A local store wants my help with running tournaments but they have it in their head to run a big cash payout tournament with a sizable entry fee, like 30 bucks with the winner claiming close to half of the money paid in.
I haven't seen any other X Wing tournaments run this way and was wondering if any of you have? And if so how did they go over?
I can't speak of seeing one but if I did I would be extremely worried about some tournament with a big cash payout. I mean you see people playing shady games or just outright cheating when there is little more than bragging rights on the line so what do you think happens when there get to be real, universal, awards on the line? If someone wants to run a tournament like that they had better be completely above board on that and probably should have a number of unbiased judges walking around and making sure everything is on the up and up. The WORST thing in the world would be to have a judge who is PLAYING in such a tournament and/or who has a friend or two in the tournament; I guess things could be worse if the judge also doesn't have a great grasp on the rules.
As for a tournament with a big entry fee but limited prizes I believe it would chase away many regular players who know they have almost no shot at one of those huge money prizes. I believe a far better prize strategy would be to give out many smaller prizes while the top four could get a better reward.
Baaad idea.
Have you seen the stushi that's going on over in the "Dice" thread?
Imagine how many people would be playing with loaded dice if they knew money was at stake.
Cheers
Baaa
Bad idea.
Distracts from the purity and fun of the game.
rather do it for bragging rights and tokens.
Yeah, things can get fraught enough over stuff like nudges and stuff being fractions of a millimetre in or out of range when the only things on the line are some alt art cards and acrylic tokens. Not sure I'd want to play in a game where the stakes are far higher.
Good idea and no reason not too. The hoth open is being played for a free trip to London and star wars celebration which is well over a couple thousand dollars in value. If it's good enough for ffg I think it can be good enough for any store that wants to do it.
I'm thinking there is some difference between winning a free trip and winning cash. Maybe you're great at converting a trip you win into liquid assets but when people know you win but don't go that will put a stink on you. Something else, what is the entry fee for that tournament? I'd say it is also one thing if you have someone sponsoring a big prize vs. requiring a big entry fee for a big payout.
Eh, you want cash prizes, you can always ebay your actual prizes. Some of them will fetch a pretty penny.
But no, I don't really think cash prize tournaments are a good idea.
Last year a regional in one of the Carolinas I belive or maybe Georgia was going add $1,000 on top of the normal regional prizes and a lot of people were excited for it and it was going to draw quite a few people from out of town myself included. On Facebook people stared crying about cheating and all the bad people it would bring and I they cancelled it. It was ridiculous because I have way more faith in this community to be able to handle a tournament like that.
IF you are going to do a cash prize, the only way to do it is to spread it around as much as possible.
At the store I have run events at which likes to do "cash prizes", there are a few things of note:
IF you are going to do a cash prize, the only way to do it is to spread it around as much as possible.
At the store I have run events at which likes to do "cash prizes", there are a few things of note:
- It's not actually cash, but store credit. Which is as good as cash to gamers, more or less, but it's not literally cash. You can, after all, only spend it at that one spot, and if you get a reputation for being a cheating slime (or worse, cheat badly enough to be banned from the store)...the value of the prize obviously diminishes rapidly.
- We try to break it down by (generally) X-Wing product prices. So the highest theoretical prize is enough for a Tantive IV or Raider (IE., $100), although more practically we top out at Transport ($60), with additional prizes being some multiple of the individual packs ($45 or $30).
- And again, spreading it around as much as possible - certainly everyone who makes the cut into elimination rounds should get something at the very least. Putting it all (or nearly all) on one position is just a terrible idea, sure to leave a bad taste. I mean, we all know skill plays a huge factor in the game, but sometimes the dice just frack you over, and nobody wants to drop from possibly winning $1000 down to a $50 (or whatever) second place and feel it was down to an awful dice roll. That's the type of thing that instantly burns someone out on a game and has them selling all their stuff.
Big prizes tend to create bigger stress. People play harder lists and the games are less fun. I've seen it done that way with other game systems.
The best thing to do, instead, is to run a standard entry fee ($10/$15) and then use the money as gift certificates to the store. That way people do get money prizes, but it goes right back into the store.
I don't mind Store Credit, but I don't like Actual Cash prizes given for games. Now I do like Cash prizes for Painting competitions though.
Last year a regional in one of the Carolinas I belive or maybe Georgia was going add $1,000 on top of the normal regional prizes and a lot of people were excited for it and it was going to draw quite a few people from out of town myself included. On Facebook people stared crying about cheating and all the bad people it would bring and I they cancelled it. It was ridiculous because I have way more faith in this community to be able to handle a tournament like that.
I think that was Raleigh, NC and I think part of the problem people had was the $50 entry more than it being a cash tournament
Store credit is as close as I would go.
Winning something of monetary value is different than winning cash. Heck, those World's Dice are north of $300... But winning those is not the same as winning cash. Though I suppose the argument could be made that most people spent more than $300 getting to worlds...
Back on topic though, I would expect there to be a very small turn out for that. Even if you say that you have an active community of over 100 players, I would doubt that more than 10% of those would attend since those who know they have no chance at winning are likely to pay $30 just to play X wing. So only those would have a realistic chance at winning would be interested in joining. So now you have a 5:1 pay out if you win, second place probably gets some winnings, and maybe 3rd and 4th get their money back. Still not a particularly appealing turn of events.
It "works" in magic because of the shear payouts and quantity of players that exist. When you have a 40k purse, the prize money goes far enough that people are motivated that they think they can win top 16 and take home a grand. Oh well... who knows.
You'd need a level of TOing/Judging that doesn't yet exist for this game.
I don't think the ruleset and infractions are solid enough for a higher stakes game. Like, what happens when a player accidentally nudges a piece? Or what happens if that player repeatedly nudges a piece? Or don't square their bases up against the edge of their templates. Or weight their dice? Or take too long setting a dial? Or take too long figuring out where to decloak?
All these time constraints, etc, just make it not really a great game for ultimate-rules-lawyering. It could be with a few nudges, but isn't there right now when the only "official" templates you can use are rediculously priced on eBay, or cardboard.
I have repeatedly said locally that I would pay good money for a "pro" set of templates and dice. Maybe even a pro set of obstacles, and firing arcs. There's just too much "slop" in everything I think to up the stakes to substantial money at this point of this game.
As for a local cash prize tournament, I encourage someone to try it. See what it looks like, and see what the judging looks like for said tournament. It may be too much commitment for the tournament size, but I'd sure like to hear about someone's experience with it.
Bad Idea
I think it's a good idea!
I would just recommend that additional TOs be on site. Someone walking around the tables during game play is NOT a bad idea. I would actually recommend this for all Store Champ, Regional, National events, etc.
Honestly, cash prize, store credit prize, sell-able OP kit prize, I honestly don't see the current "competitive" X Wing players playing any different for different prizes.
Just think about it, we're all coming their to win, and will be doing everything in our power to win.
I wouldn't say that it's a bad idea in itself, but just be aware that it will bring the worst out in some players. I've noticed that "fly casual" goes out of the window often enough when it's just free spaceships on offer. Expect it to be worse when the prize is cash.
I spend wife points going to tournaments that give out store credit.
I gain wife points going to tournaments that give out cash prizes.
Big prizes tend to create bigger stress. People play harder lists and the games are less fun. I've seen it done that way with other game systems.
Honestly, the best way to make the game more interesting is to have all the players standing over trapdoors. When a player loses, the trapdoor opens to a Rancor Pit.