This is a very raw idea: Would it be possible (and viable) to have both the benefits of playing solo (only 1 card revealed during questing) and 2 players (decks synergy, setup, wider card pool, etc) "without" the drawbacks?

Specifically I'm thinking in the next idea: Two decks, one of them is just for helping the other to setup faster, and then this second decks "kills" itself, hence leaving the rest of the game in solo-mode. The second deck is meant to be the first player in the 1st round, needs to (help to) setup the main deck, and then commit suicide before questing phase. Only three heroes have the ability to kill themselves for no reason: Tactics Boromir, Caldara, and Treebeard. There is no need to run the three of them; some of you may think Treebeard alone is enough, since it gives access to secrecy and Lore (card draw and scrying).

The main drawback is that many scenarios put more cards during setup due to 2 players mode. This is where the main question of viability surges again.

I've been lazy and I don't have a specific deck in mind for this support-suicidal deck idea. I'm guessing stuff like Deep Knowledge, A Good Harvest+Steward of Gondor, Scrying cards, Gondorian Fire, Blood of Numenor, etc. should work...

EDIT: Forgot that once a deck dies, it takes away all its cards, so this support deck should be consisting mostly of events (and attachments/allies that can work during the very small window they're around.... A Good Harvest+Steward of Gondor could still work, but just for one round)

So basically you're just looking for a second starting hand to benefit the other deck?

When you're eliminated, cards you control are taken out of the game, but if you have played an attachment on another player's hero, or put an ally into play under another player's control, the other player can keep them. So it's still a possibility. The core set manual explains that cards you control (not "own") are removed from the game.

This could define a whole new mode of playing solo. We could call it "Parting Gift" mode.

Since you will only see seven cards, I didn't include any cards that need combos to work. These are only zero or one cost cards to make sure a maximum number of cards are utilized.

The deck is also universal with its attachments and do not need specially-traited heroes on the other team to work.

Thematically, my favorite is Hail of Stones, which turns the card into a hit and run tactic.

Solo Boost
Total Cards: 50

Heroes (starting threat: 32)
Boromir ( The Dead Marshes )
Caldara ( The Blood of Gondor )
Treebeard ( The Treason of Saruman )
Attachments (35)
2x Arod ( The Treason of Saruman )
3x Blade of Gondolin ( Core Set )
3x Dagger of Westernesse ( The Black Riders )
2x Horn of Gondor ( Core Set )
3x Ancient Mathom ( A Journey to Rhosgobel )
3x Miruvor ( Shadow and Flame )
3x Spare Hood and Cloak ( Over Hill and Under Hill )
2x Thrór's Key ( On the Doorstep )
3x Ent Draught ( The Treason of Saruman )
3x Expert Treasure-hunter ( On the Doorstep )
3x Ithilien Pit ( Encounter at Amon Dîn )
3x The Long Defeat ( The Battle of Carn Dûm )
2x Keys of Orthanc ( The Voice of Isengard )
Events (15)
3x Hail of Stones ( Road to Rivendell )
3x Courage Awakened ( Trouble in Tharbad )
3x Radagast's Cunning ( Core Set )
3x Ravens of the Mountain ( On the Doorstep )
3x Rumour from the Earth ( Return to Mirkwood )

Deck built with Rivendell Councilroom

I think I'd be tempted to try to quest one round with such a strategy. It's probably worth an extra encounter card. It would also allow including one hero that doesn't have a way of killing itself---you could take one undefended attack and kill it, and then use Boromir and Treebeard if available to kill the enemy. I'm thinking Sam for 3 willpower and to allow access to Steward of Gondor and Legacy of Numenor without needing Good Harvest.

This could define a whole new mode of playing solo. We could call it "Parting Gift" mode.

Since you will only see seven cards, I didn't include any cards that need combos to work. These are only zero or one cost cards to make sure a maximum number of cards are utilized.

The deck is also universal with its attachments and do not need specially-traited heroes on the other team to work.

Thematically, my favorite is Hail of Stones, which turns the card into a hit and run tactic.

Solo Boost

Total Cards: 50

Heroes (starting threat: 32)

Boromir ( The Dead Marshes )

Caldara ( The Blood of Gondor )

Treebeard ( The Treason of Saruman )

Attachments (35)

2x Arod ( The Treason of Saruman )

3x Blade of Gondolin ( Core Set )

3x Dagger of Westernesse ( The Black Riders )

2x Horn of Gondor ( Core Set )

3x Ancient Mathom ( A Journey to Rhosgobel )

3x Miruvor ( Shadow and Flame )

3x Spare Hood and Cloak ( Over Hill and Under Hill )

2x Thrór's Key ( On the Doorstep )

3x Ent Draught ( The Treason of Saruman )

3x Expert Treasure-hunter ( On the Doorstep )

3x Ithilien Pit ( Encounter at Amon Dîn )

3x The Long Defeat ( The Battle of Carn Dûm )

2x Keys of Orthanc ( The Voice of Isengard )

Events (15)

3x Hail of Stones ( Road to Rivendell )

3x Courage Awakened ( Trouble in Tharbad )

3x Radagast's Cunning ( Core Set )

3x Ravens of the Mountain ( On the Doorstep )

3x Rumour from the Earth ( Return to Mirkwood )

Deck built with Rivendell Councilroom

Nice! For some reason I didn't see Hail of Stones while searching cards for this setup deck, and it's definitely worth adding

Palantir should really be included imo. Information is power Also if the main deck can sustain some threat damage, Deep Knowledge also should be included

EDIT: Side quests would be awesome to include as well

You can also make one normal deck with more cards (like 75 or more) with mad card draw (Erestor + Codran, etc) and fetching (Galadriel ally, that Noldor lore guy...).

Palantir should really be included imo. Information is power Also if the main deck can sustain some threat damage, Deep Knowledge also should be included

EDIT: Side quests would be awesome to include as well

I initially discounted Palantir because I assumed all attachments would go on a surviving hero. The risk/reward ratio still deters me from using it. Attaching it to a leaving hero, however, and exhausting it for the effect gives the remaining player the information of the next three encounter cards with no penalty. That's a no-brainer inclusion! After you see what is there, maybe you DO go for another round.

The core set manual explains that cards you control (not "own") are removed from the game.

I missed that rule somehow. We've always played it as removing cards you own and not just control.

Very helpful indeed.

I posted a thread about this once: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/180648-kamikaze-helper-deck/

My specific approach at time wouldn't work anymore with the Love of Tales erratum, though. But the idea of using Doomed cards with Loragorn available to reset the "real" player's threat still seems powerful.

The Rapid-fire zero cost Gandalf deck I posted uses Loragorn for threat resetting, but it doesn't have a capacity to killing itself on turn 1 before any more encounter cards are setup, which seems to be the idea.

I think NathanH had the right idea above: if the quest allows you to survive a single round of questing with two encounter cards, then the explosive setup that Doomed cards can enable probably makes a Loragorn-based helper strategy more than worth it. In that case, the deck suicide is just from threating out, which is not too hard to set up with Doomed cards and the Song of Earendil/Wandering Took method.

Now that Horn of Gondor reads: “Response: After a character is destroyed, add 1 resource to attached hero’s pool.”, post-shenanigan we get just the one resource from Treebeard's departure, right?

correct

If a player is eliminated, does the eliminated player still have a deck? I understand his deck gets discarded (per the elimination rules), but that does not mean cards cannot still interact with his deck...

For example, consider Curious Brandybuck. Basically, you put him into play under another player's control. Eliminate yourself...then, can his Forced effect trigger after the owner has been eliminated since the owner is no longer in play?

I think the eliminated owner of Brandybuck, still has a deck, even if all his cards in his deck were placed in his discard pile as a result of elimination...but if not, you can basically just give your playing partner an additional 6 willpower with no penalty (well I guess you have to survive one quest phase first and hope to see a location you can travel to).

Edit: On second thought, it doesn't really make sense for his effect to be able to trigger, because if it can, then he would get placed in the deck, and then nothing in the rules explicitly prohibits the eliminated player from drawing the card the next turn even though he is eliminated...lol... Even though we all can be pretty certain that we understand what "being eliminated" means, it's not actually defined.

I would think most people would agree that the natural understanding of being eliminated is that anything that references you can no longer activate since you are no longer there...Curious Brandybuck included. So should he stay in play if the original owner is eliminated, and then afterward the active location is explored?

This is a really intriguing rules dilemma to me so I sent in a rules question to Caleb. I'll post it here when I get a response.

Not ever planning to try out this strategy and to be completely honest had forgotten that Curious Brandybuck even exists but curious nonetheless!

I really like this concept, and I was thinking at least Deep Knowledge needs to be included because it helps the suicidal deck set up while also giving the permanent player more cards. Mixing that with Lore Aragorn could certainly make more Doomed cards viable assuming you can get the spheres needed and be able to play Desperate Alliance.

Hey Caleb
Lets say a player plays the card Curious Brandybuck (via its ability) and puts it into play under another players control. Before the active location is explored the owner of Curious Brandybuck is eliminated from the game. When the active location is explored the following turn what happens to Curious Brandybuck? Does it still go to the bottom of its owners deck even though they are eliminated or does something else happen? Thanks in advance!

Hi there,
Curious Brandybuck will be removed from the game when the active location is explored if its owner has already been eliminated.
Cheers,
Caleb