Price Check: A-Wing Pilots

By DagobahDave, in X-Wing

Continuing our series where I'd like us to re-evaluate the points costs of cards, one category at a time. Just copy the list and insert your own point values. Let's get to it.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

A-WING PILOTS

Prototype Pilot 17

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Gemmer Sojan 22

Arvel Crynyd 23

Jake Farrell 24

Tycho Celchu 26

I would think they are fine, especially with Chardaan refit. I don't really play A-wings, but I haven't been gnashing my teeth over them anytime lately.

Oh, poor Arvel. What are we to do with you? Test Pilot + VI?

Prototype Pilot 17

These are great as-is (with Chardaan Refit)

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Same

Gemmer Sojan 21 (-1)

Gemmer's ability is solid, but you're paying too much for PS 5, which isn't much more useful than PS 3 in the current meta and you're losing access to a 2nd EPT. A Green with PTL and VI is 21 points. Gemmer's ability is probably worth 1-2 points, I'd go with 1 since you're making a defensive ship even more defensive, when the game is about offense.

Arvel Crynyd 21 (-2)

Arvel's ability is pretty awkward at PS6. Even when it does work, the damage output is pretty abysmal since you rarely have modifiers. I think he has similar utility as Gemmer - the main benefit is his PS6 letting him reposition on generics. The ability is just something that you may use when the opportunity arises and is unlikely to matter.

Jake Farrell 24
Jake is great as-is

Tycho Celchu 25 (-1)

Jake is so good that Tycho needs a little assist. His ability is fantastic in the land of stress dealing abilities, but his damage output is still constrained by the A-Wing platform.

I mostly agree with Transmogrifier.

Prototype Pilot 17

These are great as-is (with Chardaan Refit)

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Same

Gemmer Sojan 21 (-1)

Gemmer's ability is solid, but you're paying too much for PS 5, which isn't much more useful than PS 3 in the current meta and you're losing access to a 2nd EPT. A Green with PTL and VI is 21 points. Gemmer's ability is probably worth 1-2 points, I'd go with 1 since you're making a defensive ship even more defensive, when the game is about offense.

Arvel Crynyd 21 (-2)

Arvel's ability is pretty awkward at PS6. Even when it does work, the damage output is pretty abysmal since you rarely have modifiers. I think he has similar utility as Gemmer - the main benefit is his PS6 letting him reposition on generics. The ability is just something that you may use when the opportunity arises and is unlikely to matter.

Jake Farrell 24

Jake is great as-is

Tycho Celchu 25 (-1)

Jake is so good that Tycho needs a little assist. His ability is fantastic in the land of stress dealing abilities, but his damage output is still constrained by the A-Wing platform.

This^

A-Wings doesn't need to be touched but Avrel and Gemmer don't get much love :(

Looking forward to adaptability and dropping avel's ps down to 5

Gemmer Sojan 21 (-1)

Gemmer's ability is solid, but you're paying too much for PS 5, which isn't much more useful than PS 3 in the current meta and you're losing access to a 2nd EPT. A Green with PTL and VI is 21 points. Gemmer's ability is probably worth 1-2 points, I'd go with 1 since you're making a defensive ship even more defensive, when the game is about offense.

Arvel Crynyd 21 (-2)

Arvel's ability is pretty awkward at PS6. Even when it does work, the damage output is pretty abysmal since you rarely have modifiers. I think he has similar utility as Gemmer - the main benefit is his PS6 letting him reposition on generics. The ability is just something that you may use when the opportunity arises and is unlikely to matter.

The thing is.....is that meta changes. If you change it now, it might break it later. At the moment, there is > PS 3 and PS 9+, with the idea that everything else sucks. That can change with a release. That's also only with tournament high level games. Lots of times the others are good besides tournament play.

A-WING PILOTS

Prototype Pilot 17

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Gemmer Sojan 22

Arvel Crynyd 23

Jake Farrell 24

Tycho Celchu 26

This one's easy.

Prototype Pilot 15

Green Squadron Pilot 17

Gemmer Sojan 20

Arvel Crynyd 21

Jake Farrell 22

Tycho Celchu 24

Then ban Chaardan Refit.

I feel like A-Wings would be in a pretty solid spot if they had a way to hook up Extra Munitions. They're all very fairly costed for what they do, their main problem is that they favor defense too heavily. A second volley of PRockets might make them more desirable. As it is, they're still a bit toothless in a game that relies heavily on blowing up your opponents.

A-wings are good with their single munitions, they just need to lose the tax on them. Same with the X-wing: I'd run torpedoes on them if they could take Guidance Chips without sacrificing all defensive ability. The X-wing really needs double mods if it wants to use ordnance.

As for A-wings lacking bite, it's important to remember that the A-wing is both good at reaching Range 1 and defensively strong enough to thrive there. This means it's making more three die shots, giving it effectively higher firepower than a Z-95 (which also has two dice but lives at Range 2). In terms of damage potential, it's not as far behind the X and B-wings (which tend to fight at Range 2) as you'd think.

I would like Awings to be more dedicated to zippy missile shooters, I'd play them more with that choice on the table.

I've switched to A-wings as my main thang (sorry T-65s) specifically Tycho and Jake with PtL, VI, and PRockets.

If it works, it's a short game.

If it doesn't? Well, guess we need to stay at range one with those hard 1s don't we Tycho?

The price is right for A-wings as long as you are taking PRockets or Chardaan.

A-WING PILOTS

Prototype Pilot 17

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Gemmer Sojan 22

Arvel Crynyd 23

Jake Farrell 24

Tycho Celchu 26

This one's easy.

Prototype Pilot 15

Green Squadron Pilot 17

Gemmer Sojan 20

Arvel Crynyd 21

Jake Farrell 22

Tycho Celchu 24

Then ban Chaardan Refit.

I'd tweak this slightly. Gemmer and Arvel should have had EPTs from the start, in addition to the Test Pilot option. If he could take both Intimidation and Predator, then Arvel would be an absolute terror at 26 points, especially for any ship with only one agility die.

Gemmer Sojan 21 (-1)

Gemmer's ability is solid, but you're paying too much for PS 5, which isn't much more useful than PS 3 in the current meta and you're losing access to a 2nd EPT. A Green with PTL and VI is 21 points. Gemmer's ability is probably worth 1-2 points, I'd go with 1 since you're making a defensive ship even more defensive, when the game is about offense.

Arvel Crynyd 21 (-2)

Arvel's ability is pretty awkward at PS6. Even when it does work, the damage output is pretty abysmal since you rarely have modifiers. I think he has similar utility as Gemmer - the main benefit is his PS6 letting him reposition on generics. The ability is just something that you may use when the opportunity arises and is unlikely to matter.

The thing is.....is that meta changes. If you change it now, it might break it later. At the moment, there is > PS 3 and PS 9+, with the idea that everything else sucks. That can change with a release. That's also only with tournament high level games. Lots of times the others are good besides tournament play.

I took the whole point of this thread is "what is X *really* worth in the current meta?". I would still argue that Arvel and Gemmer are overcosted even if mid-PS was intrinsically valuable in the meta since their abilities simply aren't that strong and the premium you are paying for their PS + ability doesn't match the value you gain from them.

I would disagree with your second point about their pricing being OK outside of tournaments. The fact that you don't see these guys flown in tournaments is a good sign that their capabilities don't match their costs. Gemmer in particular should (theoretically) be a great TLT counter since he's high enough PS to trump most TLT carriers and his ability (particularly paired with autothrusters) can make him practically immune to them. The ability is solid in our meta and the A-Wing is a good ship, but you don't see him flown because he costs so much more than a Green Squadron Pilot while not adding enough value to be worth it.

I feel like the Awing Pilots and the Tie Interceptor Pilots are all pretty well priced, they just need the EPT SLOT!!!

2 named pilots need a slight change and that's it. Chard an refit did the rest already.

A-WING PILOTS

Prototype Pilot 17

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Gemmer Sojan 21

Arvel Crynyd 21

Jake Farrell 24

Tycho Celchu 26

Scrap refit

-2 to everyone

arvel's cost equal to gemmer's

A-WING PILOTS

Note: I'm including CR in the base cost of the ship.

Prototype Pilot 15 - The prototype is great. But (and perhaps this is a bit of a power creep) I would drop the cost another point. The argument to lower it would be basically it's a TIE/FO trading a hull for a shield and BR for Boost. The lack of BR is huge. Plus you lose the Sloop. It seems clear to me that the /FO is a better ship for the same cost. Or perhaps the /FO needs another point added to it?

Green Squadron Pilot 17 - This the cheapest most viable platform for PTL. And it comes in at 20 points. Not bad. I wouldn't touch it.

Gemmer Sojan 20 - 3 points for 2 PS and an ability, but no EPT. I'm not going to touch the 2 points for 2PS, which means Gemmer is basically an unique EPT for 1 point. I have no problem with this. Now if you were to start discussing if 1PS = 1 point across the board, then I would argue that it's not that simple, the cheaper ships should pay less for PS increases. In which case, I would argue Gemmer should only be 19 points.

Arvel Crynyd 21 - See above about my PS argument. I really do think they screwed up on that. It's one of the reasons Corran is the only E wing worth using. So 1 point from that, plus I don't think his ability should cost anything. 19 points as well. Though I would prefer him to be 18 and PS3-4.

Jake Farrell 22 - Jake is great. If we continue with my PS argument, he would be 20 points. But his ability is probably a 2 point ability, putting him at 21 points. I have to wonder if this would make Jake too cheap though.

Tycho Celchu 24 - A 2 point reduction from PS would be overpowered. So again, I feel like his ability should cost another point, putting him at 23 overall. It goes to figure that Tycho and Jake are on the edge of competitive because they're abilities are so great that they can overcome their overpriced PS bid.


Prototype Pilot 15

Green Squadron Pilot 17

Gemmer Sojan 19

Arvel Crynyd 20

Jake Farrel 22

Tycho Celchu 23


And ban Chardaan Refit, of course.


The Protos, Greens and Jake are all fine just with the -2 from the Refit, but Gemmer, Arvel and Tycho need a little extra on top. Gemmer and Arvel's abilities are so weak I'd ignore them altogether and just price them by PS; even then I don't think we'd see too much of them. Tycho's ability is really good, but on a ship with as much green on its dial as the A-wing has it's not quite good enough to be worth 2 points.


Prototype Pilot 17

These are great as-is (with Chardaan Refit)

Green Squadron Pilot 19

Same

Gemmer Sojan 21 (-1)

Gemmer's ability is solid, but you're paying too much for PS 5, which isn't much more useful than PS 3 in the current meta and you're losing access to a 2nd EPT. A Green with PTL and VI is 21 points. Gemmer's ability is probably worth 1-2 points, I'd go with 1 since you're making a defensive ship even more defensive, when the game is about offense.

Arvel Crynyd 21 (-2)

Arvel's ability is pretty awkward at PS6. Even when it does work, the damage output is pretty abysmal since you rarely have modifiers. I think he has similar utility as Gemmer - the main benefit is his PS6 letting him reposition on generics. The ability is just something that you may use when the opportunity arises and is unlikely to matter.

Jake Farrell 24

Jake is great as-is

Tycho Celchu 25 (-1)

Jake is so good that Tycho needs a little assist. His ability is fantastic in the land of stress dealing abilities, but his damage output is still constrained by the A-Wing platform.

If the z 95 didn't exist you could talk me into dropping the point cost by at least one across the board so the rebels would have better access to a cheap missle platform, but that's a distant hypothetical.

Edited by catachanninja