.
• Evade token on a Agility 1 ship. Not to mention it can make use of Juke/Sensor Jammer
• A better dial. 2 K turns to add some unpredictability and flexibility, and another green. All out just better.
• Crew to start. It can take a couple of really good scum only crew like outlaw tech to lever the restricted dial
• Its slightly less vulnerable to Plasma Torps ;-)

Why I don't think we will see it in multiples is the Mist hunter title, giving it that reposition, is unique. And I think it kind of relies on it. I think we may see the unique's more often because of this, but I am slightly worried about how expensive a loaded 4 Lom/Zuckuss will be. But in tandem with a Palob, this can be one terrifying ship..... If it can get to fire.

But time will tell.

I'm really looking forward to the Mist Hunter, and 4-Lom in particular. Was definitely going to get one, but now that I've seen the costs of the Generics, I might get 2.

Others have offered good points. I never felt this ship would unlock a scum GGGGZ list. Kind of glad it didnt. I'm a little surprised actually that we are going to see 3-4 JM5K lists instead of multiples of G1-A. I've always been a fan of how scum has an 'assorted' feel. Lists can easily not have duplicates of a ship. This seems appropriate given the canonical uniquenessof the Bounty hunter craft.

I'm stoked for Juke/FCS combo. The crew cards are nasty. Zuckuss pilot seems like he fits in with the Scum extra red dice aces (Kath, Talon). He will be a hit hard. Favorite build for him is juke, FCS, and 4-LOM. You can roll 4-5 dice with TL and juke then mitigate with evade.

I'm not sure I agree with Sable that its dead on arrival. But I will say I don't think it is a ship that will be used in multiples. I think the ship has a bunch going for it that the standard B doesn't.

• +1 PS to place it above other generic and prevalent PS2 ships.
• Evade token on a Agility 1 ship. Not to mention it can make use of Juke/Sensor Jammer
• A better dial. 2 K turns to add some unpredictability and flexibility, and another green. All out just better.
• Crew to start. It can take a couple of really good scum only crew like outlaw tech to lever the restricted dial
• Its slightly less vulnerable to Plasma Torps ;-)

Why I don't think we will see it in multiples is the Mist hunter title, giving it that reposition, is unique. And I think it kind of relies on it. I think we may see the unique's more often because of this, but I am slightly worried about how expensive a loaded 4 Lom/Zuckuss will be. But in tandem with a Palob, this can be one terrifying ship..... If it can get to fire.

But time will tell.

I should probably be careful to say "dead on arrival" are my words interpreting his sentiment. He said something to that effect, and I remember clearly he said that it was yet another dud for scum, but I'm not quoting him.

Edit: Nevermind

Could 4 ps3 shots down a PS2 Ywing before it even shoots?

oh my gods. What if you had Boba drop the TLT off. Or tractor beamed into a rock.

I think it could still see some play simply due to the system + crew slot combination. Also, the G1A should make a perfect damage sponge for Xizor.

that's a B-wing that traded shield for a hull (duh) Barrelroll for Evade (DOH!) and the glorious K2 for two Ks and sliiiiiiiiiightly less red dial.

it won't v_v