Since it'll come pre-nerfed with "cant be tractor-beamed off the matt," anyone complaining about TB should be ashamed of themselves.

However, on any other ship, giving up your attack is going to be brutal. Considering you want that Tractor Beam token to be there for later attacks, you'll need to give up the attack of a higher PS pilot (which may be useful on the unique lambda's hmm...).

Generics man, generics. You can fit an awful lot of pain in at PS2. Dropping the agility will make everyone a baby-Wedge.

Large ships only have their agility reduced. They don't get pushed around by tractor beams. If you don't want to get moved, fly a large ship.

I apologize if this has been stated or asked before - my quick scan of this thread did not find it...

Is it allowable to use tractor beam to boost or barrel roll an opponent off the play area (destroying the opponent's ship)?

I apologize if this has been stated or asked before - my quick scan of this thread did not find it...

Is it allowable to use tractor beam to boost or barrel roll an opponent off the play area (destroying the opponent's ship)?

No it isn't, a while before the Tractor Beams were revealed the rules were changed so you cannot boost or barrel roll off the playing area anymore. Most likely because of the tractor beams.

You can however try to set them up so they have no choice but to fly themselves off. You can't really take too many chances flying at the edge anymore.

Thanks Dagonet. Clear as day in the rules reference: boost and barrel roll cannot be performed if it would cause the ship to leave the play area.

I'll add a third, use Large base ship, they can't be move.

Sure, they still lose one agility, but I always roll blank anyway so....

Two ways to help against tractor beams

1) put rocks close to your side and fly past em

2) Don't take rocks. Use debris

There tractor beam not as bad

I'll add a third, use Large base ship, they can't be move.

Sure, they still lose one agility, but I always roll blank anyway so....

Eh, I've had times when that one green on a YV-666 has pulled through for me. Losing it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but it's something , I guess. It also will basically force C-3P0, when used, to have to activated on the tractor beam attack (if it's first).

Still, large base ships will shine a bit here. It should do... interesting... things to the meta. But in the long run, don't see it killing much diversity, which is a good thing. We'll have tractor carriers, probably often with a miniswarm to take advantage with, arc dodgers which can avoid being shot at with tractor beams, big ships to basically ignore tractor beams, swarms looking to take advantage of the big ships low agility totals, and plenty of folks just flying whatever they're best with to take on all comers in a diverse meta.

The new TIE Defender, however, does terrify me a little when it arrives. Still, they'll be more than beatable.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Bingo.

In the worst case scenario, we will see a rise in the use of these two ships to make tractor beam use, well, useless, and then we will see the meta react to their increased use, and then react to that, and then... You get the point.

It may be whined about for a bit, but building to counter it is easier than it was/is for any meta forming upgrade which proceeded it. TLT takes some well thought out list building and strategy to defeat. With Tractor beam, you've nullified it completely if you take double Deci (not that I would enjoy seeing that, but it would get the job done).

Remember when Dash was the new hotness, and people couldn't stop complaining about how broken he was, because he got to ignore rocks?Tractor beams are next up (it might wait until Imperial Vets lands to really kick into high gear, not sure). The forums are going to be thick with complaints about how utterly brokenly overpowered they are, because (like Dash) they make the play space asymmetrical. If a player has a tractor, all of a sudden the rocks are way bigger for the other side, and that means they'll have to fly their list differently. People hate that. There is also the issue that they seem to snowball a little bit, in that if you can hit and fling a ship into rocks, that ship probably won't get actions next turn, which means they can get tractor beamed again more easily, and if there's another rock nearby...All of that means that any productive discussion about tractor beams is going to get swamped by people yelling about how broken they are, because they won't adapt. Get your theorycrafting and your mathwing in now, folks!

The low post count dudes with no avatars are waiting to spam the forums with their doomsaying and sky falling moans and groans.

I maintain that if Ion Cannons aren't dominating the meta then Tractor Beams won't either.

TB equipped vessery is going to dominate alot of people if the games I've been playing are any indication shot denial from being pushed around is highly annoying for the other guy.

My Jonas brothers 2.0 list using /D and ion was just brutal and with the points freed up you can make Jonas more than just a buffbot.

Pretty much my list, well I take 1 TB and 1 Ion.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

Which will not bother the Ghost and Decimator in the slightest. They are already Agi 0.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

No, it literally never could (outside of Kenkirk). You can't have an agility lower than zero.

I think it will be popular for a while with lots of complaining and then go away once people realise it's not that good.

If you face a big ship you are going to be very sad you brought that cannon on your defender instead of an ion or flachet. In fact I think most of the time you would rather have an ion cannon.

The flechette gets 1 damage, since bigs arnt hull 4 or less, and the Ion has to shot twice to get its affect. TB can still matter because of the -1 Agi. Especially think of it against things like 3PO, or Brobots.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

Which will not bother the Ghost and Decimator in the slightest. They are already Agi 0.

Can change that Range 3 through a rock shot from 2 Def to 0, if your firing a secondary and have already TBd them.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

No, it literally never could (outside of Kenkirk). You can't have an agility lower than zero.

See my post about range 3.

Ghost and Decimator are immune to tractor. Should be fine.

Not ENTIRELY Immune. They still suffer the -1 Agi, while not huge it could come into play in a few instances.

No, it literally never could (outside of Kenkirk). You can't have an agility lower than zero.

See my post about range 3.

That's incorrect. agility does not effect range bonus or obstacle bonus. They would still get 2 dice for defense, even if they had 20 tractor beam tokens.

I'll repeat and quote myself from the "the phantomsky is falling" thread here:

@everybody who thinks the **** thing is too good:

it's very easy:

if you think it's -that- broken, fly the **** thing yourself

gras is always greener on the other side

don't get me wrong, I love it on 1+ of my defenders. but it has a lot of disadvantages to the advantages, too. if you think it is that good, grab yourself 5 scyks(sp?) and go to town.. please, do.

or get yourself 3 defenders and laugh like a maniac when firing the beams (like I do ), and see where that takes you;

yelling "the sky is falling, because the other guy with X can do Y" is easy..

so try it yourself and see if you win as easy with a beamlist as you think others do.

Any big wrinkle in the meta yes. Thinking people will whine and scream "IT'S OP!" I think not. Well they may still whine, but we can't stop that :/

To take FULL advantage of the tractor beam, ideally you have to shoot it before your opponents do to allow a few things to take into effect:

-Move them onto a rock to stop them from shooting

-Decrease their agility so that the rest of your squad can take advantage when they shoot

Otherwise all you are doing is moving them, which I agree is still impactful, but not as much if they have already shot and if most of your ships already shot as well. There are a few ships and combos that I've already thought about that can actually take full advantage of the tractor beam. My "top" one right now is Serissu with VI. For 24 pts you have PS 10 with a decently mobile tractor beam and for an added 3 pts, add on a stealth device to mitigate some damage. If all you want to do is field a tractor beam, Serissu will offer probably the best point cost for it. Now the big one once Imperial Veterans comes out is going to be Rexler and/or Vessery with /D carrying tractor beams. VI definitely increases their effectiveness with tractor beam and I will assume with most Tie/D titled Defenders, its going to be between Tractor Beam and Ion Cannon that players will choose. The Mist Hunter is another, which automatically gets it, but most likely could be using 4-LOM since Zuckuss' pilot ability could be considered counter intuitive to what you are trying to do, which is reduce the opponent's agility. Brobots can take two cannons so that could add another layer to them. Then finally the Scyk swarm would best perform with Torkil Mux added in the list to make one of your opponents ships a 0 pilot skill during combat phase where it matters against tractor beams.

Again, a big wrinkle in the meta, but I don't think your going to be able to just slap a tractor beam where ever you can and call it good.

Think the whiners will coin

"Tractor wing"

Or

"Beam wing"

I see 3-4 lists/ships that will probably benefit from tractor a lot.

2-3 Tractor Scyks maximizing damage of a Z-95 swarm will very probably be a decent jousting list that could be dangerous to the can't touch this ace ships that are good inthe meta.

4-B-Wings with Tractor and FCS are very flexible in that you can decide to use your cannon just when it's opportune while not costing you much, and can easily be mixed to TLTs and other control elements for very nice rebel lists other than the currently flown.

Brobots might leave a Seismic or Glitterstim at home in order to run it alongside Manglers. For 2 points only the enemy needs to be on its heels all game long. And it's also rerollable with IG-88B or you can decide to switch from a missed mangler shot to tractors or vice-versa.

I can also imagine it on a Palpshuttle if you have a point left Because you took Crackshot or VI on Vader instead of a 2 point talent. (Classic Palpmobile should be at 99 then). I have actually taken a lot of shots with my Shuttle lately because Soonts and Vader were occupying them in a way that they just ran in front of my shuttle trying to dodge the aces. A well placed Tractor shot in such a situation can just turn the game around!

The obvious choice are of course Defenders with /D title. But i am not actually that convinced about 2-3 generics with it. I think it will really be Vessery making a very strong appearance in the future. In mean he will be Top 3 imperial ships at least after Veterans hit. His ability is just too good with /D title, and tractor makes him a total menace!

So yes i think Tractors will really play a big role in the meta as soon as available. But then all factions have at least decent lists with them, and Imps have just a great pilot for it. But i don't see why i should be concerned about that. I really look forward towards trying these new options and see how they change the meta.

It is funny all these wild predictions but it isn't really something that you can identify as meta defining unlike TLT. So tractor beams, how will they affect this meta.

Well right now they won't Not until Imperial Veterans come out and then there might be some adjustment to the Meta as Defenders may attempt to make another appearance. So far here is the current meta.

Acewing (High Pilot Skill ships that dodge Arcs and have consistant dice modifications) (Soontir, Brobots)

TLT Y-wings (Scum and Rebels with stressbot)

Big Brother and Little Brother (old 2 ship meta like Dash Corran which still shows up post large ship nerf)

So against Acewing, well not too many Aces have cannon slots with the exception of brobots. If they don't bid for initiative and go for standard FCS and other builds they may pick this up for 2 points but many brobots already have a full list. As for the rest of the Aces they will be bidding on initiative and shooting before tractor beams so it will not have the full effect needed for them to be forced into making major adjustments. Soontir is Pskill 9 not the OGP Shuttle.

Against TLTs, 0 damge vs 2 is what it comes down. Sure you may beat them in pilot skill but you have to throw them on a rock in which they might be taking debris clouds or even pebbles to prevent that and flying away from rocks. But then that is sacrificing an attack to possibly temporary remove an attack. Also placing them on a rock has a chance of obstructing your shots too depending on the final position which negates the tractor-beam token for follow up shots.

If tractor beams becomes a thing you will start to see large ships come back. Much like how Fat Han was the counter to Whisper when Wave 4 hit Large ships tend to be the perfect counter to ion tokens tractor beam tokens and arc dodgers.

People like to think balance is that of a 2 dish scale. It is not it is more like a circular plate on a single tip in the center. Adjust items on one side and the plate begins to tip in a whole new direction. The meta is more than just decrease value X to increase value Y. It is more like F _net =F _g +F _y +F _t +F _n +F _x with each F being a 2 dimensional vector. Some cancel each other out while others continue to pull in their direction but the inevitable is that F _net begins to move towards one direction until the values are readjusted then it may move in another direction.

In any versus game, anything that lets the opponent move your figures will usually be whined about.

His cheeto covered fingers are on my mini!!!