Soo it's been discussed before that range and distance aren't the same, and that the whole business could possibly be simpler.

Range is measured to the hull zone, ie the ship card, while distance is measure to the ship base, ie the plastic frame without shield dials.

However, while explaining this to someone today, another exception came up, which I haven't seen before : "If the attacker is a squadron, the defending squadron or hull zone must be at distance 1"

So, am I right in thinking this is the only occurence of a distance being measured to a shipcard? are there any other exceptions like this? Will we ever get a nice and tidy system?

Soo it's been discussed before that range and distance aren't the same, and that the whole business could possibly be simpler.

Range is measured to the hull zone, ie the ship card, while distance is measure to the ship base, ie the plastic frame without shield dials.

However, while explaining this to someone today, another exception came up, which I haven't seen before : "If the attacker is a squadron, the defending squadron or hull zone must be at distance 1"

So, am I right in thinking this is the only occurence of a distance being measured to a shipcard? are there any other exceptions like this? Will we ever get a nice and tidy system?

That only one that I know of.

The difference between range and distance is what side of the range ruler is used to measure it.

What you measure between depends entierly upon what you are trying to determine. Attack range is specificaly measured from/to a hull zone (in case the attacker/defender is a ship) and hull zone is defined as the cardboard, ignoring all plastic of the base.

So, am I right in thinking this is the only occurence of a distance being measured to a shipcard? are there any other exceptions like this? Will we ever get a nice and tidy system?

Is it a distance measured to a ship card? ... Or are you measuring distance because a squadron is involved, and you use the distance with Squadrons? Its all in perspective.

Which would make the only exception to the rule being Major Rhymer , as he makes you measure Range when squadrons are involved.

The system is as tidy as it could be given the breadth of options involved.

No! It's a range measured with the distance ruler! No wait! It's a distance measured as a range would be!

The system would be tidier with a single line of measurement on ship base that works for all purposes, wouldn't it? Not that we're still in the game design stage, mind you

I don't think it's all that complicated realy. Hull zone is the cardboard, ship icludes the plastic base. If you are instructed to measure range or distance is rather irrelevant to how you measure. It's all in if you measure to/from a hull zone or a ship.

Well if that doesn't strike you as unnecessary complexity, then you're lucky, because that's not the case of most of the players I've been explaining this to.

Then explain it like I did.

"Oh, its a Squadron doing something like Moving or Shooting? Then its Distance."

"Its a Ship Shooting? Then Range."

Refer it to the Squadron Side and the Ship Side of the Ruler, if that makes it easier...

Err, you're kinda proving my point Drasnighta. What you're proposing is exactly the way I explain it.

The issue I'm raising is this:

"Oh, you're measuring for Home one zone of effect? Then it's Distance. Why, to the ship base of course!"

"Oh, its a Squadron doing something like Moving or Shooting? Then it's Distance. But to the ship cardboard!"

So yeah, maybe hullzone vs ship is the problem rather than range vs distance.

Oh, here's another : " Activate a number of friendly squadrons up to the ship’s squadron value that are at close–medium range of the ship", a range measured to the ship base.

Hullzones are used for Shooting. Hullzones are Cardboard.

Ship is used for Not Shooting. Ship is Plastic.

Its as clearly defined in the Rules as it can be.

I can see a reason why it is... Mostly because the Ship Cardboard has the hull zones printed on it, and those lines differ from ship to ship, so having it go over to the Ship Plastic edge is difficult...

The only way it would be the same is if there were no plastic overhang - in which case, there may well be issues on how stable the cardboard is when not at least partially framed...

Part of me is really feeling if that is a serious impediment to gameplay issues, then the inherent complexities that come with a game with bredth of choices may not be for them...

Shooting = Cardboard
Not Shooting = Plastic

Other than that, if there's an exception, its on the upgrade card that's in front of you , so its nice and easy to read. If you don't have the card, well you don't have the upgrade...


Personally, I do believe it is as straightforward and easy as it can be... Because those are right in front of you. They're not part of a book or set of rules that you have to flip pages to reference, they're not buried in a tome of laws... They're right in front of you.

Home One says Distance. Is it Shooting? No.

Very straightforward to me. Doubly so in comparison to other games.

Is it as absolutely straightforward as it could potentially be? No. But I feel you'd be making other compromises in order to streamline it further, and frankly, I'm not comfortable with the few I come up with off the top of my head already...

Yeah, it certainly isn't a gamebreaking problem, I'm just annoyed at the fact it could be simpler.

But what could go wrong if say, all measurements were done to cardboard?

... You'd have someone argue that ships weren't bumping into each other until the Cardboard was overlapping.

When it comes to teaching, I just explain the basics and tell the new player that if they buy into the system, that the way to measure has a few areas where it's a bit more precise. Otherwise, I just do cardboard to cardboard for ships, and base to cardboard for squadron to ships.

My goal is to teach them to enjoy the game itself and if they want the details, they can have that after they buy in, play a few games and have had time with the RRG.