Going to try this in a few days when I next play.

I'm fairly happy with the Decimator build and don't think there's much I'd want to change there,apart from maybe predator or determination instead of lone Wolf. I'm still eying to figure out what I want there.

I'd be very grateful for any advice on the Vader build. I've never flown him before (I've actually got quite limited experience with flying small based ships) so would really appreciate it. I guess I'll get up close and dirty with the Decimator and keep Vader at something of a distance.

You dont want Dauntless on tanky decimator cause Ysanne wont trigger. I see what you want to do: boost if bump then fire from behind but do you need it on tanky dec? I woudl get rid of it, Lone Wolf and get predator. Lone Wolf gives you nothing on defense (you got palpi for that) and way less then predator on offense. With focus+pred im getting 3 hits almost all the time. (im using exacly that list just with pred)

Dauntless was just there to fill points to be honest. I found that I bumped a lot both accidentally and in purpose and being able to do something with that would be good (either a focus/target lock etc).

I went with Lone Wolf as it gives practically the same effect as Predator, unless facing very low PS ships, and has the potential to save me using Palpatine so I can use him for other situations if needed. I'll test Lone Wolf and see how it does. When I've played before I did generally have my two ships well out of range of each other. Thanks for the input!

FYI, you can Push the Limit off of Isaard's Evade Action to get basically the same benefit but at the beginning of combat after everyone has moved. It is actually better since you get the evade action too. Just watch out for stress lists.

Cheers, I'd actually got top 4 at a store championship with a Ysanne > Experimental Interface > Expose build. It did great but if I'd come across any stress builds I'd have been screwed.

And the problem is Experimental Interface takes away your precious Engine Upgrade, and that's just flat necessary for arc-dodging goodness - not that there's a LOT of swarms flying around right now, but screwing over jousters and miniswarms and (with Chiraneau) PS7< pilots is highly relevant.

The more I think about it, the more I REALLY like Engine Upgrade + Isard + Push the Limit. Being able to arc dodge (or at least TRY) after Aces have moved? Or Focus, Evade, AND Target Lock in the same turn? The thing is you'd probably want Chiraneau or Gunner to increase damage output.

Chiraneau (48) + EU (4) + Isard (4) + PTL (3) = 59. If you go for defensive as possible with Kenkirk (and rely on TL + Focus to deal damage), you could fit Palpatine on the Deci and Vader with standard build in there too. I don't like not having Predator, but in this case you're making up for it with the other actions.

I tried a dual decimators list today for the first time. Won 2 out of 3 games with it, and the loss could have been avoided if I hadn't been greedy (Vader-ed Soontir twice to remove him, but he was already facing the wrong direction and would have been out of the fight for one turn) :-)

The build is:

OICUNN

Dauntless

Intelligence Agent

Kallus

Daredevil

Anti-Pursuit Laser

PATROL LEADER

Vader

Gunner

I tried a variation with EU on Oicunn instead of Kallus and APL in one game, but I was only able to use EU once, so no real use. I like Kallus and APL more.

It's amazing how that build messes with the current Aces lists, Soontir can't even get into range of patrol leader or will simply die, Oicunn gets the smart dudes that seek safety by being close - well, 2 damage from initial overlap + daredevil teaches them, and if they didn't see it coming it might even be a third damage thanks to APL. The Dauntless+DD combo mostly works only once per game (it takes some time to clear the stress, and Oicunn draws a lot of fire), but DD alone gives some nice flexibility (to be used wisely, it might cost you much).

I was surprised by the performance of the decimators actually (so far only fought against them, mostly with swarms, and they weren't very impressive). Finished off Vader in a single turn (Oicunn overlaped him and removed shields with DD, PL dealt the killing blow).

I like the idea but why Kallus?

Well, I have the points left over, and with stress from DD and/or Dauntless you need some kind of modification.

I'd love to try a dual Decimator build with Vader. Once I've bought a few more ships I like I might buy a second one to try out...

*sigh*

Amazon sent me the French version of the Tie Advanced (twice in fact!) and I really don't fancy flying around as "Dark Vador", not to mention I can't read the upgrade cards etc so will be sending it back.

I was really looking forward story trying Vader out with a tank Kenkirk Decimator build tonight but now I dunno what I want to fill that 36 points with :/

I suppose it'll have to be some Ties as I only have those, a Firespray, a Defender and a Phantom

Bought a Tie FO expansion to try Omega Leader for fun. First game against As and Bs I battered won quite easily.

Second game against Dash with a Mangler, A and B, I was incredibly impressed with Omega Leader. He practically soloed Dash and it wasn't until right at the end he took a single damage. I'd love to try him in a bigger ship list at some point, he's not really the best to take with a tanked up Kenkirk.

Kenkirk did really well. I dropped Determination for Lone Wolf as I just didn't grt enough benefit from it. Lone Wolf worked out great, between that and Palpatine, Kenkirk lasted for an incredible length of time. If I hadn't messed up and got repeatedly bumped into debris 3 times I think I would have won. As it was my opponent had to leave and we called it a draw.

I think I will drop Engine Upgrade though. I just haven't got the use out of it I want and playing as a tank Kenkirk I'd rather take a focus action. Dauntless was great some I'm keeping that. Just need to decide what to replace EU with...

Bought a Tie FO expansion to try Omega Leader for fun. First game against As and Bs I battered won quite easily.

Second game against Dash with a Mangler, A and B, I was incredibly impressed with Omega Leader. He practically soloed Dash and it wasn't until right at the end he took a single damage. I'd love to try him in a bigger ship list at some point, he's not really the best to take with a tanked up Kenkirk.

Kenkirk did really well. I dropped Determination for Lone Wolf as I just didn't grt enough benefit from it. Lone Wolf worked out great, between that and Palpatine, Kenkirk lasted for an incredible length of time. If I hadn't messed up and got repeatedly bumped into debris 3 times I think I would have won. As it was my opponent had to leave and we called it a draw.

I think I will drop Engine Upgrade though. I just haven't got the use out of it I want and playing as a tank Kenkirk I'd rather take a focus action. Dauntless was great some I'm keeping that. Just need to decide what to replace EU with...

Woah there, good buddy. I run Kenkirk all the time, and EU is possibly his best upgrade. If you don't think so, it's possible that you're not in the mentality to properly take advantage of it yet. That, or your meta is still full of super fat turrets for some reason. Big ship boosting is seriously powerful business.

I think the reason that EU isn't serving you especially well is probably the same reason that Dauntless is paying huge dividends. Try veering your nose away from the enemy pile at the start of a few fights and see if it feels any easier to out flank with your Deci. Just my two cents.

Hah, you're probably right! Meta does seem to have a lot of fat turrets still to be honest. That and Aces. No TLTs really

So the interaction between Wampa (always deal a face-down damage card), Palpatine (turn Wampa's rolls into crits for that reason), and Lieutenant Colzet (spend a target lock to flip a face-down damage card face-UP) is really intriguing to me.

and as it turns out, those cards together cost 45 points, leaving plenty of room for a nice Decimator build to go with it!

Chiraneau - Veteran Instincts, Emperor Palpatine, Rebel Captive, Engine Upgrade

Wampa

Lt. Colzet - Title, Accuracy Corrector

Comes to 99 points. VI puts Chiraneau to 10, which is plenty to do some arc-dodging on Aces, and I went less defensive because Wampa and Colzet will attract a LOT of attention in the early game. Rebel Captive is there because it does mean things to Palpaces (and has let me arc-dodge a POE!), which is a common thing in my area - and discourages them gunning for Chiraneau too soon. Sensor Jammer is a strong contender for Colzet, as he's flying around flipping cards and being annoying so going more defensive is a good idea...

I also seriously considered Gunner on Chiraneau; Predator is another strong contender as it's action-independent and helps use Engine Upgrade more.

I also considered Kenkirk + Push the Limit + Emperor + Isard + Engine Upgrade, because it'd let you Boost in the Combat phase off of the Isard trigger, letting you TL/focus as needed in the Activation phase and potentially arc dodge after Aces move. 3 actions a turn is pretty good economy.

That sounds like a really fun list, be interested to hear how you get on with it. I don't think I'll stop flying a kenkirk /Palp/Ysanne build as it just lasts and lasts.

I had some success with Chirenaeu, experiment interface and expose (top 4 store championship) but found being stressed all the time made me very easy to get in arc and focus down. Though I suppose I could have been smarter with my EI usage.

I was thinking of messing around with a phantom with the Decimator at some point too. I did have a question about the decloaking/cloaking though.

If I've decloaked at the start of the movement phase, and then when it comes time to move can't get anyone in arc, am I allowed to recloak as my action?

Yes.

Dauntless was just there to fill points to be honest. I found that I bumped a lot both accidentally and in purpose and being able to do something with that would be good (either a focus/target lock etc)

Seismics isn't such a bad investment in your Kenkirk list actually.

That sounds like a really fun list, be interested to hear how you get on with it. I don't think I'll stop flying a kenkirk /Palp/Ysanne build as it just lasts and lasts.

I had some success with Chirenaeu, experiment interface and expose (top 4 store championship) but found being stressed all the time made me very easy to get in arc and focus down. Though I suppose I could have been smarter with my EI usage.

I was thinking of messing around with a phantom with the Decimator at some point too. I did have a question about the decloaking/cloaking though.

If I've decloaked at the start of the movement phase, and then when it comes time to move can't get anyone in arc, am I allowed to recloak as my action?

I've been planning on doing the same, as I really like flying both of those ships. I finally bought a Raider the other day so I can have Palpatine and expand my options now.

98 points

PILOTS

Commander Kenkirk (59)

VT-49 Decimator (44), Push the Limit (3), Emperor Palpatine (8), Ysanne Isard (4)

“Whisper” (39)

TIE Phantom (32), Fire-Control System (2), Veteran Instincts (1), Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

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I still debate on whether to take FCS or Sensor Jammer on Whisper.

Edit: I'm also not sure about PTL, because even though I can trigger off of Ysanne, it'd be nice to have EU as an option, but there's no room for it on Kenkirk.

I don't know if you've been paying much attention, but pretty soon there are going to be a LOT more Ordnance lists out there, some of which can dissolve a Decimator in a single barrage - Blount with Tracers + 5 Zs with Clusters/Guidance, 5 TIE Bombers with LRS/Extra Munitions/Flechette Torpedoes, 3 B-Wings (Nera, Ten Numb, Blue) with Crackshot/Guidance/EM/Proton Torps, Redline with LRS/EM/Clusters... the list goes on.

I'm not sure I see Kenkirk as viable in such an environment. The only way for large ships to survive will be to get REALLY good at arc dodging and destroying enemies they can't dodge, and the only way to do that is with the Engine Upgrade and Chiraneau. At this point, I'd rather lose Isard than EU. Hell, EU is going on my Palpshuttles from now on, too - though at least that's not half a list!

You bring up a fair point about the potential shift in meta, but I do wonder if many people will go that far with ordnance (in my local area).

For the time being I'm enjoying trying to work on this build and will definitely try and get better at using Engine Upgrade. CBMarkham was definitely right in saying I tend to prefer getting in close to get good shots off over avoiding getting shot.

It'll definitely depend on the area you live in. My store championship saw very little regen lists, I'm pretty sure I was the only 4 Y TLT list, and there were several Decimator lists. Will have to wait and see what happens. I'm not necessarily looking to use a Decimator competitively myself. More so for casual.

I don't know if you've been paying much attention, but pretty soon there are going to be a LOT more Ordnance lists out there, some of which can dissolve a Decimator in a single barrage - Blount with Tracers + 5 Zs with Clusters/Guidance, 5 TIE Bombers with LRS/Extra Munitions/Flechette Torpedoes, 3 B-Wings (Nera, Ten Numb, Blue) with Crackshot/Guidance/EM/Proton Torps, Redline with LRS/EM/Clusters... the list goes on.

I'm not sure I see Kenkirk as viable in such an environment. The only way for large ships to survive will be to get REALLY good at arc dodging and destroying enemies they can't dodge, and the only way to do that is with the Engine Upgrade and Chiraneau. At this point, I'd rather lose Isard than EU. Hell, EU is going on my Palpshuttles from now on, too - though at least that's not half a list!

Most ordnance builds are Pilot Skill 2 - 4. Kenkirk is PS 6. With engine, he is just as good at dodging arcs as Chiraneau is (against those lists). Oicunn too if you have an initiative bid and give it to the opponent (only matters if they have PS 4 ships).

I don't know if you've been paying much attention, but pretty soon there are going to be a LOT more Ordnance lists out there, some of which can dissolve a Decimator in a single barrage - Blount with Tracers + 5 Zs with Clusters/Guidance, 5 TIE Bombers with LRS/Extra Munitions/Flechette Torpedoes, 3 B-Wings (Nera, Ten Numb, Blue) with Crackshot/Guidance/EM/Proton Torps, Redline with LRS/EM/Clusters... the list goes on.

I'm not sure I see Kenkirk as viable in such an environment. The only way for large ships to survive will be to get REALLY good at arc dodging and destroying enemies they can't dodge, and the only way to do that is with the Engine Upgrade and Chiraneau. At this point, I'd rather lose Isard than EU. Hell, EU is going on my Palpshuttles from now on, too - though at least that's not half a list!

Most ordnance builds are Pilot Skill 2 - 4. Kenkirk is PS 6. With engine, he is just as good at dodging arcs as Chiraneau is (against those lists). Oicunn too if you have an initiative bid and give it to the opponent (only matters if they have PS 4 ships).

The problem isn't that he can't arc-dodge. The problem is that Kenkirk's advantage over Chiraneau is that he has that two automatic damage mitigation once he's down to 11 Hull due to Emperor+Isard; but when a list can deal 10+ damage in a single turn and you're relying on arc dodging to survive it becomes all too similar to Fat Han... and we know how well Fat Han has been doing lately.

Might as well go pure offense and PS and hope to kill what you can't dodge.

Against lists with 2 ships, I'd bring a Fatkirk all day long, but the more ships you add in the worse he starts to look. That's why I started looking at Kenkirk+PTL+Isard, because that gives you action economy AND lets you try arc dodging after aces have moved... once Isard kicks in.

That's why I started looking at Kenkirk+PTL+Isard, because that gives you action economy AND lets you try arc dodging after aces have moved... once Isard kicks in.

I used to run that combo all day, er' day, but there's just too much stress in the current meta. That, and when you hook up Predator, you remember how glorious it is to have access to your full dial.

After some time playing with both versions of the list, I find that you don't really need to move last against aces, at all. You just need to know how far they can move. Arc dodging with PTL is possible, but you're better off making sharper turns with your full dial so you can more easily aim to be behind them. Also, just make long distance moves followed by boosts to move distances they can't match in their tiny ships, unless the spend actions boosting, which means fewer actions for offense and defense.

Knowing where they'll end up and then boosting in response isn't much more of an advantage than knowing the limitations of where they can end up, and then exploiting that with your full dial at PS6, imho.