Why can't we just use a curancey conversion chart in 2e? Guild Script to Bone Chips? Travel to a different planet, change your money into the local currency. Yeah sure there are a multitude of planetary systems out there, but you could have a random shrine world roll to see how much your guild script is worth and visa versa.

Because most currencies would be worthless on planets other than their planet of origin because they are only useful to people planning to head to the planet of origin. It simply wouldn't make any sense for currency conversion to happen at all.

Mechanically, having players keep track of their currency encourages them to loot everything for sale. Players will strip every single piece of gear from dead enemies and sell it, because it all adds up to them buying the really expensive stuff. Some GMs don't like this loot everything mentality.

Some GMs don't like this loot everything mentality.

It was a really wonderful moment early on in my campaign when my most loot-happy player finally 'got' the Influence system and stopped trying to take every friggin' thing that wasn't bolted down (and a few that were).

I understand that many people don't like the system and I'm aware that it has its shortcomings, but I'm really glad that FFG decided to go in that direction.

Some GMs don't like this loot everything mentality.

It was a really wonderful moment early on in my campaign when my most loot-happy player finally 'got' the Influence system and stopped trying to take every friggin' thing that wasn't bolted down (and a few that were).

I understand that many people don't like the system and I'm aware that it has its shortcomings, but I'm really glad that FFG decided to go in that direction.

Honestly, theres 3 real issues with this system that I see normally

1) getting must have items, such as ammo resupply, or basic equipment like flashlights (torches, stablights, not lasguns) and communications becomes unreliable

2) starting acquisitions are too valuable to spend on filling out said basic equipment, and instead demand focus on better weapons, armor, and specialist tools(auspex, multikey, combat vest, mechadendrites, etc). You could use starting acquisition to get more basic equipment, but you're basically hamstringing yourself as its a significantly harder roll than the flashlights, backpacks, and whatnot.

3) sacrificing influence to get gear early, but while that increases the power curve temporarily, it exacerbates problem number 1. Still, i see it banned often enough that i should add it.

Scarce or better "may" have been too high of a level for starting acquisitions, but based on the expected power curve of the released campaigns so far, The devs expect GMs to ramp up the difficulty faster rather than slower like in 1st edition, with much shorter campaigns and higher experience gains.

This also may have something to do with trying to cater more towards the pulpy side of 40k, considering most people can't take space orks, space elves, power armored mutant boy scouts, and space wizards/demons too seriously and see playing the infantryman who dies to everything as being utterly pointless.

A lot of this is off topic though, sorry.

The idea of never having standardized a currency in such a vast empire is kind of dumb, especially when you have rogue traders who go around wheeling and dealing across far edges of the empire and are supposed to somehow keep an account of profits, with no number to back it up.

I feel like they should have left in a currency system, just have anything above a certain rarity not buyable with coin/gelt/whatever. It represents the heirloom status of power weapons and the restricted status of heavy armor and ordinance on most worlds i feel. You need to have influence/power to even be able to get a look at such items, much less buy them.

1) getting must have items, such as ammo resupply, or basic equipment like flashlights (torches, stablights, not lasguns) and communications becomes unreliable

That sounds a problem with how often players get to make requisition tests. Something we aren't given any guidelines about.

The Imperium lacks the infrastructure to standardize currency. It doesn't have any need to as it tells planets what they must provide and then tries to give them what they need.

As for Rogue Traders, they make their profits outside the Imperium. Even if there was a standard currency within it, Rogue Traders spend most of their time where it would be useless.

Short answer: You can, it's just not in the rules.

Long Answer: It takes some gm prep work that you may or may not want to do, but can add alot of flavor to a campaign by enforcing small currencies on top of the awkward influence system.

I think the Influence system is problematic in general. Too much depends on sheer luck.

If one builds a character focussed on requisition, it gets too easy (even for rare items), if you don't, many simple things are too hard too get.

On the other Hand, it is too late now to introduce throne gelt cost for every item (the devs just wont do that in that stage).

I for myself would already be happy if we had a table to Requisition different amounts of "Money".

This would enable Players to have a Kind of token for sure when they Need it (for bribes, or to Exchange for items with the same rarity when needed).

E.g.:

> some coins: Abundant

> a workers monthly loan: Plentiful

> A suitcase full of Money: Very Rare

Without such Options, one might just Need to optimize the current System, especially for items with regular use (ammunition etc). Get commerce skill for a Chance of a Bonus (emperor provides), get a matching Peer Talent (+10 on influence Tests) and try to loot the one or other scarce item to trade it in for a +10 Bonus. Furthermore, requisitioning in a suitable Environment (e.g. a hive in most cases) should also grant a certain Bonus of at least +10 or even +20 (depending on the good and how common it is there).

That leaves one with an easy to get +30 Bonus and a Chance for an additional commerce Bonus. Ammunition for an average weapon would be common (+10), so for an Influence 30 Acolyte would be a Chance of 30+10+30 = 70%

Thats ok to me. As far as you can regularly loot scarce+ items and invest about 500XP in commerce/peer.

I think the Influence system is problematic in general. Too much depends on sheer luck.

If one builds a character focussed on requisition, it gets too easy (even for rare items), if you don't, many simple things are too hard too get.

On the other Hand, it is too late now to introduce throne gelt cost for every item (the devs just wont do that in that stage).

I for myself would already be happy if we had a table to Requisition different amounts of "Money".

This would enable Players to have a Kind of token for sure when they Need it (for bribes, or to Exchange for items with the same rarity when needed).

E.g.:

> some coins: Abundant

> a workers monthly loan: Plentiful

> A suitcase full of Money: Very Rare

Without such Options, one might just Need to optimize the current System, especially for items with regular use (ammunition etc). Get commerce skill for a Chance of a Bonus (emperor provides), get a matching Peer Talent (+10 on influence Tests) and try to loot the one or other scarce item to trade it in for a +10 Bonus. Furthermore, requisitioning in a suitable Environment (e.g. a hive in most cases) should also grant a certain Bonus of at least +10 or even +20 (depending on the good and how common it is there).

That leaves one with an easy to get +30 Bonus and a Chance for an additional commerce Bonus. Ammunition for an average weapon would be common (+10), so for an Influence 30 Acolyte would be a Chance of 30+10+30 = 70%

Thats ok to me. As far as you can regularly loot scarce+ items and invest about 500XP in commerce/peer.

This. When I first read through the influence system I liked it a lot. I still like it now because it discourages looting every pointless enemy they kill and it works fine for some things, but when conducting in game purchases it can be a bit problematic and immersion breaking with particularly bad rolls needing a quick justification on the fly as to why it failed.

And I really think it would be so simple as to put a "local currency" Requisition table into place. Problem solved.

You might Need a rule how it is possible to split and merge different "Money" then, but that should be do-able.

Not to toot my own horn, but I wrote up a currency/cost table for my group a while back and posted it here: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/194823-gelt-based-resource-system/

This isn't a standalone system; it augments the Requisition system, making it simple/easy to acquire cheaper things while your high-value products take a LOT of saving up to acquire. It also cuts the value out from under resale to make looting less feasible.

Main thing to consider is that 'gelt' is just the abstract value exchange rates are based on in this case (it isn't an actual standardized currency). When using a local currency, feel free to mix up the numbers while keeping the abstract value the same.

I think the Influence system is problematic in general. Too much depends on sheer luck.

If one builds a character focussed on requisition, it gets too easy (even for rare items), if you don't, many simple things are too hard too get.

So this (and some previous posters) is one of those examples where someone isn't "getting" the Requisition system.

The question you need to ask is "Why is my character making a Requisition test?"

- What's your game set-up? Are you a cadre of undercover agents, working behind the scenes to investigate a planet? Are you a hit-squad being used to take out key targets? Are you something else? This will determine the parameters of your "missions".

- For game set-ups where you have regular contact with your Inquisitor (or his agents), your Inquisitor will be providing you with your "basics". He's not going to send you out without a clip of ammo between you, is he? For anything that is required for a mission, whether that be ammo, an auspex, a bionic leg or whatever... the GM should just give that to you at the start of the mission . You don't need to roll for it, you don't need to burn Influence or take a subtelty hit...the Inquisitor is just giving you this stuff before the mission starts. This is like the GM describing there being a key in a room; it's a thing that's there. You don't need to roll to pick up a key in front of you. Likewise, you don't need to roll to have things that are given to you.

- On the other hand, however. Some game set-ups will mean that the players are free agents, working independently of their Inquisitor or his agents. In these games, your own resourcefulness is key and if you're not very resourceful (i.e. your Influence is low) then getting hold of what you consider "basics", like ammo and lasguns should actually be quite hard. PC basics , like weapons and armour, should often be restricted, illegal or noteworthy acquisitions in many places. Further, if you're keeping a low profile, then getting hold of gear that will make you stand out in a crowd is not something you should even be doing!

- What does all this mean? In short, it means that whether you're character is focused on Requisition or not, then you still have to ask the questions "do I need to?" and further "should I?", not just "can I?".

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So, where does all this fall into the currency debate?

The first question to ask is; what benefit does having a given monetary system give us ?

The second question to ask is: what are the drawbacks of having that monetary system ?

The third question is: do the benefits outweigh the drawbacks in terms of gameplay and immersion ?

If you think that giving every item a price, adjusting that price for local factors, having multiple currencies and fluctuating exchange rates and so on and so forth for all the details of a galaxy-spanning economic system is worth the effort, great! Go for it. Just don't be surprised when your players turn around and start playing Merchants & Marauders instead of Dark Heresy, as they traverse the galaxy stealing everything that's not nailed down in order to turn a profit so they can buy the next biggest gun/ship/whatever.

If, however, you consider that the Requisition system accounts for all those variable economic factors by giving the GM the option of saying "that's a hard test here, -20" or another simple modifier to your test, whilst also discouraging the "take every lasgun" mentality, then you'll see that although it does have its loopholes, on the whole the Requisition system accounts for something that should be very complex in a remarkably elegant fashion.

If, however, you consider that the Requisition system accounts for all those variable economic factors by giving the GM the option of saying "that's a hard test here, -20" or another simple modifier to your test, whilst also discouraging the "take every lasgun" mentality, then you'll see that although it does have its loopholes, on the whole the Requisition system accounts for something that should be very complex in a remarkably elegant fashion.

Elegant or Lazy; Both are apt depending on your personal views on the mechanic.

I think the Influence system is problematic in general. Too much depends on sheer luck.

If one builds a character focussed on requisition, it gets too easy (even for rare items), if you don't, many simple things are too hard too get.

So this (and some previous posters) is one of those examples where someone isn't "getting" the Requisition system.

The question you need to ask is "Why is my character making a Requisition test?"

I think it's a rather assumptive to suggest that the concept is not being 'got' by so many people. The GM is the only arbitrator of wealth in this game, not the actual sub system of currency or requisition rolls. As it has always been. The only difference really is the Requisition system is open to far more short cuts and hand waivum than the previous system.

Effectively however, the Requision system does exactly the same thing as having a currency system, only mitigating speed of play by removing personal accountability to the players inventory sheets. That is the actual core of the issue that keeps seeing threads like this pop up - some gms prefer players to manage their inventories as part of the experience, others just want to get on with the story. Is either wrong? No, not at all. Play as you will as you and your group wish to. That's the only important rule to all of this.

Elegant or Lazy; Both are apt depending on your personal views on the mechanic.

Heh, yeah. I won't disagree. On the other hand, if you consider the "non-lazy" approach, it should be a logistical nightmare. If it isn't, it's not modelling the complexities of the economic system adequately...if you take one short-cut, why aren't you stripping it back to the bare-bones, which is, essentially, what the Requisition system is? If you want to play stocks & shares, great. Who am I to stop you? If not and you want to get on with some DH, might as well skip the economics and get on with some shootin' and investigatin'.

I think it's a rather assumptive to suggest that the concept is not being 'got' by so many people.

Presumptive, perhaps, yes. Though by the language being used by GauntZero and others, it seems to me that they are missing the point. I'm not saying they don't understand the "how" of the mechanic, but rather the "why" of it.

Effectively however, the Requision system does exactly the same thing as having a currency system, only mitigating speed of play by removing personal accountability to the players inventory sheets. That is the actual core of the issue that keeps seeing threads like this pop up - some gms prefer players to manage their inventories as part of the experience, others just want to get on with the story. Is either wrong? No, not at all. Play as you will as you and your group wish to. That's the only important rule to all of this.

Again, I won't disagree. The Requisition system is, as you say, little more than an expedient method of representing the economic systems, whatever they may be, in the game. That's the crux of it. In the 40k galaxy there are thousands upon millions of different economies, some will be based on fortunes of gold or land, others will be based on what someone looks like, others on social status or any number of different standards by which to distribute and account for whatever passes for wealth in a given system or on a given planet.

So, your character comes along with 20 bars of gold. Good to buy a crate of lasguns on the last planet he was on. The local economy, however, is based not on material wealth but on social status. As an outsider, his social status is Zero, but he can buy his way up the ladder with material goods. How, then, do we go about translating his gold into status? Any ideas? Is it, in fact, worthwhile going through the rigmarole of translating Gold into Status, when the end result of him buying a crate of lasguns is the same? Is it not more expedient, more elegant (or lazy) and more to the point to use an abstract system of wealth that not only represents the characters physical wealth, but also his ability to call in favours, his personal charisma and ability to barter and any number of other factors that might come in to play?

I wholeheartedly agree with your concluding statement. However you want to play the game is the most important thing. All I caution against is trying to achieve something that is not going to satisfy because the setting is so incredibly vast that the job of detailing the minutiae is too great and further, may even give rise to a fundamental change in the feel of the setting/game; from Dark Heresy to Merchants & Marauders.

Not to toot my own horn, but I wrote up a currency/cost table for my group a while back and posted it here: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/194823-gelt-based-resource-system/

This isn't a standalone system; it augments the Requisition system, making it simple/easy to acquire cheaper things while your high-value products take a LOT of saving up to acquire. It also cuts the value out from under resale to make looting less feasible.

Main thing to consider is that 'gelt' is just the abstract value exchange rates are based on in this case (it isn't an actual standardized currency). When using a local currency, feel free to mix up the numbers while keeping the abstract value the same.

Had a look, that looks pretty good! My only concern is I have no idea how many Thrones to offer my players on a given mission without inbalancing things.

I guess I just have a good group; even though I instituted a currency system, none of them have turned it into Merchants & Marauders. Some of these guys I know usually do it, and there's some checks and balances in case someone tries (because I knew some might try), but I honestly can't name any time they've gathered loot up and sold it. There's been some cases where they gather loot up and stockpile it (they've got close to 100 lasguns and other weapons in various bolt-holes in the region, an armory full of stuff they've bought, etc.), and there's been one or two times where they turned in valuable items to a group as a Requisition test to lower the difficulty, but that's about it. Hell, the most effort the group went to looting at this point was for some fish.

They'd busted a Heretek, but something they noticed going into his lair was a half dozen massive, splendid fish-tanks full of various aquatic critters. After they defeated him and recovered some of his files, they even got the data on what kind they were (one tank was an example of life on Juno before they tortured the planet, another from some place called a 'Maiden World', etc.) and how to take care of them (once per month, perform the Rite of Replacement on the filter's charcoal, add these materials, feed at this time, etc). They spent days collecting the fish safely, putting plants into buckets and then shipping these fish-tanks to their base for decoration. This is for something with no actual value except impressing visitors at a later point (and they don't want visitors).

And Gregor, I personally use a pay-by-month system, where I figure out how much time goes by and they get a check at the end of each month (since they're never really not working, they're just doing boring, uneventful investigations and looking for leads into their next big case). Assuming standard calendar year, a paycheck of 1,000 gelt would give them 12,000 gelt. That is enough to buy one Very Rare item with 2,000 gelt leftover, or one with a 20% mark-up. 500 would leave them with 6,000 a year, which is up to 6 Rare items, assuming standard rates. That leaves no money for other things, however. All you have to do is figure out what kind of items you want them being able to access in a reasonable amount of time, and go off of that.

They don't pay for their food or lodgings usually, as that and healthcare are under the Inquisitor's bailiwick (it cuts down on 'you spend three hundred gelt on food a month, mark that off' and the Inquisitor does it in-game because the less his employees have to think on mundane things, the more they can investigate and purge. Also, Magos Biologis level Chiurgeon in the party). The money is basically to cover their personal lives and operational expenses beyond the norm. They buy ammunition for their specialist weaponry, better than average armor, drugs and specialist equipment, those kinds of things, etc. Sure, some unsavoury Acolyte could spend most of their month's pay on hookers and space-blow, but then when they need to buy grenades and other necessities for some huge event/showdown, they're woefully unprepared and the Inquisitor will go out of his way to say some kind of short, sarcastic remark at the Acolyte's closed-casket funeral before leaving.

It comes down to how you want to play the game and what you'd like the focus to be.

I would far rather have the point of playing be to work as agents and investigators of an Inquisitor, than to worry about how much I can afford to shoot a Bolt pistol this month. You never see or hear Eisenhorn's Acolytes worrying about expense, why should we?

If you have a group that really wants a monetary system, great. I don't think it would work well in mine and I'm glad that isn't the way the game is designed.

You never see or hear Eisenhorn's Acolytes worrying about expense, why should we?

But you do hear about Czevek exchanging ingots for script, and its adds some level of setting minutiae that is just...gratifying to the more narrative minded.

I sort of do like having the players (or when I'm a player) worry about keeping their fancy guns in ammo. Some of those sources are rare or restricted; just going 'oh, you have all the ammo you need' doesn't cut it for me, especially when the group hits up a planet without sources. Sure, it is easy to recharge las-cells and stubber/autogun ammo is relatively plentiful, but bolts? Plasma flasks? Needle rounds and melta fuel? It should be something you keep ammo in mind for if you want to keep using it.

It could also be an Inquisitor thing; some Inquisitors make sure their teams have every little thing they think the group needs. Others say 'here's your job, good luck!' Mine is a mixture; he provides some resources and expects the group to use them in the best way.

You never see or hear Eisenhorn's Acolytes worrying about expense, why should we?

But you do hear about Czevek exchanging ingots for script, and its adds some level of setting minutiae that is just...gratifying to the more narrative minded.

There are a thousand things from Eisenhorn that would add to a game of Dark Heresy, but I don't consider currency exchange one of them - and this is coming from someone who is likewise narrative-minded.

Some GMs don't like this loot everything mentality.

It was a really wonderful moment early on in my campaign when my most loot-happy player finally 'got' the Influence system and stopped trying to take every friggin' thing that wasn't bolted down (and a few that were).

I understand that many people don't like the system and I'm aware that it has its shortcomings, but I'm really glad that FFG decided to go in that direction.

Honestly, theres 3 real issues with this system that I see normally

1) getting must have items, such as ammo resupply, or basic equipment like flashlights (torches, stablights, not lasguns) and communications becomes unreliable

2) starting acquisitions are too valuable to spend on filling out said basic equipment, and instead demand focus on better weapons, armor, and specialist tools(auspex, multikey, combat vest, mechadendrites, etc). You could use starting acquisition to get more basic equipment, but you're basically hamstringing yourself as its a significantly harder roll than the flashlights, backpacks, and whatnot.

3) sacrificing influence to get gear early, but while that increases the power curve temporarily, it exacerbates problem number 1. Still, i see it banned often enough that i should add it.

Scarce or better "may" have been too high of a level for starting acquisitions, but based on the expected power curve of the released campaigns so far, The devs expect GMs to ramp up the difficulty faster rather than slower like in 1st edition, with much shorter campaigns and higher experience gains.

This also may have something to do with trying to cater more towards the pulpy side of 40k, considering most people can't take space orks, space elves, power armored mutant boy scouts, and space wizards/demons too seriously and see playing the infantryman who dies to everything as being utterly pointless.

A lot of this is off topic though, sorry.

The idea of never having standardized a currency in such a vast empire is kind of dumb, especially when you have rogue traders who go around wheeling and dealing across far edges of the empire and are supposed to somehow keep an account of profits, with no number to back it up.

I feel like they should have left in a currency system, just have anything above a certain rarity not buyable with coin/gelt/whatever. It represents the heirloom status of power weapons and the restricted status of heavy armor and ordinance on most worlds i feel. You need to have influence/power to even be able to get a look at such items, much less buy them.

Once upon a time I tried to fix this with a group by providing two separate starting requisition chances. The players did their weapons/armor and other stuff in a round of requisitions as normal.

Then they did it again but only taking things from the tools and gear section.

From a game play point of view it wasn't OP, it really didn't knock things out of balance. The reason I stopped doing it was because everyone tended to just get the same thing, there was no diversity.

The requisition was always:

Flak armor

Red dot laser sight

New weapon

Photo contacts

Respirator

Some form of specialist tool

One of the things Ive done is as follows;

Requisition can only be used on / with People with the "power" to deliver on those Goods & Services

(real world analogy - The Lord of War <Movie> - say a character wants to buy a tank go to the former Soviet Union during its collaspe and see Army Base Colonel - who happens to be corrupt)

Kings, Leaders, Lords, and the like are able to fulfill Requisitions (i.e. in the name of the Emperor I come to you for these things...)

Otherwise small items, civilian / serf wares, small arms, and black market good go for Gelt!

Worries about hoarders - Gelt and its accumulation draws attention <drops Subtly) to yourself (analogy - like a drug dealer and the IRS or other drug dealers or drug robbers)

Selling gear and what not - drops Subtly

That's it in essence - Requisitioning is not like spending money - its going up to people who should be Throne Loyal subjects of the Emperor and making them give you goods and services - remember this is a regime not modern day democracy...