Okay, thanks all!

If I were to swing a wrecking ball into a car at 20kph, is that any different than swinging a car into the wrecking ball at the same speed? So, I imagine the damage is done to both objects, then both objects have to apply soak and wounds for the 22 damage.

So, to clarify, do you add uncancelled successes on the ranged attack to the damage, or is it simply equal to Silhouette x 10?

For example, if I were to roll 3 Force pips (1 base power, 1 range upgrades to move the object out of Short Range, and 1 to move a higher Silhouette object) and gain two successes on Discipline to throw an Acklay (Silhouette 2), would I deal 20 damage (2 x Silhouette) or 22 ((2 x Silhouette) + 2 successes)? Also, the fluff mentions that the damage is dealt to the "target and the object": does this mean that both of the aforementioned would suffer the full 20-22 points of damage, or would the damage split between? Also, you have roll to pick up the object, but does the target of the attack (the one having the Acklay thrown at it) get any chance to dodge?

I was under the impression that one would also have to activate relevant control upgrade to trigger the offensive ability of the move power? So the above mentioned example would require one additional force pip spent for control upgrade - hurl?

None of the Control upgrades for Move require you to spend additional force pips. As long as you rolled well enough to move the object you selected, you can hurl it (or pull it from a secure mounting, etc.).

I just wanted to point out that when you target an important NPC you shouldn't change the silouette based difficulty for Discipline. The rulebook specifically says that you only need to do it for powers that are not already opposed or combat checks (wich move already is). Remember that being a combat check Adversary talent already applies, so that should be increase enough in difficulty for such an NPC (you could actually make it easier otherwise if you are moving a big object, wich would make no sense at all).

So in that case, you'd upgrade the Discipline check by a number equal to his Adversary Talent?

So in that case, you'd upgrade the Discipline check by a number equal to his Adversary Talent?

Yes, just like any other combat check.

So here's a thought: The text for Move consistently uses the term "object" for what the Jedi can move. Would you allow a Jedi to Move a living being (or a droid)? If they want to hurl an officer into a stormtrooper, does the officer get a chance to resist being moved first?

So here's a thought: The text for Move consistently uses the term "object" for what the Jedi can move. Would you allow a Jedi to Move a living being (or a droid)? If they want to hurl an officer into a stormtrooper, does the officer get a chance to resist being moved first?

1) Yes. The rules explicitly allow for this. Sidebar on page 283, towards the bottom.

2) Yeah, I'd say the officer's Adversary talent should do it!

In the above example, I would assume you roll only once - for the officer, with his Adversary Talent coming into effect - rather than twice? If you succeed at picking up the officer, and have enough LS pips to power it, then you automatically deal damage to both the officer and stormtrooper?

Yup. And then gain some conflict for using a human being as a bludgeoning weapon

So here's a thought: The text for Move consistently uses the term "object" for what the Jedi can move. Would you allow a Jedi to Move a living being (or a droid)? If they want to hurl an officer into a stormtrooper, does the officer get a chance to resist being moved first?

In this case, since the goal is to deal damage to both the Officer and the Stormtrooper, I would treat this as a Autofire attack.

You'll need 1 Pip for Move, and 1 Pip for Strength upgrade to Sil 1. Possibly more for Range.

Difficulty of Sil 1, +1 for Autofire (2 purple), and adjust as per the highest ranged defense of the two targets.

Spend 2 Advantage to deal damage to the secondary target.

Unless you're Moving both the stormtrooper and the officer, autofire is unnecessary. It isn't an "autofire" attempt; it is just playing smart!! You should just need enough pips to move the officer, and the rules allow for whatever he hits to be damaged as well as his self being damaged.

Unless you're Moving both the stormtrooper and the officer, autofire is unnecessary. It isn't an "autofire" attempt; it is just playing smart!! You should just need enough pips to move the officer, and the rules allow for whatever he hits to get damaged as well as his self getting damaged as well.

I disagree. As the intent is to damage two targets, it should use some mechanic for multiple hits/targets. No free lunch.

If you're Moving both then you need to activate the Magnitude upgrade, and I would still suggest using some mechanic for multiple hits/targets.

Then what do you do with the rule that says, "Resulting impacts deal damage to both the target and the object being moved"... ignore it? House rule it?

Like I said, it's not a free lunch; it's simply "fighting smart" (albeit a little dark-leaning). They still have to succeed at a skill check and activate the Force power. So it's not free.

Pretty much ignore it.

I played a Force Wizard using Move a lot when EotE first came out. And as the person doing the "smart fighting" it felt a little cheesy getting the extra hit "for free."

But giving the officer a resist attempt before you throw him feels like it would bog down the mechanic. So I find it more elegant to apply a multiple target mechanic instead.

Thinking about it some more, I'd be okay with Linked, and for very large objects Blast could make sense.

Autofire for Move also opens the door for things like picking up a single object and hitting multiple targets.

Because "Bowling for Stormtroopers" is hilarious, and should be encouraged at all times.

The autofire clause says, "If a player wants to use multiple objects to hit multiple targets..." and that is not what we're talking about. We're using 1 object (an imperial soldier) to hit 1 target (another imperial soldier).

The way I see it, the autofire upgrade is for where you're trying to fling, say, two stormtroopers into two more stormtroopers. Then you'd need to declare the autofire attempt And you'd need at least 4 pips (basic, +1 magnitude, +1 silhouette, +range) and 2 advantage.

I agree with your breakdown, but for me it would cost 6 Advantage to get all 4 targets damaged.

Let me ask you this: in your method, does the 2nd thrown trooper take damage if you can't activate Autofire to make him hit your second target?

Then what do you do with the rule that says, "Resulting impacts deal damage to both the target and the object being moved"... ignore it? House rule it?

Like I said, it's not a free lunch; it's simply "fighting smart" (albeit a little dark-leaning). They still have to succeed at a skill check and activate the Force power. So it's not free.

Pretty much ignore it.

I played a Force Wizard using Move a lot when EotE first came out. And as the person doing the "smart fighting" it felt a little cheesy getting the extra hit "for free."

But giving the officer a resist attempt before you throw him feels like it would bog down the mechanic. So I find it more elegant to apply a multiple target mechanic instead.

Thinking about it some more, I'd be okay with Linked, and for very large objects Blast could make sense.

Autofire for Move also opens the door for things like picking up a single object and hitting multiple targets.

Because "Bowling for Stormtroopers" is hilarious, and should be encouraged at all times.

The autofire clause says, "If a player wants to use multiple objects to hit multiple targets..." and that is not what we're talking about. We're using 1 object (an imperial soldier) to hit 1 target (another imperial soldier).

The way I see it, the autofire upgrade is for where you're trying to fling, say, two stormtroopers into two more stormtroopers. Then you'd need to declare the autofire attempt And you'd need at least 4 pips (basic, +1 magnitude, +1 silhouette, +range) and 2 advantage.

I agree with your breakdown, but for me it would cost 6 Advantage to get all 4 targets damaged.

Let me ask you this: in your method, does the 2nd thrown trooper take damage if you can't activate Autofire to make him hit your second target?

Or you could just have the adversary talent involved in the difficulty. And have the stormtroopers setback for armor apply as well. since both adversary and armor should be involved.

The autofire clause says, "If a player wants to use multiple objects to hit multiple targets..." and that is not what we're talking about. We're using 1 object (an imperial soldier) to hit 1 target (another imperial soldier).

The way I see it, the autofire upgrade is for where you're trying to fling, say, two stormtroopers into two more stormtroopers. Then you'd need to declare the autofire attempt And you'd need at least 4 pips (basic, +1 magnitude, +1 silhouette, +range) and 2 advantage.

I agree with your breakdown, but for me it would cost 6 Advantage to get all 4 targets damaged.

Let me ask you this: in your method, does the 2nd thrown trooper take damage if you can't activate Autofire to make him hit your second target?

Eesh. That's too rich for my blood These are just minions, after all!

No, the second trooper "thrown" in that case wouldn't hit anything except for the ground, so perhaps he'd end up prone and with his dignity bruised, but otherwise none worse for the wear. The first trooper, and his target, would both take full damage. Which (incidentally) would be just enough to take them both out of play (10 damage + success-soak 5 = at least 6 wounds, just enough to kill off a stormtrooper).

Eesh. That's too rich for my blood These are just minions, after all!

No, the second trooper "thrown" in that case wouldn't hit anything except for the ground, so perhaps he'd end up prone and with his dignity bruised, but otherwise none worse for the wear. The first trooper, and his target, would both take full damage. Which (incidentally) would be just enough to take them both out of play (10 damage + success-soak 5 = at least 6 wounds, just enough to kill off a stormtrooper).

Cool.

Though, if they're the same minion group and you get enough for a crit, then the second thrown trooper might have fallen and can't get up.

I think someone mentioned Crit with Move earlier. I use the Improvised Weapons rating of Crit 5 for most Move objects.

Per RAW, if you're throwing an Imperial officer into a stormtrooper, you wouldn't need to invoke Magnitude Upgrades since you're only directly affecting a single object, that being the Imperial officer. As the text under the Control Upgrade to hurl objects cites, both the thrown object and the target suffer damage. In fact, the devs have even said that you'd use this aspect of Move to replicate the "Force slam" effect we see in the films.

As to whether using Move to hurl a living being into another living being generating Conflict, that's up to the individual GM. If both of them are trying to kill you and your allies, then as the GM, I probably wouldn't assign Conflict for using Move in that way since you're acting to defend yourself and your allies and remove the threat as quickly as possible. A part of the Jedi mindset is that if you can't avoid a fight, then you end it as quickly and mercifully as possible, be it with a lightsaber or a Force slam.

I suppose it has a lot to do with the narrative.

"I lift the officer up with the Force and use his body to beat down his subordinate"

vs.

"I reach out to the Force and push, hard. The officer goes hurtling into one of his stormtroopers."

One is egregious and conflict-worthy

Yes. The second one. The first sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

Eesh. That's too rich for my blood These are just minions, after all!

No, the second trooper "thrown" in that case wouldn't hit anything except for the ground, so perhaps he'd end up prone and with his dignity bruised, but otherwise none worse for the wear. The first trooper, and his target, would both take full damage. Which (incidentally) would be just enough to take them both out of play (10 damage + success-soak 5 = at least 6 wounds, just enough to kill off a stormtrooper).

Cool.

Though, if they're the same minion group and you get enough for a crit, then the second thrown trooper might have fallen and can't get up.

I think someone mentioned Crit with Move earlier. I use the Improvised Weapons rating of Crit 5 for most Move objects.

That's fair. I have some homebrewed items that give Move a crit rating, so I myself don't like to tread too much on its toes. But I will generally allow a critical injury if anyone gets a Triumph. So in that light, 5 Advantage is probably reasonable.

OK so on topic question.

One ofy players has really taken a shine and started investing experience into move more than any other players I've had.

He currently has 2 magnitude, 3 strength, 2 range and the control upgrade on 2 force dice.

With a lucky roll of 2 pips on each dice am I right in thinking he could lift 3 silhouette 2 items (says rocks) and auto-fire hurl them at a target?

1 pip to activate power

1 pip for magnitude

1 pip for strength

1 pip for range?

Obviously he'did have to make a discipline roll to actually hit the target but with a successful for that's 3x 20 damage (before soak)

OK so on topic question.

One ofy players has really taken a shine and started investing experience into move more than any other players I've had.

He currently has 2 magnitude, 3 strength, 2 range and the control upgrade on 2 force dice.

With a lucky roll of 2 pips on each dice am I right in thinking he could lift 3 silhouette 2 items (says rocks) and auto-fire hurl them at a target?

1 pip to activate power

1 pip for magnitude

1 pip for strength

1 pip for range?

Obviously he'did have to make a discipline roll to actually hit the target but with a successful for that's 3x 20 damage (before soak)

That all sounds right.

Just to be clear, you mean the damage would be 20+successes (apply soak). Then Autofire can be activated twice for more hits.