Well formations have ruined 40k, for example the Genestealer cults have just returned. Awesome right? I want the models.

But their formation allows starting 1 inch away from your opponent with their most powerful models and allows you to charge on turn one.

WHAT???

And on top of that my children (not that I have any, but that's not the point) would probably be the target demographic. Except I am their (hypothetical) father. I am a miniature/gamer/painter with 30 plus years of experience. There is no way no child of mine would play GW stuff, when there is so much else out there. And I still have 1000's and 1000's of points if GW stuff, and much it of still boxed and unpainted. There is no justification to spend any money at GW and so much lovely choice out there and so many companies worthy of my time and cash.

My pretend child would love XWing. If not, I would eBay him for one that did.

GW messed up, creating a steel-hearted hawk-eyed hobbyst culture that despises their methods, and can do anything from scratch-building to painting,

and now they won't be able to get into the next generation pockets because we're all well informed about their policy and attitude xD

made my day, man.

GW explicitly wants you to buy MORE RIPTIDES for the glorious all-out overwatch derpness!

Even if you add the patriarch and primus to the two gene stealers, it relies a lot on going first and not getting seized on.

And that your opponent doesn't have any flamers or decent rolling for overwatch.

It's not really competitive. Maybe it'll catch some jet bikes if you Go first, but Marine Gladius won't care, Tau will just super overwatch them off the board, etc.

Will make a good distraction carnifex for more traditional bug lists that aren't five flyrants and three mawlocs I suppose...

40k right now relies a lot on going first and not getting seized on.

Fixed that for you

One-shotting half of enemy force is the state of things in 40k

That being said, if this increase happened over the last 5 years, that is crazy.

That.

When I played 40K 10 years ago, a codex was £10 ($17ish?). Last I checked they were £30.

But they are all in hardback now. So you know, worth it. Totally.

When I started playing in 2000, the codex cost $30cdn, was soft cover, had very little rules, and virtually no fluff or background. Then around the 2006 to 2008 mark, they increased to $45 and switched to the Fantasy format: soft cover, black and white, larger number of rules, considerably more fluff. 2012 to present they moved to the current format: hard cover (so more durable), full colour, more rules, all of the fluff from every previous generation plus some new stuff. Price jumped to $60. Now, some of the larger codex like Space Marines cost $75, but that is because they are twice as thick as others. A considerable sum for a book, but when you take into account the changes that have been made over the years, worth the price.

I've seen battle reports of 40k games and the game seems appealing to me, but the extreme cost, time, and skill needed to paint them well and purchase them is just too much. If it coated like, half the amount it currently does I could see myself getting into it.

It's injection molded plastic. They only have to make the molds once.

Without turn it this I to a 40k hate thread, it isn't even the cos lt that puts me off, it's the constant pee-peeing around with the rules. When I bought sixth edition (prob about £150 in source material; rulebook, codexes ect) I managed to get ten games in before they released the next edition, complete with all new rule books and codexes. That's about the point I found x-wings rules were available FOR FREE online. I can't believe that one company could expect me to pay so much per year for rules when another is happy to give them to me for free!! Since that day, I haven't even picked up a 40k model, and I'm guessing I am not the only one who's had enough of GE policies, hence the (long overdue) dethroning of the GW empire

You are using the change from 6th to 7th as your excuse for being upset at GW? Yeah, it sucks that 6th edition only lasted two years, but the change needed to happen. 6th edition was the worst edition they had written as there were so many things wrong with the core rules. Rules just did not work together. If you look at the history of the previous editions, GW normally takes between 4 and 6 years to release a new edition.

People on this site might think that this is the beginning of the dethroning of the GW Empire, but I don't believe that to be true. 40k has had one major release since the spring, and that was the Tau. The primary drive from GW since the spring has actually been towards Age of Sigmar, so it makes sense that 40ks numbers are down. How many new waves have come out for X-wing since the spring? 2? 3? I can almost guarantee that if / when GW swings their focus back to 40k, you will see it back on top as the highest selling game.

Found the guy who works at GW.

That being said, if this increase happened over the last 5 years, that is crazy.

That.

When I played 40K 10 years ago, a codex was £10 ($17ish?). Last I checked they were £30.

But they are all in hardback now. So you know, worth it. Totally.

When I started playing in 2000, the codex cost $30cdn, was soft cover, had very little rules, and virtually no fluff or background. Then around the 2006 to 2008 mark, they increased to $45 and switched to the Fantasy format: soft cover, black and white, larger number of rules, considerably more fluff. 2012 to present they moved to the current format: hard cover (so more durable), full colour, more rules, all of the fluff from every previous generation plus some new stuff. Price jumped to $60. Now, some of the larger codex like Space Marines cost $75, but that is because they are twice as thick as others. A considerable sum for a book, but when you take into account the changes that have been made over the years, worth the price.

I've seen battle reports of 40k games and the game seems appealing to me, but the extreme cost, time, and skill needed to paint them well and purchase them is just too much. If it coated like, half the amount it currently does I could see myself getting into it.

It's injection molded plastic. They only have to make the molds once.

Without turn it this I to a 40k hate thread, it isn't even the cos lt that puts me off, it's the constant pee-peeing around with the rules. When I bought sixth edition (prob about £150 in source material; rulebook, codexes ect) I managed to get ten games in before they released the next edition, complete with all new rule books and codexes. That's about the point I found x-wings rules were available FOR FREE online. I can't believe that one company could expect me to pay so much per year for rules when another is happy to give them to me for free!! Since that day, I haven't even picked up a 40k model, and I'm guessing I am not the only one who's had enough of GE policies, hence the (long overdue) dethroning of the GW empire

You are using the change from 6th to 7th as your excuse for being upset at GW? Yeah, it sucks that 6th edition only lasted two years, but the change needed to happen. 6th edition was the worst edition they had written as there were so many things wrong with the core rules. Rules just did not work together. If you look at the history of the previous editions, GW normally takes between 4 and 6 years to release a new edition.

People on this site might think that this is the beginning of the dethroning of the GW Empire, but I don't believe that to be true. 40k has had one major release since the spring, and that was the Tau. The primary drive from GW since the spring has actually been towards Age of Sigmar, so it makes sense that 40ks numbers are down. How many new waves have come out for X-wing since the spring? 2? 3? I can almost guarantee that if / when GW swings their focus back to 40k, you will see it back on top as the highest selling game.

Found the guy who works at GW.

Or is a fanboy to the bone marrow xD

AoS is something worth NOT mentioning ever.

because one thing worse than 40k dumb-****-rules is AoS level of DERP rules.

When I started playing in 2000, the codex cost $30cdn, was soft cover, had very little rules, and virtually no fluff or background. Then around the 2006 to 2008 mark, they increased to $45 and switched to the Fantasy format: soft cover, black and white, larger number of rules, considerably more fluff...

40k right now relies a lot on going first and not getting seized on.

Fixed that for you

One-shotting half of enemy force is the state of things in 40k

Skyhammer says hello.

Building a list right now that is a Skyhammer grav drop with a 1st company combi melta drop. 1500 points.

I think there's an inquisitor with servo skulls for extra Luls. Maybe I'll make him warlord and fish for orbital bombardment.

40k has always been a really derpy game because it was made for and by derps. It has very little tactical nuance, no real suppression, a non-interactive defensive fire system, uninteresting movement, and a focus on highly randomized features. GW has not made a single interesting or deep game that would hold up today where tabletop games are so much better than they were in the 90s.

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

As a collector and a player I have to say that 40k has never been so diverse and interesting (except Chaos Space Marines) - chapter tactics, formations, Harlequins, Mechanicum and now the Genestealer Cults.

Harlequins used to be in when Rogue Trader was born, so were things like squats. They took out Genestealer cults many years ago to be revived again it seems. They Dumbed down 40K many years ago and only had the "Main" races, Eldar, Imperium, Chaos etc. They lacked a lot of diversity in races. They may have that back now but there is minimal tactics in the game. Don't want to be shot at? Put your entire list in drop pods or some other death from above list. 40K went from squad tactics, to hero hammer to now death by multi dice.

I guess a lot of ex 40K and Fantasy players are bitter at GW because it is akin to breaking up with a long time girlfriend/boyfriend. You have invested a lot of time into it, had a lot of fun together, you have laughed and cried at the misfortunes of others, only as the years of the relationship has dragged on they have changed and not for the better, you cant enjoy it like you used to. So in the end, you just have to leave it and have the fun memories from a long time ago... But every now and then you still grumble **** GW, you had the best years of my life.....

Well formations have ruined 40k, for example the Genestealer cults have just returned. Awesome right? I want the models.

But their formation allows starting 1 inch away from your opponent with their most powerful models and allows you to charge on turn one.

WHAT???

"Balanced"....

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

want to buy some XV-104 Rapetides? you can now field 9 of them at once!

It's like "buy yourself these new Jetbike boxes! 8 of them!"

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

want to buy some XV-104 Rapetides? you can now field 9 of them at once!

It's like "buy yourself these new Jetbike boxes! 8 of them!"

Hunter Contingent is better, Even with the ITC nerfs, since it doesn't get hard countered by a Draigo Cent Star or you know, Grav weapons in general. Or a Thunderwolf Star. Even Ravenwing, who normally die to Tau. Since 9 riptides are enough points you won't really have marker lights...

I mean, I'd rather face 9 Riptides then an exalted court of Knights, or Eldar, or a daemon factory.

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

I used to play warmachine but I found list experimentation to be too expensive in that game and the game to take too long.

Ah, yes, people played 40k thusly it must be an actually good game. Do you really want to go there?

6th-7th Ed 40k killed GW for me.

I'm not saying 6th didn't need a fix, but being forced to pay for what was effectively a patch less than 2 years after 6th was released was just blatant profiteering.

Combine that with the ridiculous trend towards superheavy uber-units making infantry obsolete and the game has become unplayable.

I would genuinely love to want to play 40k again. I have 3 large armies with years of history behind them. I've been collecting since the earliest days of rogue trader and still believe that somewhere in there is the core of an excellent infantry skirmish game. The lore, the imagery, and the models are still second to none.

But until the entire top management of GW is dropped off a cliff somewhere on Mars, the company is only every going to go backwards. Their belief that they can profit purely off the reputation of the model range without any kind of coherent and playable rule-set is frankly mind boggling.

I'm glad to see that their once seemingly impregnable monopoly has been broken, and the fact that it's X-wing that has knocked them off top spot doesn't come as a great surprise. I only hope that the competition forces them to reevaluate their business strategy and start making sensible decisions again. The re-boot of specialist games suggests that someone is taking it seriously. But they have been very complacent for a long time and specialist games aside, nothing else they seem to be doing with regards to 40k and AoS appears to show any real shift in attitudes.

Necromunda and Blood Bowl are still the two best miniatures games ever made though, and I have enough nostalgia for 40k that I'd be pleased to see them stop the rot.

Hunter Contingent is better, Even with the ITC nerfs, since it doesn't get hard countered by a Draigo Cent Star or you know, Grav weapons in general. Or a Thunderwolf Star. Even Ravenwing, who normally die to Tau. Since 9 riptides are enough points you won't really have marker lights...

I mean, I'd rather face 9 Riptides then an exalted court of Knights, or Eldar, or a daemon factory.

I don't know what any of this means, nor do I want to.

I'll go ahead and use that software analogy some more.

The original RT had fairly basic rules, it was all stats really, very few special rules. Did the job. It's DOS.

2nd ed things could get pretty cheesetastic, it had the cards, codexes. Special rules started appearing. 3.11

3rd was a complete revamp, designed for bigger army lists. a LOT happened in 3rd ed. We had lots of experimental rules, we had the minidexes for guard, blood angels etc. we had 2 summer campaigns (armageddon and 13th black crusade) The edition introduced Dark Eldar and Tau. (Previously Dark Eldar were only hinted at, and i thought they were slaanesh daemons at tallarn). 3rd Ed gave us the legion lists, very customizable guard, Black Templars, lost and the damned, physical witch and daemon hunters dexes Deathwatch rules (proto sternguard). It was a time along with 2nd when the mainline game was released along with specialist games, so there was decent crossover (see deathwatch above). It is the last time there was a physical sisters dex. Windows 95. Cityfight started here. 3rd was also really where the transition from metal to plastic kicked off. There have been plastic basic kits for a while, but anything special was still metal. This started to change. Slowly.

4th was really a consolidation of the experimental rules for 3rd, a few other bits. Introduced bigger codexes (twice the size as the 3rd ed ones, about the size of 2nd ed dexes) Chaos codex was simplified, but powerful. Black Templars Codex was Awesome. Windows 98. No rules updates for Deathwatch, Dark Eldar. Tyrannic Veteran rules for ultramarines are proto sternguard mk2. Cityfight redux Killteam first appears, included in the core rules as an option along with combat patrol.

Awesome.

5th is where things start getting skubby. Grey knights make a comeback, necrons and blood angels too, fluff starts getting a bit ridiculous. This is the Wardian Era. On a plus side, Sternguard officially introduced. Drop pods officially introduced (forgeworld had them as a model but you previously just used a large blast template). Windows ME. Here's where we get problems. Planetfight started. Finecasts.

5th Edition in my mind is where it starts to fall down, while a good edition in itself most units have special rules as well as stats, Grey knight blood angel and necron cheese really takes off.

6th. Huge hardback dexes. Start of online dataslates. ome VERY skubtastic rules. Lasted 2 years. Expansions mean things start getting really bloated. lots of expansions. the damage from 5th really shows through. in 5th there was slightly more gaming than there was arguing over rules. we'll call it 60/40. 6th onwards it goes the other way.

7th. Psychic phase, invisibility spam, everyone takes inquisition, riptides, taudar (the latter three in 6th too but gets ridiculous here) mission cards. Here's where i find it too bloated. Where PC's would have trancended to XP, vista and beyond into 64 bit territory, here.. for at least 2 editions we have a stagnant, backwards, bloated game which resembles with some irony the Imperium of Man itself.

It's more patch and dex than rules.

This is why it needs an overhaul. It needs to be brought all the way up to windows 7 at least, if not 10. The very core of the way the game plays needs to be changed - but the aesthetic. The aesthetic that all 40kers have fell in love with needs to remain the same. So not like AOS where they piss over the aesthetic.

40K can become a great game again But they need a complete rewrite.

Maelstrom is great.

Aside from formations and super heavys 7. Edition is the best designed ruleset of all 40k-iterations imho.

From a tournament standpoint the meta was never as diverse as at the beginning of 7. edition.

Sadly the following upgrades of the fractions introduced power creep on a mindblowing level...

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

From the early 90's to 2004 in the UK GW was the only game in town if you wanted to miniature war game and they offered a wide variety of games to entertain.

That was before the rot really set in then they decided to drop specialist games and swap their focus from vets to kids, that's the year things went **** up.

GW turned its back on a loyal fan base and that's where the hate comes from.

As for 40k 5th edition was the last playable version it wasn't perfect but it was fun, 6th rewards you for playing gun lines and taking flyers and had the broken allies system.

7th was far worse it let you bring in titans to a regular 2k games, it added objectives which let you get a win even if your army was blasted off the board, and unbound was blatantly there to make the game pay to win.

That was before they even released eldar and tau.

Modern 40k is a terrible mess driven by corporate greed not the desire to make a good game or provide a good service to their customers.

40k has become a joke sadly and GW the punch line.

40k right now relies a lot on going first and not getting seized on.

Fixed that for you

One-shotting half of enemy force is the state of things in 40k

This is a statement from someone who doesn't know the game.

The best scenario is to null deploy and go second so you go last and can compete objectives.

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

I used to play warmachine but I found list experimentation to be too expensive in that game and the game to take too long.

Ah, yes, people played 40k thusly it must be an actually good game. Do you really want to go there?

People still play 40k. Just because you are bitter doesn't still mean it's a widely enjoyed game system. It has its qualities, and, of course, negative aspects.

It is still a good game. 7th is one of the better editions, and while it definitely needs some FAQs and Erratas and some cleaning up, it's not nearly as bad as the vocal minority make it out to be. These things hold it back from being a great game.

.

6th-7th Ed 40k killed GW for me.

I'm not saying 6th didn't need a fix, but being forced to pay for what was effectively a patch less than 2 years after 6th was released was just blatant profiteering.

Combine that with the ridiculous trend towards superheavy uber-units making infantry obsolete and the game has become unplayable.

I would genuinely love to want to play 40k again. I have 3 large armies with years of history behind them. I've been collecting since the earliest days of rogue trader and still believe that somewhere in there is the core of an excellent infantry skirmish game. The lore, the imagery, and the models are still second to none.

But until the entire top management of GW is dropped off a cliff somewhere on Mars, the company is only every going to go backwards. Their belief that they can profit purely off the reputation of the model range without any kind of coherent and playable rule-set is frankly mind boggling.

I'm glad to see that their once seemingly impregnable monopoly has been broken, and the fact that it's X-wing that has knocked them off top spot doesn't come as a great surprise. I only hope that the competition forces them to reevaluate their business strategy and start making sensible decisions again. The re-boot of specialist games suggests that someone is taking it seriously. But they have been very complacent for a long time and specialist games aside, nothing else they seem to be doing with regards to 40k and AoS appears to show any real shift in attitudes.

Necromunda and Blood Bowl are still the two best miniatures games ever made though, and I have enough nostalgia for 40k that I'd be pleased to see them stop the rot.

GW made a gamble with AOS. They had to do something, as the tactical marine box was out selling the entire Fantasy range. A lot of the stuff they are currently releasing has been in the pipe since before the new CEO took over (I believe admech has copyright 2013 on it!). Now whether he pushed for its release or if it was planned to be released already, who knows.

They are working on getting things back on track... I suppose we will see what happens in the next year or so with 40k.

"From the early 90's to 2004 in the UK GW was the only game in town if you wanted to miniature war game and they offered a wide variety of games to entertain."

Only game... maybe not. But most accessible, definitely. There was a huge warhammer culture, and the specialist games were going strong.

Of note I will say that this era for GW videogames is brilliant.

Mordheim, Battlefleet Gothic. 3 different space hulks, Space Marine, Eternal Crusade. Total War.

AoS... No, Sorry AoS is a joke. It's a failure. Nothing else needs to be said about it.

Formations and cheese. Nothing else needs to be said about that. It's stupid and I don't want to play with it.

Allies system... Skub. On the one hand, mixed marine groups, marines and guard.

On the other. Necrons and Blood angels.

Wut.

Seriously.

I wish I had a time machine so I could get the sweet quirky metals of the 80s and 90s. As well as all the sourcebooks from what in my opinion was the golden age of warhammer and 40k. 3rd ed fantasy. 1st ed 40k. with Realms of Chaos for both.

I wonder when we'll see a Necromunda rerelease / videogame.

That would be sweet.

Speaking to Crazy Terrans arguments above.

I think you are deluded. It's not a personal attack, it's a plain observation. I kinda had a group of people who've played 40k for some time. All told perhaps a dozen of us. None of us play mainline 40k any more.

I don't even personally know anyone who still actively plays anymore. It's not simply us being bitter. Yeah, I will admit to being bitter, sure. Not wrong. Not even a little bit NOT bitter. But their sales have been decreasing, people aren't playing as much. They have Fehled da Emprah. They've gone full Boreale.

Never go full Boreale man, not even once!

The player base has shrank, the older players have mostly left and a lot of it is a younger audience. This, to be fair has cycled a few times. But never as badly as it has now.

Please understand. I've played 40k for longer than many people on this forum have been alive. Easily. I've seen (as surely evidenced in my earlier posts) some rises and falls. Yeah, adding admech and genestealer cults, and new rules for cypher, and fliers is all sweet. It is. It's all good. But don't let the paint hide the rot in the woodwork. The core rules, the core corporate culture of GW, the core attitudes. That's just bad.

I'd still buy the entire range of plastic sisters as a matter of **** principle.

7th edition allows for invisibility spam. That alone makes it the worst edition.

Ahh yes, the 40k is dumb and if you play it you are dumb comment. I assume you enjoy the failing Warmachine? Going to tell us page 6, bro?

If 40k was as bad as people made it out to be, it would have died ages ago. Of course, logic and reason have no place in your world, hmm?

That being said, I love me some Xwing, and I'm glad to see it doing well. Of course, an earlier comment about the only real 40k release being the Tau in the last few months is also true.

I used to play warmachine but I found list experimentation to be too expensive in that game and the game to take too long.

Ah, yes, people played 40k thusly it must be an actually good game. Do you really want to go there?

People still play 40k. Just because you are bitter doesn't still mean it's a widely enjoyed game system. It has its qualities, and, of course, negative aspects.

It is still a good game. 7th is one of the better editions, and while it definitely needs some FAQs and Erratas and some cleaning up, it's not nearly as bad as the vocal minority make it out to be. These things hold it back from being a great game.

.

6th-7th Ed 40k killed GW for me.

I'm not saying 6th didn't need a fix, but being forced to pay for what was effectively a patch less than 2 years after 6th was released was just blatant profiteering.

Combine that with the ridiculous trend towards superheavy uber-units making infantry obsolete and the game has become unplayable.

I would genuinely love to want to play 40k again. I have 3 large armies with years of history behind them. I've been collecting since the earliest days of rogue trader and still believe that somewhere in there is the core of an excellent infantry skirmish game. The lore, the imagery, and the models are still second to none.

But until the entire top management of GW is dropped off a cliff somewhere on Mars, the company is only every going to go backwards. Their belief that they can profit purely off the reputation of the model range without any kind of coherent and playable rule-set is frankly mind boggling.

I'm glad to see that their once seemingly impregnable monopoly has been broken, and the fact that it's X-wing that has knocked them off top spot doesn't come as a great surprise. I only hope that the competition forces them to reevaluate their business strategy and start making sensible decisions again. The re-boot of specialist games suggests that someone is taking it seriously. But they have been very complacent for a long time and specialist games aside, nothing else they seem to be doing with regards to 40k and AoS appears to show any real shift in attitudes.

Necromunda and Blood Bowl are still the two best miniatures games ever made though, and I have enough nostalgia for 40k that I'd be pleased to see them stop the rot.

GW made a gamble with AOS. They had to do something, as the tactical marine box was out selling the entire Fantasy range. A lot of the stuff they are currently releasing has been in the pipe since before the new CEO took over (I believe admech has copyright 2013 on it!). Now whether he pushed for its release or if it was planned to be released already, who knows.

They are working on getting things back on track... I suppose we will see what happens in the next year or so with 40k.

Warhammer 40k is like FIAT cars and farts - only very few of the owners like them

I had a huge 40k collection which I sold about 7 or 8 years ago because the game was already a chore to play by then. Haven't looked back once.

I belive 40k is stil reigning supreme in Europe. However I am very surprised, that Armada with its: 1 Wave per year sells so well AND that the very flawed Attack Wing with its: 12 waves per year + limited sets + special ships made it back into the top 5.