Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

It goes just like this

Dealt final damage card, ship is considered destroyed

Dead man's switch (since Trevura's ability is not immediate)

All cards discarded.

4 new cards dealt

Trevura may again dead man's switch.

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

I love when someone tries to argue without studying the rules.

Man seriously. Read rules reference. Just peek into it.

Xwing is divided into steps. Every game element is divided into steps.

You don't see or does not want to see that placing hull damage cards and destruction of the ship are two totally differend events. By the rules when you have damage card equal to hull value you are not destroyed by the fact of having cards but by the "Destroying" ruling that checks for hull and damage cards. And Tel-Frakkin-Trevura OVERRIDES the "Destroying" rule. There is no destruction event in this scenario. Destruction rule watchdogs hull values and Tel watchdog Destruction rule.

NO, GODFORSAKEN NO!!!! Bolded are 2 steps! Not 1!!!

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

It goes just like this

Dealt final damage card, ship is considered destroyed

Dead man's switch (since Trevura's ability is not immediate)

All cards discarded.

4 new cards dealt

Trevura may again dead man's switch.

The smart money is on "No".

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

Prove me. Give me a rule they do. I gave you the rule they dont.

Tel's ability occurs when you have zero hull.

Dead man's switch also occurs when you have zero hull.

Oh look... A rules question not in the rules subforum... How cute.

I'm ok with it working twice. Dead man's isn't exactly tearing up the Meta.

Tel's ability occurs when you have zero hull.

Dead man's switch also occurs when you have zero hull.

Did you know the world is flat!?

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

Dead man's switch triggers when you are destroyed. Tel's ability triggers when the damage cards exceed the hull value and before destroying the ship.

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

Dead man's switch triggers when you are destroyed. Tel's ability triggers when the damage cards exceed the hull value and before destroying the ship.

Too bad those aren't in separate steps. Dealing damage and being destroyed fall in the same step.

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

Dead man's switch triggers when you are destroyed. Tel's ability triggers when the damage cards exceed the hull value and before destroying the ship.

Too bad those aren't in separate steps. Dealing damage and being destroyed fall in the same step.

Man....i really dont wanna go personal on you but you really Push my Limit.

Did you even read my posts? For 30 frakkin minutes im trying to prove you they frakkin ARE!!

Tel's ability occurs when you have zero hull.

Dead man's switch also occurs when you have zero hull.

No. Both triggers when you are destroyed not when on 0 hull. With the difference than one occurs AFTER Destruction rule completes and another PREVENTS Destruction rule from occuring at all.

So if one of them prevented destruction from happening how can other one that needs destruction to complete trigger?

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

Tel's ability overrules the standard destroying ship rule. See Rules Reference, Golden Rules section.

Dead man's switch and Tel's ability occur at the same time. So I can do either one in any order.

Dead man's switch triggers when you are destroyed. Tel's ability triggers when the damage cards exceed the hull value and before destroying the ship.

Too bad those aren't in separate steps. Dealing damage and being destroyed fall in the same step.

Dealing damage cards and destroying the ship are actually two separate steps.

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

I love when someone tries to argue without studying the rules.

Man seriously. Read rules reference. Just peek into it.

Xwing is divided into steps. Every game element is divided into steps.

You don't see or does not want to see that placing hull damage cards and destruction of the ship are two totally differend events. By the rules when you have damage card equal to hull value you are not destroyed by the fact of having cards but by the "Destroying" ruling that checks for hull and damage cards. And Tel-Frakkin-Trevura OVERRIDES the "Destroying" rule. There is no destruction event in this scenario. Destruction rule watchdogs hull values and Tel watchdog Destruction rule.

It goes just like thisDealt final damage card, ship is considered destroyed

Dead man's switch (since Trevura's ability is not immediate)

All cards discarded.

4 new cards dealt

Trevura may again dead man's switch.

NO, GODFORSAKEN NO!!!! Bolded are 2 steps! Not 1!!!

It's definitively one step. Check your rule book.

Again, they take place at the same time, meaning you may do them in any order.

No they do not as destroying eveng doesnt happen at all. Tel trevura rule happens. It overrides the destruction rule.

If Tel would say "when you are destroyed instead" you would be right cause it would be:

-damage cards

-check hull

-destruction

-tel and DMS trigger

but there is no destruction step with current Tel wording.

But you have to deal all the cards that would destroy tel. At which point, it has no hull, and is destroyed. Tel's ability occurs after you have no hull. Which is also when dead man's switch occurs.

I love when someone tries to argue without studying the rules.

Man seriously. Read rules reference. Just peek into it.

Xwing is divided into steps. Every game element is divided into steps.

You don't see or does not want to see that placing hull damage cards and destruction of the ship are two totally differend events. By the rules when you have damage card equal to hull value you are not destroyed by the fact of having cards but by the "Destroying" ruling that checks for hull and damage cards. And Tel-Frakkin-Trevura OVERRIDES the "Destroying" rule. There is no destruction event in this scenario. Destruction rule watchdogs hull values and Tel watchdog Destruction rule.

It goes just like thisDealt final damage card, ship is considered destroyed

Dead man's switch (since Trevura's ability is not immediate)

All cards discarded.

4 new cards dealt

Trevura may again dead man's switch.

NO, GODFORSAKEN NO!!!! Bolded are 2 steps! Not 1!!!

It's definitively one step. Check your rule book.

..............i did.....

https://images-cdn.fantasyflightgames.com/filer_public/40/b4/40b44d5f-7a06-406c-ae6e-183c5297e796/swx36_rulesreference.pdf

Page 4 and 5 are attack and dealing damage cards. NO SINGLE WORD ABOUT DESTRUCTION.

Page 9. Dealing damage saying it can trigger destruction rule.

Page 10. Destroying ships. Ruling about destroying ship. When it occurs and how to handle it. NO SINGLE WORD ABOUT DEALING DAMAGE CARDS.

You still cannot comprehend that "destroyed" doesnt mean "destroyed,kaboomed, blown out of the sky" in xwing. Its just a state, like defender or attacker, and that triggers consequences for the ship(removing), can trigger cards (DMS) and can be prevented (Tel Trevura).

Dictionary destroyed != Xwing destroyed.

I can ALMOST see the OPs point, but agree with most that, no it doesn't work. The designers seemed pretty implicit by choice of words. DMS says when you ARE destroyed, Tel says would be destroyed. Assuming the OP argument of choice of timing, it would seem that by choosing DMS first, you are forgoing Tel's ability, because she(?) IS destroyed. If you trigger Tel's ability first, she is never destroyed, and never procs DMS.

You can't have it both ways.

That's the rules reference chief, not the actual rule book.

If you read the *actual* rule book, you'll see that it is exact and solely one step. Deal cards, destroyed. Things that then occur upon destruction occur.

I can ALMOST see the OPs point, but agree with most that, no it doesn't work. The designers seemed pretty implicit by choice of words. DMS days when you ARE destroyed, Tel says would be destroyed. Assuming the OP argument of voice of timing, it would seem that by choosing DMS first, you ate forgoing Tel's ability, because she (?) IS destroyed. If you trigger Tel's ability first, she is never destroyed, and never procs DMS.

You can't have it both ways.

Rules as written, you can. Because the damage cards are the only thing that can tell you when either ability goes off, you can do either in any order.

That's the rules reference chief, not the actual rule book.

....im speechless...

Please, please ,dont saying we are having this argument over "Learn to Play" rulebook. Cause there were no more booklets in my box nor there are any more pdfs on my site that i find under fantasyflight.com. You really consider "Learn to Play" actual rulebook?

That's the rules reference chief, not the actual rule book.

....im speechless...

Please, please ,dont saying we are having this argument over "Learn to Play" rulebook. Cause there were no more booklets in my box nor there are any more pdfs on my site that i find under fantasyflight.com. You really consider "Learn to Play" actual rulebook?

Considering the "there has been an awakening" article explicitly calls it "the new core rulebook" yes

If you read the *actual* rule book, you'll see that it is exact and solely one step. Deal cards, destroyed. Things that then occur upon destruction occur.

Rules reference page 1, Golden Rules:

"If a rule in this guide contradicts the Learn to Play booklet, the rule in this guide takes priority".

I would say that Tel is not actually destroyed when his ability takes place.

The card says, as others have pointed out, "The first time you would be destroyed, instead cancel..."

Because of the wording, the "instead" here means "instead of being destroyed".

Sure, you count up damage cards as you would normally during a ship's destruction. But it doesn't say to treat the ship as destroyed when you're doing that, and I think the English strongly implies that you are not actually destroyed the first time you would be destroyed.

Tel's procedure is to check for the same trigger as destruction, but not destroy the ship. In my opinion, this means it has priority over all destruction-related triggers, so you're not at liberty to pick the order of resolution with Dead Man's Switch.

And-- not that I think it's relevant to this argument, but it's interesting to point out-- Tel's ability is mandatory.

It's admittedly pretty unclear, and I wouldn't be too surprised to have it rule the other way in the FAQ.

If you read the *actual* rule book, you'll see that it is exact and solely one step. Deal cards, destroyed. Things that then occur upon destruction occur.

Ok whatever. Real life example, as i see ruling examples dont speak to you:

You aproach the thug in dark alley. You have an "upgrade card" that says: when a thug beats you loose your money. But you also have a skill saying: First time a thug would beat you , instead run fast to your home.

So what would happen? You would loose cash or run?

When and instead words were sponsors of todays episode of Sesame Street.

That's the rules reference chief, not the actual rule book.

....im speechless...

Please, please ,dont saying we are having this argument over "Learn to Play" rulebook. Cause there were no more booklets in my box nor there are any more pdfs on my site that i find under fantasyflight.com. You really consider "Learn to Play" actual rulebook?

Considering the "there has been an awakening" article explicitly calls it "the new core rulebook" yes

LEARN TO PLAY. LEARN.

Half of even semi advanced rules are skipped there. And you fight over such a advanced issue backuped by this?? Always a glossary or such a rules reference is considered more advanced then entry rulebook....

If you read the *actual* rule book, you'll see that it is exact and solely one step. Deal cards, destroyed. Things that then occur upon destruction occur.

Rules reference page 1, Golden Rules:

"If a rule in this guide contradicts the Learn to Play booklet, the rule in this guide takes priority".

THAT.