Jack playing only Armada might be a reason why he's having a harder time with this?

Give this a try, take Admiral Screed,

Gladiator : Demolisher : Engine Techs : Intel Officer : Ordnance Experts : Assault Concussion Missiles (92pts)

A couple of Raiders(OE & APT's/ 53pts each) and an Imp II decked out (Relentless : X17 TL : Intel Officer : Gunnery Team : ECM : SW7 Ion : Admiral Screed / 181pts)

Total is 379 points atm, here you can add Tractor beams on the Imp II taking you to 385pts, or Quad Laser Turrets on the 2 Raiders, taking you to 389 points, what is important is ensuring you get to be player one, being player one with 4 ship activations stands you a high chance of getting that Demolisher to go last one round and first the next round, meaning you should be able to fire it 4 times, 2 red (front) then 4 black (side), then 2 red 2 black front, then 4 black side, meaning you can trigger ACMS 2 times with Screed, Ordnance experts should get you the 3rd, you can pretty much kill anything with this ship build and the initiative.

Keep the two raiders on the Imp IIs flanks ( one either side), and you are set for Ackbar's destruction.

I run something very similar though with Ozzel. The value of having initiative and a higher ship count is priceless. A double tap from a glad or ISD is brutal. With Ozzel I can cruise at speed one and then pounce with a quick boost to a speed three move (4 with glad engine tech)I just use ordnance experts to make up for lack of screed.

... Man, one or two games a week... I'm Jealous of that

... Man, one or two games a week... I'm Jealous of that

... Man, one or two games a week... I'm Jealous of that

I did 3 this week, 7 last week. . . 3 the week before that. . . I love the fact I set up my own league you should do the same!

I have set up the League. I run the Sentry Box League up here in Hothgary, and am already considered the go to guy for Armada there... We just had our 4th Gaming Day, and I gave out Prizes including an OnTarget Laser Line and Stand, and items from a Winter Kit...

But the big issue is, being a full-time Stay at Home Dad and small Business Owner, I only get One Day a Fortnight off to Play. So Play I do. Maybe 1 or 2 games after I travel 2 hours across the City to get there...

But on topic.

Certainly, if they're using the same lists - thats cool. That's opportunity to find the ***** in the armour and go for the gut... It gives you opportunity to find not only waht you like, but find a way to make it effective... Find what their strategy is and work around it... Ask around people here is always a good start. Do something that forces your opponent to change their ideas, change their paradyme... You certainly sound like you have opportunity to play and grow, and that is all you need...

Look at the Objectives and which ones give away Escalating Points, and which ones are Set Points... Build you list around those to force a further bonus, or deny your opponent crushings...

Look at how other people adapt to certain lists and tactics. Hang out on Vassal, or at the very least, download game replays and watch them (something I do on occasion when I set up an auto-clicker and paint)

I have run this and have yet to lose a wave 2 game.

ISD-II (120)

Gunnery team (7)

Electronic Counter-measures (7)

SW-7 Ion Batteries (5)

XX-9 Turbolasers (5)

Avenger (5)

Admiral Motti (24)

(173)

VSD-II (85)

Gunnery Team (7)

Overload Pulse (8)

(100)

Raider-I corvette ( No upgrades)

(44)

Howlrunner (16)

Tie Fighter (8)

Tie Fighter (8)

Tie Advanced (12)

Tie Advanced (12)

Tie Interceptor (11)

Tie Interceptor (11)

(82)

Total: 395 points

You get three activations, have a good fighter presence, gunnery teams on your SD's give you really good firepower especially when you combine OP on the VSD with the ISD's Avenger title. And at 395 points a good chance for initiative.

Just finished store championship tourney where I beat both ackbar lists I faced.

I was running Ozzel, a moderately upgraded ISD 2, Demolisher and a naked raider with a moderate Fireball (3 firesprays, dengar, Rhymer and a tie advanced), the key is to get the opponent to pick the objective YOU want. All 3 rounds my opponents picked to go first and picked my minefields (entirely to avoid hyperspace assault and precision strike, for the demolisher and bombers respectively).

I have a lot of practice with minefields and when applied correctly the power to place ALL objectives and then a nasty minefield on top allows you to control the match neatly. I managed to minimize and mitigate ackbar broadsides and even though my fireball is small, it does bonkers amount of damage!

A well played fireball can dodge engagement and pour niggling dice into ships at close and medium range and with an engine tech demolisher lurking around you give your opponent a tough choice on when/where to use defense tokens. With ozzel I start my demolisher at speed 1 and creep along till just after the ackbar boats end their turn in red range then I jump up to speed 3 and use engine techs for an effective movement of 4 after which i can fire.

Worked rather well.

I believe that your list can do well with some minor modifications.

I recently ran a similar list and won a small store championship with it. My list was

ISDII

Motti + ECM + SW7

ISDII

Gunnery Team + Intel Agent + ECM + SW7

GSDII

Demolisher + Ruthless Strategists

Tie Adv + Tie Bomber

Adv Gunnery+Fire lanes+Minefields

Essentially the idea is to use Gladiator as anti-squadron force with TIE bomber as a meat for RS. That should weaken enemy enough to AA fire from ISDs (or GSD if it's still alive).

In my experience you don't need Gunnery teams on both of your ISDs and can place your ships so your ISD with gunnery team does see main action (And now Adv gunnery is a safe pick that none of your opponents will choose). I did skip XI7 in this build for SW7, however this is a meta call (if you expect to see a lot of ships with ECM, you'd better add Intel agent, skip any accuracies and go for a raw damage)

I did face two different Ackbar fleets as well as one bomber-heavy fleet and won all three engagements.

In a Sun Tzu sort of way the broader issue is that are being dictated to. You need to flip that dynamic. Whether that means changing objectives, maxing squadrons so he has fly more cover or adapting tactics so that his normal strategies won't work you need to be the one dictating terms and make him adjust.

I would also suggest that every 5th game or something you both switch factions.

Try the following list.

http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=10529

The idea is you are going to keep you ISDs outside of long range. Use Rhymer to attack his ships from medium range ( with boosted comms they can stay long range from your ISDs), if the a-wings go to attack your bombers use dengar to pull the bombers back to medium range of your ISDs (with ruthless strategists you are guaranted a damage per attack) and then have IG-88 (a-wing killer (ignores counter and escort)) tear through the A-wings. The idea is increase your threat range beyond long range. I recommend hugging the borders and if he does come at you fast, he risks flying off the board. This is almost the opposite of most Imperial tactics.

Make him come to you, you don't have to blow him out just kill more points than you. you can play with different variations of this list. Replace minefields with strategic positions and position bombers behind his ships, use Ozzel instead of Motti for an admiral.

Make sure you come in at speed - red dice are good, but you shouldn't take too long to get in close.

The 'gunnery fleet' I've tried that did fairly well is this:

• Victory II-Class Destroyer - Tactical Expert, Gunnery Team, Overload Pulse
• Victory II-Class Destroyer - Weapons Liason, Gunnery Team, Overload Pulse, 3 x TIE Fighters
• Imperial II-Class Destroyer - Avenger, Tactical Expert, Leading Shots, Slaved Turrets, Admiral Motti

The Victory-class destroyers come in in line abreast at speed 2 - get in range and fling those blue dice back and forth.

The Imperial-class comes in at speed 3 on a slightly longer course, aiming to come in from outside the broadside arcs, and let go with a single salvo from its ridiculous forward guns at someone who no longer has any tokens to reduce the incoming damage.

Had a game yesterday and took all the advice offered here in this topic and it went a lot better! I used Modise's list from Post #35 and made some glaring mistakes that seem obvious after the game but did seem like a good idea at the time. All said a done I only lost by 7 points!

Thanks for all the advice!

happy to see someone open minded in their last building and willing to take suggestions and try them

So, happy the list worked for you, somewhat. I hope you keep playing. I love list building and am always coming up with new lists and trying them no matter how bad they are, I am always learning something new to the game.

That was one of the more enjoyable games we have had.

My usual tactic of jaming your bomber swarm with A wings was put on its ear.

A couple of mistakes were made on both sides.....next game will be even more interesting I think.

Be glad he will switch sides. And thank your lucky stars you get to play 1-2 games per week. All my gamer friends have huge gaming collection so Armada is just another.

Much of the advice above will serve you well. Focus on the squadrons and fly differently than he is expecting and read all the how to counter Ackbar posts/complaints.

***remember to ajust the relative value of points of admirals when exceeding 400. Ackbar is more powerful with more ships so his point value must be reflected accordingly. At 600 points, you are looking at 38* + 16.5 not 38. Plus if you are getting that frustrated with Ackbar ask him to play a different admiral.

Here is the thing, meta-gaming refers to the game within the game. If you know what your opponent is bringing you play a list that will counter his list. Playing a list that loses over and over, but continuing to play it, is not what you should be doing.

The guys running the Vassel tournaments have their lists up without the missions, so pick one at random and take 3 random missions. That will give you some interesting fleets to try and make sure your opponent can't meta you.

Consider too:

What is your bid?

If you have 3 ships and your opponent has 4 do you want to go first or second? If your opponent has Demolisher do you want him playing first or second? What does your opponent bid?

How many ships do you have?

Does activation advantage play into your list or does it not care? Again consider your opponent.

Do you have Squadrons?

I class squadrons as (0-3) as being none, if you get to 274 points and go, ahh well may as well take 3 TIE Fighters you don't have Squadrons that will do anything more than delay his bombers a turn. 4-7 is middle range and 8+ is what I am seeing in a squadron heavy build. Take 3 x VSD's with Flight Controllers, Expanded Hangers and 15 TIE Fighters, now, that is Fighter Heavy.

Does your opponent have Squadrons?

Yes/No? If yes you need to consider a mix of bombers and fighters as to stop him doing what he wants and allows you to do what you want. If No, then take bombers, lots and lots of bombers. Of course if your opponent is changing his fleet every game then you have to consider that you may want a more generic list of Squadrons. Note here that Rogue and Bombers would allow you to just run your ships away from his fleet and attack ships with squadrons. Ackbar can't hurt what he cant shoot at and he gets no advantage against squadrons.

The following list is that of my regular opponent, it is hard to win against though not impossible. Note: In my last game he had a 15 point initiative bid (I added ordinance Experts to the Raider so it gets to re-roll against squadrons.), so this isn't an exact copy of his list. He wants to be First Player, he will activate the Demolisher last and once he gets into attack range he will push ahead and the activate first next turn. Keep the 11 point bid, don't add another squadron or upgrade that isn't needed, you want to play first.

The Raider runs to the edges of his opponents fighters and then slows to speed 2 and circles them. 2 Black dice with re-rolls tends to hurt fighters and a few on the line of two arcs will suffer 4 black dice. It will tie up a few squadrons for a while. It also activates first most turns and tries to avoid a fight against ships that doesn't advantage it.

In essence: The squadrons form up in the middle. Screed/Demolisher with the Raider runs ahead of your fleet and turns back in as late as they can as to hit the front arc of the lead ship. The other two GSD's run up the flank and chase you down. You should probably never run a command other than a Maneuver Command until you get it down pat and where possible ram or double ram your opponent. Assault Frigates and the MC80 don't have that many hull points and when you add the APT damage you can easily put down 4+ hull on a ship.

BTW: If GSD's go "pop" you are flying them into his fleet not ahead of or behind. Don't help him out. I would suggest that you proxy some of your ships and run a few turns of practice, just to see where you want to come from and where you end up. Also note that the Raider can be setup first, then your squadrons. So if your opponent is Squadron light you'll pretty much be setting up your ships after his.

Commander: Admiral Screed

Points: 389/400

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Admiral Screed ( 26 points)
- Demolisher ( 10 points)
- Engine Techs ( 8 points)
- Assault Proton Torpedoes ( 5 points)

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
- Engine Techs ( 8 points)
- Assault Proton Torpedoes ( 5 points)

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
- Engine Techs ( 8 points)
- Assault Proton Torpedoes ( 5 points)

Raider-I Class Corvette (44 points)
- Instigator ( 4 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Assault Proton Torpedoes ( 5 points)

1 Major Rhymer ( 16 points)
4 TIE Bomber Squadrons ( 36 points)
1 Dengar ( 20 points)
1 TIE Advanced Squadron ( 12 points)