Would pump up ordnance a bit though...!

If you gave a K Wing or the Punisher an EPT like Push the Limit that would make it OP as ****. Carry 4 Proton Bombs in the Punisher, as well as what ever missiles you want, get something like this.

Move, action - drop bomb, 2nd action - target lock. Combat phase shoot missiles/torpedoes at crying kids. Rinse repeat 4 times....

There is a reason some ships dont have access to certain things.

Perhaps you own Guidance Chimps or Long Range Scanners. I don't.

So Ordnance is far from fine now. We don't know with kind of upgrades will be available in Imp vets, so far from fine NOW.

Perhaps next month. Not now.

Perhaps you own Guidance Chimps or Long Range Scanners. I don't.

So Ordnance is far from fine now. We don't know with kind of upgrades will be available in Imp vets, so far from fine NOW.

Perhaps next month. Not now.

That doesn't help the logic of your argument. the addition of EPTS to "anyone at any PS" is a hypothetical, and if actioned would be far later than a month from now. In order to appreciate the aspect of it's effect towards ordnance, then upcoming, especially immediately upcoming cards should be considered.

Would pump up ordnance a bit though...!

If you gave a K Wing or the Punisher an EPT like Push the Limit that would make it OP as ****. Carry 4 Proton Bombs in the Punisher, as well as what ever missiles you want, get something like this.

Move, action - drop bomb, 2nd action - target lock. Combat phase shoot missiles/torpedoes at crying kids. Rinse repeat 4 times....

There is a reason some ships dont have access to certain things.

You pay a valid amount of points for warheads. If they just turn out to be firecrackers like they use(d) to, they are indeed a failed investment.

That was the general consensus and criticism regarding ordnance.

If you pimp it with a Elite Slot for generics bombers, that way generic missile boats like Scimitars, Cutlasses or Wardens should see a new dawn and be a valuable choice over default TLT-carriers or economy class shuttles...!

There would be - you know - kind of competition within the given fighter classes and PS-ranks for a designated role in the list.

Granted, there would also be less incentive to buy new cards with new ships also, because the possibilities of customization would be legion at this point already...!

Perhaps you own Guidance Chimps or Long Range Scanners. I don't.

So Ordnance is far from fine now. We don't know with kind of upgrades will be available in Imp vets, so far from fine NOW.

Perhaps next month. Not now.

But you are proposing to install EPT's while knowing what is coming down the lind, including the Guidance Chips.

Would pump up ordnance a bit though...!

If you gave a K Wing or the Punisher an EPT like Push the Limit that would make it OP as ****. Carry 4 Proton Bombs in the Punisher, as well as what ever missiles you want, get something like this.

Move, action - drop bomb, 2nd action - target lock. Combat phase shoot missiles/torpedoes at crying kids. Rinse repeat 4 times....

There is a reason some ships dont have access to certain things.

You pay a valid amount of points for warheads. If they just turn out to be firecrackers like they use(d) to, they are indeed a failed investment.

That was the general consensus and criticism regarding ordnance.

If you pimp it with a Elite Slot for generics bombers, that way generic missile boats like Scimitars, Cutlasses or Wardens should see a new dawn and be a valuable choice over default TLT-carriers or economy class shuttles...!

There would be - you know - kind of competition within the given fighter classes and PS-ranks for a designated role in the list.

Granted, there would also be less incentive to buy new cards with new ships also, because the possibilities of customization would be legion at this point already...!

You are missing the entire point of the argument, it is about balance and trying to retain balance. Would I love to rock out that Punisher example? Of course I would, but I understand that it isnt going to happen because players that are a million times better than me will be able to exploit these ship builds.

I would like to see more things like Chardaan refit, negative points to remove slots that are never used. Possibly a way to sell cards too.

Not, not my thread. I say that WHEN WRITING SCENARIOS I break the rules. I do not think that universal EPT is a good thing. PTL, more PTL, barrel rolling Y 666...

I say that now there are no chips, no LR Scanner...not released on stores. Perhaps with Imp Vets there will be included an anti ordnance cost cero mod. We do not know.

Today, february 2016, ordnance is not fine. Later...we will see.

You know you can proxy cards when not doing tournament right? it's how I played Vader X1 ATC 6 months before the raider release...

You are missing the entire point of the argument, it is about balance and trying to retain balance. Would I love to rock out that Punisher example? Of course I would, but I understand that it isnt going to happen because players that are a million times better than me will be able to exploit these ship builds.

I can assure you, I am not!

After all, the idea of this threat is to establish a balance and return both underused ships and cards back into the game.

Of course I would, but I understand that it isnt going to happen because players that are a million times better than me will be able to exploit these ship builds.

This I understand pretty well: Hesitation out of fear.

Point is the "munchkinism" - is that a real word? - would be (like it is now) on every end of the spectrum (offense/defense) and faction.

You could only fear the upcoming of disbalance, if some faction or ships would be favoured lopsidedly - which wouldn't be the case in this scenario...!

You can proxy cards, modify cards, create cards...

You are talking about LRS, but we have no idea about what cards will be included in Imp Vets. Imagine that you preview ONE page in a new book in FoW, or W40k, a new card in MTG...and you say. This aircraft is AWESOME. When the book is released, and you read it, next page... FLAKVIERLING ANTIAIRCRAFT GUN. That plane is not awesome now. The new MTG monster card is canceled via a new spell. And so on.

Until you see all the contents, you can say if this or that is fixed or not.

Eh, with FFG we are spoiled the details pretty well in advance, and the way they operate generally they fix and adjust things quite gently.

It's not like 40K where they Games-Workshop are partnered with Kraft when releasing dataslates/codices for Spacemarines/Eldar/Tau.

And about the EPT dilema, an example.

HORTON Y WING. He must drop a seismic bomb on a Power Station before a Turbolaser heats up and destroy a Rescue Ship. Ok. No EPT on the card. But in this mission Horton will fly with an EPT. "Cool Hand". On his long bombing run, when in the last meters a pesky Tie will tail him, he has the option to go 4 forward red. 4 ctms advance, and discarding Cool Hand he can gain Evade Token. Perhaps the difference between life and death...or not.

More options are good. There are ample EPT and upgrades. Allways Crack, PTL, Predator...

You can proxy cards, modify cards, create cards...

You are talking about LRS, but we have no idea about what cards will be included in Imp Vets. Imagine that you preview ONE page in a new book in FoW, or W40k, a new card in MTG...and you say. This aircraft is AWESOME. When the book is released, and you read it, next page... FLAKVIERLING ANTIAIRCRAFT GUN. That plane is not awesome now. The new MTG monster card is canceled via a new spell. And so on.

Until you see all the contents, you can say if this or that is fixed or not.

Erm, except that we know all but one of the upgrade cards that are in Imperial Veterans already - 2 of each of the 3 titles (/x7, /D, Shuttle), 1 Crack Shot, 2 Long Range Scanners, 1 Tractor Beam, 1 Cluster Missiles, 1 Proximity Mines. The only one we don't know is the Sys... Of... which is most likely a crew upgrade called Systems Officer, given that the pack contains a title which allows bombers to take crew, but currently doesn't have any revealed crew upgrades in it; it's unlikely they'd release the bomber shuttle title in a box without anyone to shuttle.

The rest of the stuff we don't know is pilot cards.

And we know exactly what Guidance Chips are going to do, they're out imminently.

Horton has access to an EPT. He just loses the possibility of Regen, stressbot, and green 1-2 turns to get it.

Everyone getting EPT renders that little upgrade-bot useless.

Eh, with FFG we are spoiled the details pretty well in advance, and the way they operate generally they fix and adjust things quite gently.

It's not like 40K where they Games-Workshop are partnered with Kraft when releasing dataslates/codices for Spacemarines/Eldar/Tau.

What I try to say is that upgrades, etc, should be examined in detail when all the upgrades and fixes are known, whe the expansion is released. Because we do not know if there will be an anti.ordnance mod or a pilot that prevents ordnance working in an area, etc. We will see... and enjoy

Everyone getting EPT renders that little upgrade-bot useless.

Also, what prevents you from using Elite-Bot on another ship to gain one more EPT-Slot? It'll still cost you extra points you'd miss somewhere else...!

That is true.

Munitions failsafe still has a niche though, as I had mentioned (extra flachette missiles).

Everyone getting EPT renders that little upgrade-bot useless.

So what? It's not the first time that happens. <Glances at Munitions Failsafe>

Also, what prevents you from using Elite-Bot on another ship to gain one more EPT-Slot?

R2-D6 itself, probably.

FWIW I do think that most ships should get a PS 5/6 elite generic pilot card with either an EPT or some other minor bonus.

Open-ended skills for pilots is one of the things that ruined Star Trek: Attack Wing.

I don't want to see such runaway power creep happen in x-wing, too.

Allways the competitive point of view, build a killer to smash other.people in the LGS. NO way to equip a 1 pt use and discard EPT on a PS 4 Y...but twin IGs are OK and 100% legal. Or 4, in Epic

Ok, this is no Vietnam, here there are Rules.

FWIW I do think that most ships should get a PS 5/6 elite generic pilot card with either an EPT or some other minor bonus.

FWIW I do think that most ships should get a PS 5/6 elite generic pilot card with either an EPT or some other minor bonus.

I agree with this. I don't every individual ship should get EPTs but I do think we should get some generic veterans + EPT for those classes of ships that don't have them yet (Y-wing and E-wing are obvious candidates but there are probably others).

Phantoms, scum and rebel Zs, T65s, Advanceds, StarVipers(?), scum y-wings (maybe rebels as well, though I really don't think the stresshog needs the buff), E-wings, various large-base ships, are the obvious ones that aren't already getting a re-release. I think there ought to be mid-PS generic EPTs for any ship where at least one unique has one.

I'd be surprised if we didn't see generic EPT T65s and E-wings in Rebel Veterans the way Imperial is releasing TIE Bomber and probably TIE Defender ones.

Allways the competitive point of view, build a killer to smash other.people in the LGS. NO way to equip a 1 pt use and discard EPT on a PS 4 Y...but twin IGs are OK and 100% legal. Or 4, in Epic

Ok, this is no Vietnam, here there are Rules.

Fine, For Scenarios ALLOW IT!!!!!!! !!! (and a few more!!!'s to make my point known).

For Epic, Home rule it.

There are scenarios I am certain in FFG's missions where ships do have upgrades or are assigned in a way they otherwise would not be (hello rebel controlled Gozanti).

But for the ultra competitive scene where by the book is by the book, leave the book alone.

I agree with you 100%. And after the release of Imp, Reb and Scum veterans ( pray for those ) perhaps we will see a new. and better x wing. And by the Book !!! Cheers