I was listening to NOVA Squadron radio (I think) and their number-cruncher guy was talking about how it's not worth it to spend the extra points for a higher PS, unless you were getting an ability with the higher PS.
Is this a general consensus among you guys? What do you think?
Currently PS is best at the extreme ends - either as high as possible to move last/shoot first or as low as possible to save on points. Unless you need a specific ability, or EPT slot, this is more or less the golden rule.
That's pretty much always been the case. You either stop at 1-4, or shoot straight to 8-11. PS5-7 pilots generally have no reason to exist unless their pilot abilities are utterly ridiculous (BroBots and Dash, for example).
If you go to the List Juggler tool at lists.starwarsclubhouse.com and click on the "Time Series Charts" tab, you can scroll down to see what the "landscape" of pilot skill looks like.
I prefer to look at lists that are making tournament cuts, because that's where I want to be. And there, over 30% of ships are on PS1-2, and almost 30% are at PS8-9. That means almost any PS bid puts you in front of a big chunk of ships, but it's a long way from there to the next big chunk.
Also, when attacking or defending, the only thing PS gets you is a chance to deny your opponent an attack, sometimes. When you combine those facts, you end up with the conclusion that PS bids--especially when you're bidding to 3-7--probably cost you more than they earn back.
The exception is maneuvering. Because you get such an informational advantage if you can barrel roll and boost after your opponent's ships have moved, ships that depend on arc-dodging to stay alive get a lot more than most ships out of having a very high PS. It's one of the reasons Soontir and Vader are so effective.
Disagree, p.s 3-5 is in a good place vs mass TLT, predator - and opening up elite pilot talents on blacks, omegas, and more. A lot of the p.s. 5-6 aces can be tanks, or destroy lower generics while being maneuverable enough to block the p.s. 8-9 aces and open up points for the generic / aces. Naked p.s. 7 is probably in the worst place.
There are definitely 4 tiers at work in the "global" meta. Local metas vary though. And the p.s. 5-7 range (excluding dual aggressors) is a fairly high skill ceiling. 5-7 range is getting to be more of a thing with wave 8 too. Imperials seem to have the most mid p.s. Ships not worth taking.
So S&V is right, you usually don't take mid P.S without a useful ability.
Aye, really high or really low PS tends to be where the most commonly used pilots gravitate towards, though there's definitely exceptions to the rule (IG-88, for example, is a middling PS6 and a staple of competitive play).
It's not that mid-PS pilots are automatically bad, it's just that they fall in the awkward space between "too high to be dedicated blockers, too low to position/take actions after aces move". Learning to fly them will also mean you need to have solid experience on how that pilot will handle both higher and lower PS pilots. Still, they have their place. Good players can position themselves well enough that not being able to do so after your opponent's ships have moved doesn't matter. And I think a lot of people tend to get lost in the idea that a named pilot MUST be the focus of a list to an extent and thus the lower PS guys just don't compare one on one to their higher PS counterparts, which isn't the case. The existence Poe Dameron doesn't prevent you from also throwing "Blue Ace" on the table as well; Poe is definitely the better pilot, but that doesn't automatically make "Blue Ace" bad (especially as a wingmate for Poe!). On the flip side, maybe a cheapish mid-tier pilot fits perfectly into a list (points wise) where you'd have to make sacrifices elsewhere to squeeze in a higher PS pilot.
And then, yes, some of them just have abilities that are really bad ("Fel's Wrath", Graz The Hunter), difficult to use effectively (Lt. Lorrir, Commander Alozen), or might require point investments somewhere else in the squad to get really good mileage out of (Kir Kanos, Arvel Crynyd).
When I started playing in Wave 3, it seemed low PS was the way to go. Then, the Phantom arrived, and PS became the stat.
Lately, the meta revolves around aces, so either prepare to be shot before you shoot, or slap VI on Han
The extremes are more potent for their consistency.
Low PS plans with perfect knowledge of the activation phase: the boardstate does not change between their planning and their maneuver.
High PS activates with perfect knowledge of the combat phase: the boardstate does not change between their boost/barrel-roll and their attack.
That's pretty much always been the case. You either stop at 1-4, or shoot straight to 8-11. PS5-7 pilots generally have no reason to exist unless their pilot abilities are utterly ridiculous (BroBots and Dash, for example).
I think 7 is still a cut above. 7s include:
All of whom can be flown to deadly effect without the aid of VI, and I believe that's a good majority of the PS7ers. If you look closer, it's 5 and 6 where PS really suffers. There's a couple of folks in that range worth a gander, especially on the discount of only ~1/4 of your points, but by and large that's the zone of "these are the pilots you never see on the table".
And yes, I'm including Porkins on my list. After my tournament experiences with him, I'm confident in his abilities as someone actually worth bringing along.
I disagree. I've played against a lot of decent lists using some of the middling pilots - particularly in scum (although I guess they don't really have an out and out 'ace').
All of whom can be flown to deadly effect without the aid of VI, and I believe that's a good majority of the PS7ers.
I'd consider a PS7 with VI a 9 for the purposes of a discussion on whether or not it's worth taking PS 5-7 pilots.
PS 7 is also important because VI will push it to PS 9.
Right now PS breaks down like this:
PS 1 - Blockers. Used to be more valuable, but TLTs at PS 2 hurt that value.
PS 2 - Blockers. Spammed TLTs. Simul-fire after being killed by spammed TLTs.
PS 3 - The first PS "bid." With enough red dice, kill a TLT -- including Stresshog -- before it shoots. The lowest PS with EPTs.
PS 4-6 - The least valuable PS. In my personal opinion, unique pilots at this PS ought to have the most powerful pilot abilities, because high PS is so valuable in and of itself.
PS 7 - The first PS to beat a significant number of seen-in-play unique pilots. As mentioned above, also valuable because it can go to PS 9 with VI.
PS 8 - With an EPT slot, valuable because it can go to PS 9 (Adaptability) or PS 10 (VI). Without an EPT slot, pretty much lumps in with PS 7.
PS 9 - Beats or ties everything that doesn't have an EPT devoted to going higher.
PS 10 - Beats Soontir and Whisper+VI. Needs repositioning to leverage.
PS 11 - Beats Poe+VI. Needs repositioning to leverage.
PS 12 - Epsilon Ace is the only mover in this category. Roark can make any Rebels shoot here.
The extremes are more potent for their consistency.
Low PS plans with perfect knowledge of the activation phase: the boardstate does not change between their planning and their maneuver.
High PS activates with perfect knowledge of the combat phase: the boardstate does not change between their boost/barrel-roll and their attack.
Rephrased:
Low PS has their choice of positioning, and can pick it with impunity.
High PS has their choice of action and attack, and can pick it with impunity.
Note that some actions are better at one end of the scale than the other (Focus is better at Low PS than it is at High. Evade and TL are better at High than they are at Low. Boost and Barrel-Roll are equally good at both ends, but they change in HOW they are good.)
Edited by DraconPyrothayanHigh ps is kinda vital if your a fragile ace but on a tankier ship like the aggressor or defender you can get away with a lower ps.
Fel wouldn't see play at ps 6 but vessery will when vets arrives.
Movement at PS 0 is also possible with enhanced scopes for blockers/bombers. PS 3+ also depends on prevalence of predator and such upgrades in your meta. I'd say 7-9 is high for PS due to vi. But generally the golden rule of extremes still holds true unless a mid PS ship has something awesome to offer or you are planning against a specific meta.
Is this a general consensus among you guys? What do you think?
right now it's TOO GODDAMN IMPORTANT
that' why the acewing happens
the last jouster with not_through_the_roof ps is the IG.
right now it's TOO GODDAMN IMPORTANTIs this a general consensus among you guys? What do you think?
that' why the acewing happens
the last jouster with not_through_the_roof ps is the IG.
The fact that you just called the IG a jouster just solidifies the fact that you honestly shouldn't give advice to others.
PS is only important of it is important to you. Comes down to play style, if you need it or if you think you need it for your meta (either kitchen table or tournaments) then it's important.
Mid-PS bomb carriers have the best of both worlds; they can move after and shoot before low PS swarms, and reliably move before and drop mines right on top of high PS ships.
One of the reasons why I enjoy flying Emon Azzameen so much.
IT IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR A LOT OF SHIPS AND ABILITIES.
That's pretty much always been the case. You either stop at 1-4, or shoot straight to 8-11. PS5-7 pilots generally have no reason to exist unless their pilot abilities are utterly ridiculous (BroBots and Dash, for example).
Or if you are scum and have extremely limited availability of 8+ PS....Like 4. Serissu, Talonbane, Boba and Dengar.
I used to love a PS2 swarm, but now they seem to get killed before they can shoot.
Scum's a later designed faction - a lot of their great skills are in the mid PS level - a lot of ships here break the golden rule by having an ability that you want to play - so you just ignore PS and roll with the ups and down of the PS game.
Recent releases seem to be muddying the PS waters. We are getting more ships in the mid PS range that have abilities that make them worthwhile taking (Red Ace is my favourite example at the moment). Also Juke is an interesting card whose value scales proportionally with PS. You use it offensively but its value ends when you spend the Evade token. Therefore even a modest PS bump can make the difference between using the ability and not managing to get it off. If you want to run it on generic Interceptors for instance, I think there is a good case for opting for Royal Guard over Saber Squadron. Shooting at PS6 means you are that much more likely to still have your Evade token around.
The Ghost contains entirely low to mid PS pilots but some have very interesting special rules. My hunch is that FFG are actively working to make mid PS ships more competitive.
Mid range PS is indeed a thing, but it takes an entirely different mindset and ways to adapt:
- IG-88s will never reach the high PS, so it's not worth it to try and you spend your points elsewhere. From that point on, every point spent by the opponent to get that PS 9, 10 or 11 is a point (and useful EPS slot) wasted. The large base also makes him a dangerous blocker.
- You can use a high pilot's boost and barrel roll to get out of arc and go in for the attack, but if Palob steals your lone remaining focus then that attack is suddenly a lot less threatening.
- Torkil will lower your PS, so you have the worst of both worlds: a risk of being bumped and shooting last.
- Oicuun thrives on crushing high PS target
- Valen will also become interesting; better not wiff those dice or else he might get some extra actions to get back in arc, get a target lock, etc.
- Nera can be somewhat interesting, if you can afford her (harder to block than others).
I think the middling PS ranks will get a bit more popular and will start to be taken after Wave 8 drops. With Ordnance finally being worthwhile (only took 8 waves 
), you will see a lot of low PS ordnance spam lists. Spending the 2 points to bump your generic to PS 3-5 might be worth it.
Of course Tractor Beams could muck that up too. The higher PS your tractor beam is, the more effective it is.
Edited by Jo Jo