So I just thought of something stupid
4 protectors each with bodyguard/improved bodyguard, circle of shelter and dip into soresu defender and get supreme parry and improved reflect or shien expert for supreme reflect/improved reflect
mwahahaha we shall never fall or at least it'll take a really long time
Grenades and Rocket Launchers, Go for the blast damage.
Grenades and Rocket Launchers, Go for the blast damage.
Funny part about that because everyone has circle of shelter everyone can reflect the attack. With 3 ranks in reflect each that effectively reduces that damage of a direct hit thermal detonator by 20. OP
You are a monster and should probably come with a warning label.
Well if anyone tries this or already did let me know how it works out
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together.
On the other hand that sounds like a perfect description of an Imperial Knights detachment.....mhmm they are only lacking the armorer spec.
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better 
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better
If it's a planetary sized weapon like the Death Star it wouldn't be 35+ damage to characters. It would be 100 times that, so the damage is 3500 and no matter what the group would be vaporized. Now that 20 points reflected back to say the Death Star would be 100 times less damaging due to difference in weapon scale. It ultimately becomes .02 damage and the Death Star shrugs it off.
Using capital ship weapons it would be times 10 instead of 100, so the Jedi characters take 350 points of damage. They reflect a whopping 2 points of damage that is easily absorbed by the ship. Isn't weapon scale fun? 
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better
If it's a planetary sized weapon like the Death Star it wouldn't be 35+ damage to characters. It would be 100 times that, so the damage is 3500 and no matter what the group would be vaporized. Now that 20 points reflected back to say the Death Star would be 100 times less damaging due to difference in weapon scale. It ultimately becomes .02 damage and the Death Star shrugs it off.
Using capital ship weapons it would be times 10 instead of 100, so the Jedi characters take 350 points of damage. They reflect a whopping 2 points of damage that is easily absorbed by the ship. Isn't weapon scale fun?
Im pretty sure the weapon scale stays the same since its still the same shot unless there's some ruling about reflect I havent read. Still it makes no sense if you fire a big ass shot it some how shrinks when it gets reflected back by someone smaller
PS to be fair if the GM is using that to take down PCs (with no ship) then he's an ass
Edited by ninjahXPlenty of soak, but what's your counter for critical hits? Missile tubes and thermal detonators have a damage rating of 20 and a critical rating of 2, which means any hit will at least graze them and be capable of critting. Thermal detonators even have Vicious 4, which means any crit scored will be debilitating at best and catastrophic at worse.
Plenty of soak, but what's your counter for critical hits? Missile tubes and thermal detonators have a damage rating of 20 and a critical rating of 2, which means any hit will at least graze them and be capable of critting. Thermal detonators even have Vicious 4, which means any crit scored will be debilitating at best and catastrophic at worse.
simple crits can only be activated if they damage you so anything short of 10 thermal detonators wont do much. Even then I think the crit applies to only one person so with improved bodyguard if need be you can spread around the crits
Plenty of soak, but what's your counter for critical hits? Missile tubes and thermal detonators have a damage rating of 20 and a critical rating of 2, which means any hit will at least graze them and be capable of critting. Thermal detonators even have Vicious 4, which means any crit scored will be debilitating at best and catastrophic at worse.
simple crits can only be activated if they damage you so anything short of 10 thermal detonators wont do much. Even then I think the crit applies to only one person so with improved bodyguard if need be you can spread around the crits. Then just whittle them down with strain from the threats they generate
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better
If it's a planetary sized weapon like the Death Star it wouldn't be 35+ damage to characters. It would be 100 times that, so the damage is 3500 and no matter what the group would be vaporized. Now that 20 points reflected back to say the Death Star would be 100 times less damaging due to difference in weapon scale. It ultimately becomes .02 damage and the Death Star shrugs it off.
Using capital ship weapons it would be times 10 instead of 100, so the Jedi characters take 350 points of damage. They reflect a whopping 2 points of damage that is easily absorbed by the ship. Isn't weapon scale fun?
Im pretty sure the weapon scale stays the same since its still the same shot unless there's some ruling about reflect I havent read. Still it makes no sense if you fire a big ass shot it some how shrinks when it gets reflected back by someone smaller
PS to be fair if the GM is using that to take down PCs (with no ship) then he's an ass
Page 230 of F&D in the box titled Starships, Vehicles, and Scale, "When dealing with a vessel’s weapons, armor, and hull trauma threshold, every point is equal to 10 points of the equivalent characteristic in personal scale. For example, a laser cannon with a base damage of 3, mounted to a starfighter, deals 3 points of damage when fired at another spacecraft, but 30 points of damage when fired at a human. Conversely, a human-sized blaster rifle would need to deal 10 points of damage to a starship to inflict even 1 point of damage on it."
I followed the logic for starship weapons being 10 times more damage to a person on personal scale when it came to planetary scale weapons. A planetary scale weapon would deal 100 times the amount of damage compared to a personal scale weapon. Like I said in my example, the reflected damage is miniscule and absorbed easily while the party ends up dying due to massive damage.
Edited by ThePatriotAlternately, counter them with a party of four Technicians with Bad Motivator "Gee, you Jedi have been falling behind on your lightsaber maintenance, haven't you?"
PS a group of players cheesing the system to be invulnerable are the ones being an ass. The GM has the job of giving the PCs a challenge. If the only way to challenge them is through using starships attacking them then so be it.
Stupid party makeup?
Subtitle: A clown.
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better
If it's a planetary sized weapon like the Death Star it wouldn't be 35+ damage to characters. It would be 100 times that, so the damage is 3500 and no matter what the group would be vaporized. Now that 20 points reflected back to say the Death Star would be 100 times less damaging due to difference in weapon scale. It ultimately becomes .02 damage and the Death Star shrugs it off.
Using capital ship weapons it would be times 10 instead of 100, so the Jedi characters take 350 points of damage. They reflect a whopping 2 points of damage that is easily absorbed by the ship. Isn't weapon scale fun?
Im pretty sure the weapon scale stays the same since its still the same shot unless there's some ruling about reflect I havent read. Still it makes no sense if you fire a big ass shot it some how shrinks when it gets reflected back by someone smaller
PS to be fair if the GM is using that to take down PCs (with no ship) then he's an ass
I followed the logic for starship weapons being 10 times more damage to a person on personal scale when it came to planetary scale weapons. A planetary scale weapon would deal 100 times the amount of damage compared to a personal scale weapon. Like I said in my example, the reflected damage is miniscule and absorbed easily while the party ends up dying due to massive damage.
Its still the same weapon though so if they managed to reflect it , it would keep all the properties and damage of the original weapon ie breach X vicious X, still planetary level
Alternately, counter them with a party of four Technicians with Bad Motivator "Gee, you Jedi have been falling behind on your lightsaber maintenance, haven't you?"
do you not have to be engaged or short range to use this?
PS a group of players cheesing the system to be invulnerable are the ones being an ass. The GM has the job of giving the PCs a challenge. If the only way to challenge them is through using starships attacking them then so be it.
If they want to roleplay as fellow knights that stand by and protect each other I see no issues since that is literally what they are doing
Alternately, counter them with a party of four Technicians with Bad Motivator "Gee, you Jedi have been falling behind on your lightsaber maintenance, haven't you?"
do you not have to be engaged or short range to use this?
The talent doesn't specify a range limit, and one of the options is that the item was "about to fail anyway and the player noticed it (this is the character's decision)."
Alternately, counter them with a party of four Technicians with Bad Motivator "Gee, you Jedi have been falling behind on your lightsaber maintenance, haven't you?"
do you not have to be engaged or short range to use this?
The talent doesn't specify a range limit, and one of the options is that the item was "about to fail anyway and the player noticed it (this is the character's decision)."
Thats kinda broken
"Oh look the main cannon on your star destroyer is now broken."
Thats kinda broken
"Oh look the main cannon on your star destroyer is now broken."
Well, for one the device targeted is subject to DM approval, who might rule that you have to be very close to the cannon to use it, and for another, it only targets one device and it's a once per session ability, so congratulations, you've taken out one turbolaser battery. Good luck dealing with the other forty.
Another strategy to counter this setup: mobile commando squad using heavy blaster rifles at long range. Improved Reflect only works inside medium range, so there's no need to worry about that. The strategy here is to incapacitate the Jedi by overwhelming their strain thresholds. Even with a Willpower of 3 and all the Grit ranks in three trees, they maybe have 18 strain threshold apiece. Each hit will require at least two activations of Reflect to negate, and every autofire activation adds another hit. Meanwhile, activating Bodyguard also consumes strain. In order to recover strain, they have to make combat checks and generate advantage, which requires them to first maneuver to engaged range (forgoing bodyguard for those turns), forgo Circle of Protection, and prevents them from using the discount from Supreme Reflect. How long it will take depends on how many commandos you use and how they manage their strain in the face of this tactic, but since the commandos can continually move away as the Jedi attempt to close, they're liable to find themselves trapped in that defensive posture until they collapse from exhaustion.
All of this assumes that the Jedi can force the enemy to confront them rather than bypassing them, and if they're guarding a specific point they are even more vulnerable to long range fire, as to counter it they have to let themselves be dragged out of position.
Thats kinda broken
"Oh look the main cannon on your star destroyer is now broken."
Well, for one the device targeted is subject to DM approval, who might rule that you have to be very close to the cannon to use it, and for another, it only targets one device and it's a once per session ability, so congratulations, you've taken out one turbolaser battery. Good luck dealing with the other forty.
Another strategy to counter this setup: mobile commando squad using heavy blaster rifles at long range. Improved Reflect only works inside medium range, so there's no need to worry about that. The strategy here is to incapacitate the Jedi by overwhelming their strain thresholds. Even with a Willpower of 3 and all the Grit ranks in three trees, they maybe have 18 strain threshold apiece. Each hit will require at least two activations of Reflect to negate, and every autofire activation adds another hit. Meanwhile, activating Bodyguard also consumes strain. In order to recover strain, they have to make combat checks and generate advantage, which requires them to first maneuver to engaged range (forgoing bodyguard for those turns), forgo Circle of Protection, and prevents them from using the discount from Supreme Reflect. How long it will take depends on how many commandos you use and how they manage their strain in the face of this tactic, but since the commandos can continually move away as the Jedi attempt to close, they're liable to find themselves trapped in that defensive posture until they collapse from exhaustion.
In this situation bodyguard might not be necessary and sorry circle of shelter doesnt require an activation its passive they just have to move up using 2 revenuers (short to medium and the other for cover or whatever and the eventually medium to long with 2 maneuvers) they may be a little stained when they get there but theyll get there
Any planetary scale weapon will still devastate them, especially one with Blast since they're going to be packed rather tightly together
If that planetary scale weapon does 35+ dmg then yes their 20 dmg reduction wont do much against that, but if they miss with an energy based weapon...
"sir we just fired our big ass laser at the group of rebels are you sure that was the best coarse of action?"
"Of course if anything it was a merciful and swift death"
"Um sir that big ass laser we just fired is coming back right at us"
"..."
PS the more you have with this build the better
If it's a planetary sized weapon like the Death Star it wouldn't be 35+ damage to characters. It would be 100 times that, so the damage is 3500 and no matter what the group would be vaporized. Now that 20 points reflected back to say the Death Star would be 100 times less damaging due to difference in weapon scale. It ultimately becomes .02 damage and the Death Star shrugs it off.
Using capital ship weapons it would be times 10 instead of 100, so the Jedi characters take 350 points of damage. They reflect a whopping 2 points of damage that is easily absorbed by the ship. Isn't weapon scale fun?
Im pretty sure the weapon scale stays the same since its still the same shot unless there's some ruling about reflect I havent read. Still it makes no sense if you fire a big ass shot it some how shrinks when it gets reflected back by someone smaller
PS to be fair if the GM is using that to take down PCs (with no ship) then he's an ass
There are plenty of examples of Silhouette 2 and Silhouette 3 vehicles taking shots at guys on foot. Those vehicles can and often do pack auto-blasters and/or light blaster cannons (some have even more powerful weapons). Using such weapons on dangerous targets isn't being an ass, it's why the weapon is there.