Just a squad idea I am toying with

Vader + Marksmanship + title + ATC + Engine Upgrade + Conc Missiles (41)

Inquisitor + v1 + PtL + Conc Missiles + Autothrusters* (35)

Academy TIE (12)

Academy TIE (12)

*Autothrusters can be swapped out for TIE Mk. II (99 point bid) or Guidance Chips (98 pt bid)

Essentially you use the Academies as blockers, while you action the everloving crap out of the two aces. Inquisitor can TL and get the free evade, then boost or barrel roll as needed, then push the limit to focus, or perform the other repositioning action if the situation calls for it. At PS 8 that's not bad. If you take the Mk. II then the ensuing stress is even easier to deal with. And of course I've run this version of Vader quite a few times, he's expensive but good god is he deadly, especially to crit-susceptible craft like Y-Wings, Pancakes, Epic ships, and HWKs. I think, with a list like this, if you manage to block an opposing ace you could take almost any one of them out in a single round.

You want VI and Proton Rockets on Vader. If you insist upon Marksmanship, Cluster Missiles would also be decent because Marksmanship lasts for multiple attacks. But really, you want VI on Vader, Prockets on Engine Upgrade Vader at PS 11 too OP ban pls

The problem I have with your squad is that those 2 academy TIEs are garbage and will accomplish nothing. Soap bubbles with bubble blowers as weapons. Replace those with something else. Accuracy Corrector Tempest Squadron with Proton Rockets?

Vader needs no missiles, he's the boss with Primary+Crit

Protons are good, but you want that Mod slot for EU and AT goodness, and the Advanced Bro's eat up 2\3 points (and 34 points is just a bit not enough for Fel with AT)

so Carnor

Maybe like this

No, no I don't want Prockets and VI on Vader. If I did, I'd put them on him, along with everyone else. Concussion Missiles over Clusters because the latter can't fire at R3, and to punch through high agility targets as well. And most of the time, PS 11 is a waste. If I encounter an Ace with higher PS I just rely on actually flying well to get them in arc. I was hoping to discourage the first reply being, well basically everything you just said by saying "And of course I've run this version of Vader quite a few times, he's expensive but good god is he deadly", but it seems that didn't work.

And I explained the role of the Academy TIEs. Overtly. They're blockers. With good planning, they deny aces their actions. No focus, no evade, no boost, no hope. It doesn't really matter if they get more than a handful of shots all game.

And lastly... no Tempest. Ever. Though this is really just a personal taste, I hate the way the normal TIE Advanced flies. I've tried every pilot a few times, with a few different loadouts, and can honestly say that while the new fixes may help it, it's just not the ship for me. Also having an expensive ship with more upgrades defeats the purpose of expendable blockers.

Vader needs no missiles, he's the boss with Primary+Crit

Protons are good, but you want that Mod slot for EU and AT goodness, and the Advanced Bro's eat up 2\3 points (and 34 points is just a bit not enough for Fel with AT)

so Carnor

Maybe like this

Hmm. I could get behind Carnor, but I've been flying him a lot lately. Maybe by the time Wave 8 actually hits the shelves I'll be in the mood for him again. (whenever that ends up being)

EDIT: Also Stealth Device and I can never be friends.

ATC means you really don't need Marksmanship. Marksmanship is a slow death for the Dark Lord of the Sith since you don't get the option to spend or not spend your focus token. You will regret not having a focus when you roll three eyes on defense.

Full disclosure, I'm not a competition minded player. That said, while it's in vouge to blow your ept on VI, I think it's a waste. Chances are you are going to be flying against a bunch of generic pilots Vader will out pilot skill by 3-6 points already, you don't need VI.

Same goes for the Inquisitor. Running the TAP title? That's a match made for Juke ept if I've ever seen it. Don't believe me? Ask around how good a reliable evade action plus Juke is. I'm down for Proton Rockets on both though.

ATC means you really don't need Marksmanship. Marksmanship is a slow death for the Dark Lord of the Sith since you don't get the option to spend or not spend your focus token. You will regret not having a focus when you roll three eyes on defense.

Full disclosure, I'm not a competition minded player. That said, while it's in vouge to blow your ept on VI, I think it's a waste. Chances are you are going to be flying against a bunch of generic pilots Vader will out pilot skill by 3-6 points already, you don't need VI.

Same goes for the Inquisitor. Running the TAP title? That's a match made for Juke ept if I've ever seen it. Don't believe me? Ask around how good a reliable evade action plus Juke is. I'm down for Proton Rockets on both though.

That's why I usually grab the TL on a different turn, then Marksmanship and Evade. Unless of course I know I'm not being shot at that turn, then I TL and Marksman. TL to fire, marksman to take care of focus tokens, Concussion missiles to change a blank to a hit. Most of the time the end result is Crit, Hit, Hit, Hit. Sometimes I get lucky and it's Crit, Crit, Hit, Hit. Unless my dice luck is frozen solid, in which case it's usually just 2 hits.

ATC is for the rounds after firing the missile. It's actually defensive in a way. I just keep the TL on them and add the crit results, and save all my tokens for defense. It's surprisingly effective.

For the same points you'd get more mileage out of Predator on Vader instead of Marksmanship. For three points Marksmanship only gives you a slightly better focus that can only be used when attacking. Predator and taking the focus action gives you a reroll and a focus effect on your attacks. Your normal attacks and your Concussion missile will all hit harder with that reroll than they will by getting to make one eyeball a crit instead of a hit. If you end up not rolling any eyeballs, Marksmanship is a wasted action. A focus that isn't needed might be needed on defense.

If you want range three ordnance on Vader, I'd consider giving The Inquisitor Proton Rockets and using the extra point to get Homing Missiles on Vader. That way Vader can preserve his Target Lock to use with ATC in the following round.

You want VI and Proton Rockets on Vader. If you insist upon Marksmanship, Cluster Missiles would also be decent because Marksmanship lasts for multiple attacks. But really, you want VI on Vader, Prockets on Engine Upgrade Vader at PS 11 too OP ban pls

The problem I have with your squad is that those 2 academy TIEs are garbage and will accomplish nothing. Soap bubbles with bubble blowers as weapons. Replace those with something else. Accuracy Corrector Tempest Squadron with Proton Rockets?

Ah, the Internet... Where people can make a completely subjective, personal opinion sound like some sort of inarguable fact...

You want VI and Proton Rockets on Vader. If you insist upon Marksmanship, Cluster Missiles would also be decent because Marksmanship lasts for multiple attacks. But really, you want VI on Vader, Prockets on Engine Upgrade Vader at PS 11 too OP ban pls

The problem I have with your squad is that those 2 academy TIEs are garbage and will accomplish nothing. Soap bubbles with bubble blowers as weapons. Replace those with something else. Accuracy Corrector Tempest Squadron with Proton Rockets?

Ah, the Internet... Where people can make a completely subjective, personal opinion sound like some sort of inarguable fact...

Hey hey now, I may refute his or her opinion on the squad but there's no need to make it a personal attack. We're all friends here, right?

Have you looked at Calculation as an option for Vader? A static ability that can turn two eyes into hits or, more likely, push a single eye into a crit. Not bad for a two attack dice ship and it leaves your actions uncluttered.

It also saves you two points for initiative.

Ditch the missiles and upgrade the Academies to Cracksquadrons.

Have you looked at Calculation as an option for Vader? A static ability that can turn two eyes into hits or, more likely, push a single eye into a crit. Not bad for a two attack dice ship and it leaves your actions uncluttered.

It also saves you two points for initiative.

Never been one to care about initiative bids.

The problem I have with your squad is that those 2 academy TIEs are garbage and will accomplish nothing. Soap bubbles with bubble blowers as weapons. Replace those with something else. Accuracy Corrector Tempest Squadron with Proton Rockets?

It's worth noting that the Team Covenant aces season two final featured both players having lists with two ships similar to "soap bubbles with bubble blowers": Blair's list had two Binayre pirates (no upgrades) and Matt Shadowlord's list had an Academy Tie and a Epsilon squad pilot (the base Tie/FO). In the hands of good players, a pair of PS1 blockers like these can be of immense value and should not be so easily dismissed.

The problem I have with your squad is that those 2 academy TIEs are garbage and will accomplish nothing. Soap bubbles with bubble blowers as weapons. Replace those with something else. Accuracy Corrector Tempest Squadron with Proton Rockets?

It's worth noting that the Team Covenant aces season two final featured both players having lists with two ships similar to "soap bubbles with bubble blowers": Blair's list had two Binayre pirates (no upgrades) and Matt Shadowlord's list had an Academy Tie and a Epsilon squad pilot (the base Tie/FO). In the hands of good players, a pair of PS1 blockers like these can be of immense value and should not be so easily dismissed.

That's the thing, those soap bubbles are only good for blocking.

An AC Tempest with a procket can block just as well, while being more durable and powerful. In the hands of a good player a Procket on an AC Tempest blocker will do more work than 2 soap bubbles will.

But of course, you fools continue to insist that 2 attack dice soap bubbles aren't obsolete. Go ahead, continue to believe that 5 academy pilots or Bandit Squadron Pilots are a better use of points than 4 Crack Squadrons or 4 Z-95's with Ion Pulse Missiles and Guidance Chips.

Bro, only Han takes Marksmanship, and Han is dead.

Have you looked at Calculation as an option for Vader? A static ability that can turn two eyes into hits or, more likely, push a single eye into a crit. Not bad for a two attack dice ship and it leaves your actions uncluttered.

It also saves you two points for initiative.

Never been one to care about initiative bids.

You mentioned them in your OP.

But more importantly, Calculation is out then? I agree that Marksmanship isn't a bad option for the missiles, but after that attack I think Calculation might provide you with more long term advantage.

But of course, you fools

I'd rather be a fool, continuing to try and make all ships work, than be an abrasive personality with a serious one track posting issue.

personally, I also don't care for VI on Vader, 9 times out of 10, it's wasted. I do like Adrenalin Rush though, nothing like K turning behind someone and having all your options ready to go, especially with a Proton Rockets ready to go as well.. but e each have our preferences. Some good thoughts here and .. some I wouldn't use lol.. to be nice about it..

My 9s list usually has Vader, Fel and a VI'd Turr.. I give them all some fluff to do the job, and it is usually a tough nut to crack, I have many more wins than losses..

Have you looked at Calculation as an option for Vader? A static ability that can turn two eyes into hits or, more likely, push a single eye into a crit. Not bad for a two attack dice ship and it leaves your actions uncluttered.

It also saves you two points for initiative.

Never been one to care about initiative bids.

You mentioned them in your OP.

But more importantly, Calculation is out then? I agree that Marksmanship isn't a bad option for the missiles, but after that attack I think Calculation might provide you with more long term advantage.

See, I think the reason I like Marksmanship over Calculation is that it works on multiple dice. I know it's sort of a luck thing, but the truth is that you sometimes get that statistical variance and this game can really hinge on them. We've all had that evade roll that came up with 4 focuses (and us sitting with our "play it safe statistically" evade token) and other oddball anomalies like that. And in my experience Marksmanship has worked out enough times to justify the opportunity cost. The other great thing about Marksmanship is that mid-late game, it really shines on Vader, once your opponent's shields have dropped. With ATC, you can usually just leave that TL on there too and use his other actions defensively. So you can marksmanship and evade (or focus if you feel it's better). But I've had plenty of games (both before and after ATC) where I was behind, and suddenly just gotten that wonderful attack roll that completely shifts the game around.

Honestly, Calculation probably ends up helping you about the same statistically, but it doesn't have that beautiful variance that Marksmanship can provide. That one or two game changing rolls that just happen.

EDIT: All that being said, I've only acquired Calculation in the last few days, so I'm probably gonna give it a try at some point just to experiment. I mean it is a valid option after all.

Oh and I mentioned initiative bids because I don't tend to sweat it, but since I posted this list on a forum I thought other people might enjoy the option, and also because each one of the mentioned upgrades all have their own advantages.

It's your list and what works best for you is what you should use.

Why are people suggesting Prockets on the inquisitor? You are paying for the title and the title is for TL and Evade not focus. You're spending points working against yourself. I'd say Juke or VI are better inquisitor options and no one is putting MKII on them either since it's the same slot as autothrusters.

All that being said, I'm all for Bucking the meta builds but doing it just to be that guy who is doing it inspite of your own list is a bit silly.

Why are people suggesting Prockets on the inquisitor? You are paying for the title and the title is for TL and Evade not focus. You're spending points working against yourself. I'd say Juke or VI are better inquisitor options and no one is putting MKII on them either since it's the same a lot as autothrusters.

All that being said, I'm all for Bucking the meta builds but doing it just to be that guy who is doing it inspire of your own list is a bit silly.

Far too often you don't spend that TL, or you take PTL and need no reposition actions

and it makes a huge alpha that can make the difference, especially considering you WILL end up in the furball

Why are people suggesting Prockets on the inquisitor? You are paying for the title and the title is for TL and Evade not focus. You're spending points working against yourself. I'd say Juke or VI are better inquisitor options and no one is putting MKII on them either since it's the same a lot as autothrusters.

All that being said, I'm all for Bucking the meta builds but doing it just to be that guy who is doing it inspire of your own list is a bit silly.

The OP had Concussion Missiles on The Inquisitor which work best at the range that The Inquisitor is aleady strong. Proton Rockets, on the other hand, give The Inquisitor serious punch when he finds himself with a range one shot.

VI and Juke are both strong options and end up coming in a little bit cheaper. PTL has the Advantage of letting The Inquisitor get all three tokens in a round or allowing him to measure fot target lock and then boost or barrel roll into a more advantageous range band.