Hi all,

Now that wave 2 has established (finally) the questions around how useful squadrons are, it is fair to say that most people are running at least a token fighter force.

With Dengar/Jan and Intel on the scene, are there some formations that folks find useful for protecting their bombers/critical ships (i.e. with Intel)? What about defensive formations to maximise the intercept strike?

Let's shake the tree and some views!

I got smashed by 15 Tie Fighters last weekend, directed by Flight Controllers. It was pretty brute force and I didn't play against it well.

I'm a big fan of X-Wings (x4) and Jan. X-Wings start out in a diamond formation with Jan trailing. X-Wings then spread out when engaging so that Dengar / Jumpmaster has to be honest - Jan hangs in the middle, in R1 of as many X-Wings as she can. Lot of staying power, and depending on what you tie up it can split their forces.

I like my mix of Dengar, TIE Advanced, Mithel, and fill out as wanted.

I got smashed by 15 Tie Fighters last weekend, directed by Flight Controllers. It was pretty brute force and I didn't play against it well.

Fscking OW. What a sh*tty list to have to fight.

@OP: It obviously depends on the squadrons you're running. Caveat: I play almost exclusively Rebel, so this is going to be a very Rebel-centric perspective.

One of my favorite things to do is dangle my bombers out front, around distance 1 from my ships, to lure in some hungry interceptors and Howlrunner, while my own interceptors hang back around Jan at distance ~2 away. Jan tosses braces--even burning them if necessary--to keep the bombers alive during the alpha, then Wedge, Dutch, FC A-wings, or whatever jump in and feast. I'll usually lose a B-wing or a Y-wing, but it also usually means that I get Howlrunner and her cohort down quick, and get to dictate the terms of the engagement despite my lower speeds overall. It also guarantees that not only are the bombers guaranteed to be fully engaged in the initial fighter engagement, giving me lots of extra blue dice, but so is my anti-squadron fire from the ships. Most people jump on it so fast (hey look! B-wings! Those are bombers, they should die fast, right??) that they don't consider Yavaris' two blues right behind them until it's already mowed down their entire anti-squadron screen. In most cases, I'll gladly trade a B-wing in exchange for my adversary's entire squadron force.

Speaking of B-wings, I also enjoy reminding people of the fighter part of "fighter-bomber". So many people see B's and think "oh, they hit ships really hard, that must mean they're only for anti-ship and my squadrons will be safe if I can just get them engaged." B-wings hit as hard as X's when activated with Flight Controllers, and they're not terribly cost-ineffective at doing so. If I'm running my A-wing/B-wing list, I often find adversaries pushing squadrons to within distance 3 or 4 of the B's the turn before they plan to attack them. So I hang the A's back a bit, push the B's last during the squadron phase directly toward the adversary interceptor force, and then activate them first the next turn to intercept them right back. B-wings have a threat range of ~5 if you do this, and, again, they hit as hard as X's with flight controller support. Then you can jump the A's in to support once the B's have the targets tied down as you like. Or, you can jump in and do the pinning-down with the A's if you need the speed, and then follow up with killing blows from the B's.

Let me see if I can break down the formations I try to use with the Fireball. I won't be using diagrams, mainly because the locations don't matter as much as the relations between them.

First and Foremost, the obvious - Rhymer needs to be the middle of the Ball. There is plenty of space in his area of influence to fit all the fighters, but don't forget - they don't need to be IN it, just OVERLAPPING it.

Dengar needs to stay towards the middle as well. Start behind Rhymer to give Counter to his compatriots, then move forward to Intel the aggressors.

The Firesprays clump in sets of two around the edge of the effect radii. This lets them cluster in sets of 4 blue dice VS ships.

For reactive formations, it depends on what is coming at me. Scattering is rarely a good idea, especially since more often than not the Firesprays can at least break-even against whatever it is. Fleeing an engagement is also not likely - at Speed 3, they're not slow, but they aren't fast either. You WON'T get away, so don't try. Have Dengar behind Rhymer behind the 'Sprays. Dengar can be staged to give Counter to the Firesprays while staying out of reach, then scoot up and free them as needed. Rhymer is great, but if challenged he should be the first to go - most folks are happy to oblige you, not realizing the time you spend tying up the ball is time spent getting into range, which negates Rhymer's benefit. Never forget that the core of the 'Ball isn't Rhymer, it's using Rhymer's ability to benefit your bombers. Shuck the scimitar if it means keeping the assault going.

I've watched Interceptors and Bombers padded with fighters form a fist and smash ships before them....makes me want to go fighter heavy for my Empire list.

I got smashed by 15 Tie Fighters last weekend, directed by Flight Controllers. It was pretty brute force and I didn't play against it well.

Fscking OW. What a sh*tty list to have to fight.

@OP: It obviously depends on the squadrons you're running. Caveat: I play almost exclusively Rebel, so this is going to be a very Rebel-centric perspective.

One of my favorite things to do is dangle my bombers out front, around distance 1 from my ships, to lure in some hungry interceptors and Howlrunner, while my own interceptors hang back around Jan at distance ~2 away. Jan tosses braces--even burning them if necessary--to keep the bombers alive during the alpha, then Wedge, Dutch, FC A-wings, or whatever jump in and feast. I'll usually lose a B-wing or a Y-wing, but it also usually means that I get Howlrunner and her cohort down quick, and get to dictate the terms of the engagement despite my lower speeds overall. It also guarantees that not only are the bombers guaranteed to be fully engaged in the initial fighter engagement, giving me lots of extra blue dice, but so is my anti-squadron fire from the ships. Most people jump on it so fast (hey look! B-wings! Those are bombers, they should die fast, right??) that they don't consider Yavaris' two blues right behind them until it's already mowed down their entire anti-squadron screen. In most cases, I'll gladly trade a B-wing in exchange for my adversary's entire squadron force.

Speaking of B-wings, I also enjoy reminding people of the fighter part of "fighter-bomber". So many people see B's and think "oh, they hit ships really hard, that must mean they're only for anti-ship and my squadrons will be safe if I can just get them engaged." B-wings hit as hard as X's when activated with Flight Controllers, and they're not terribly cost-ineffective at doing so. If I'm running my A-wing/B-wing list, I often find adversaries pushing squadrons to within distance 3 or 4 of the B's the turn before they plan to attack them. So I hang the A's back a bit, push the B's last during the squadron phase directly toward the adversary interceptor force, and then activate them first the next turn to intercept them right back. B-wings have a threat range of ~5 if you do this, and, again, they hit as hard as X's with flight controller support. Then you can jump the A's in to support once the B's have the targets tied down as you like. Or, you can jump in and do the pinning-down with the A's if you need the speed, and then follow up with killing blows from the B's.

I ran a 14-TIE list recently, and it was a blast. Lost about 8 of them, but hey, there's always more.

I love B-wings for precisely the reasons you mentioned. Yavaris is a fabulous might multiplier.

For the OP, I'm having to work the most at placing my Escort squadrons in a position where they'll protect the key squadrons (Rhymer/Dengar or Jan, mostly), yet are still contributing to the battle. Particularly X-wings--I feel like I have to cover Jan's rear so she's not jumped from behind, but the thought of having four anti-squadron dice out of position for an attack makes me sad. It's kind of ironic since Escort is one of the oldest squadron traits in the game, but it definitely feels like its importance is magnified now.

Trying to figure out if Counter squadrons still have a place with Escort's renewed importance--and where that place is, exactly, on the table--is also a challenge. So far I've mostly been putting Counter units out on the fringes, with the Escorts towards the middle around the key player(s) (Jan/Rhymer/Dengar), in the hopes that the opponent will either fight them on the fringes (absorbing Counter attacks while leaving my more important pieces alone), or ignore them and fly to the center to attack the Escorts, while leaving the weaker counter squads mostly unmolested (and getting more mileage out of their anti-squadron dice). If anyone's got any insights on that, I'd be very interested.

Fifteen ties sounds awesome, and totally in keeping with the fluff.

You guys are going to like my "ultimate project"

2 Ultra Frosted Detail Imperial Venators, several squadrons of UFD V-wings(fighters), Eta-2's (interceptors), ARC-170's(bombers) with a Black Eta (Vader) with a pair of V-wings.

Admit it....the idea sounds amazing.

Let's talk points. I don't have a lot of Armada experience, and I know when building a list 133 points is the max you can spend. I've been thinking that I want to use about 100 points worth of fighters. How do you think that amount works for both factions?

Let's talk points. I don't have a lot of Armada experience, and I know what the hard cap is when building a list. 133 points is the max you can spend right now, and I've been thinking that I want to use about 100 points worth if fighters. How do you think that amount works for both factions?

134

Its very easy to get to 134 points of Fighters as the Empire, while having a mix of bombers, Intel and Fighter Cover... The Rhymerball / Fireball / Shredderball is all very effective, even for its points - punching way above its weight class, and if you build it a certain way, fairly resilient too...

The Rebels have a bit of a more difficult time... The Imperial Fightercraft all Synergise with each other quickly and effectively, whereas the Rebel craft are, generally speaking, more individually capable. This means beyond the barebones of "Have Escort to Protect Intel", there's not a great deal of synergy between them all...

I routinely take 80-100 in Rebels, and 100-120 in Imperials when I'm playing, but I've always been a Fighter-Heavy Player, and I've had a lot of practice driving them around... Because at that levle, you have so many bases of fighters, they'll add to your Carpark issues in lieu of having too many ships.

With 100 pts, I'd probably try running a Howlrunner swarm. She costs 16, leaving you plenty of room for TIEs and TIE/IN squadrons. I love this strategy because it's so cost efficient. I need to get another Imperial fighter pack or two. In terms of points, Fel plus 2 TIE/Advanced costs 32 if you want to fit that in. Really irritates my opponents. Unfortunately don't have any experience with R&V, so can't speak to that.

By formations, do you mean what squadrons you take, how you play them or how are they supported by ships ?

There are so many ways to run fighters these days with Rogues and all, but here is a few things that I've noted in the battles :

- The shield depleting wing : Things to look for : hitting power over speed (so 2 dice anti-ship rather than speed 4). It's better to ensure 1.5 damage on the ships rather than hoping for a double hit on a Black dice even with bomber.2 blues with Bomber is 50% chance to deal 2 damage which is very good. Best supported by : Intel, range (Rhymer, Boosted Comms) and movement upgrades (Independence, Corrupter), having the initiative.

- The "target the depleted hull zone" wing (alternatively called the precision strike) : Things to look for : Bomber keyword, decent speed, resilience (because they'll only come into play late game). Best supported by : things that make them tank until they're needed (Escorts, Jan Ors, Gallant Haven) and help them push through fighter screens (Jan Ors, Chiraneau, Flight Controllers, Darth Vader)

- The interception wing : Things to look for : excellent speed, excellent dice anti-squadron, ability to hide behind ships and jump last when enemy squadrons are in reach before or after they've activated depending on whether they have Intel. Best supported by : Upgrades that help them attack better. Tanky aces.

I got smashed by 15 Tie Fighters last weekend, directed by Flight Controllers. It was pretty brute force and I didn't play against it well.

What a fun (sic) list to have to fight.

To be fair I played badly, while my opponent only won by 17vp, though he smashed my 133 points of squadrons and lost 48 points of Ties, I caught up by getting the 75 points for mission and a slight boost for swapping an AF for a VSD.

I got smashed by 15 Tie Fighters last weekend, directed by Flight Controllers. It was pretty brute force and I didn't play against it well.

What a fun (sic) list to have to fight.

To be fair I played badly, while my opponent only won by 17vp, though he smashed my 133 points of squadrons and lost 48 points of Ties, I caught up by getting the 75 points for mission and a slight boost for swapping an AF for a VSD.

To clarify: I wasn't saying it's a sh*tty list, as in not good. I meant that it would be really crappy to have to face it, because, you know... TIE FIGHTERS.

I understood.

Jan, 3 X, Tycho and a YT2400. The latter two for catching whichever prat has had the smart idea to split his forces. What a joker.