A friend of mine has a question. If the vt-49 is eqiuped with an ion projector and a ship bumps him. It now gets an ion token and can only move straight 1on the next turn. Now the decimator moves straight 1 which would bump, not allowing it to actually move. Now the ionized ship moves Wright ine, which it can't...so this would be another bump causing it to reionize and take damage for a bump. Is this how it works or is he missing something?

That can result in endless overlapping. However, ion projector only has a 50 % chance to inflict a ion token. And I don't see where any damage would come from. Neither overlapping nor ion projector cause any.

The title for the decimator causes damage on bumps.

The title for the decimator causes damage on bumps.

No, dauntless does not. Captain Oicunn causes damage if he overlaps someone. So yes, there's damage. As long as ion projector works. The Emperor might help.

Yeah, that's right. I don't play empire ever so I'm not surprised I got that wrong.

Yes, if you have the Emperor on the board to ensure that the Ion Projector always triggers then yes you can set up a situation where an ioned ship bumps the decimator, getting re-ioned, then Oicun bumbs back causing damage (and clearing a stress if it is a green maneuver), then taking an action with Dauntless and getting stress, then shooting something other than what he bumped, because PWT.

Do that once and then be prepared to have your decimator focus fired down insanely quickly in every game you play from then on.

Didn't they just rule with the Conner Net, though, that an already ioned ship which runs into a Net with its ion move will have ALL ion tokens (previous and from the Net) removed at once, and not carry any over into the next round? A stupid ruling, IMO, but nevertheless I believe that's what's in the FAQ. In this case, that would mean an already ioned ship bumping into Oicunn wouldn't be re-ioned (or it would, the tokens would just go away immediately).

Didn't they just rule with the Conner Net, though, that an already ioned ship which runs into a Net with its ion move will have ALL ion tokens (previous and from the Net) removed at once, and not carry any over into the next round? A stupid ruling, IMO, but nevertheless I believe that's what's in the FAQ. In this case, that would mean an already ioned ship bumping into Oicunn wouldn't be re-ioned (or it would, the tokens would just go away immediately).

Yes, you are right. I had not connected that that ruling would have implications for non-bombs but that precedent would certainly seem to apply, meaning that the endless ion trick should no longer work.

If someone wanted to send the question to FFG, who knows what they would rule though.

Didn't they just rule with the Conner Net, though, that an already ioned ship which runs into a Net with its ion move will have ALL ion tokens (previous and from the Net) removed at once, and not carry any over into the next round? A stupid ruling, IMO, but nevertheless I believe that's what's in the FAQ. In this case, that would mean an already ioned ship bumping into Oicunn wouldn't be re-ioned (or it would, the tokens would just go away immediately).

Yes, you are right. I had not connected that that ruling would have implications for non-bombs but that precedent would certainly seem to apply, meaning that the endless ion trick should no longer work.

If someone wanted to send the question to FFG, who knows what they would rule though.

It's already covered in the rules.

Ion Projector:

After an enemy ship executes a manoeuvre that causes it to overlap your ship, roll 1 attack die. On a [hit] or [crit] result, the enemy ship receives 1 ion token.

Ion Token.

Activation Phase: The owner moves the ship as if it were assigned a white [ 1] maneuver. After executing this maneuver, remove all ion tokens from the ship. It may perform actions as normal.

FAQ Page 5: Simultaneous abilities (such as when both players must trigger Swarm Tactics at the start of the combat phase) are resolved in initiative order.

So the ioned ship both gains and loses the ion tokens within the same timing window so the order in which things happen is decided by initiative.

If Oicunn has initiative he adds the ion token before the ioned player removes is - so both are lost.

If the ioned player has initiative he removes the ion token before Oicunn adds his - so he remains ioned

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

The ionized ship is getting a new ion token when IT moves, not when oiccun moves. For some reason, before the Conner net clarification, it never occurred to anyone that an ion token received in the activation phase would get removed along with an existing token. The oiccun/ion projector combo was something I saw thrown around on here as a theoretical strategy, I've never heard of anyone actually using it, but funkleton's right, the rules pretty clearly show that it won't work, and the Conner net clarification just confirms it.

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

The ionized ship is getting a new ion token when IT moves, not when oiccun moves. For some reason, before the Conner net clarification, it never occurred to anyone that an ion token received in the activation phase would get removed along with an existing token. The oiccun/ion projector combo was something I saw thrown around on here as a theoretical strategy, I've never heard of anyone actually using it, but funkleton's right, the rules pretty clearly show that it won't work, and the Conner net clarification just confirms it.

Duh. Thanks.

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

The ionized ship is getting a new ion token when IT moves, not when oiccun moves. For some reason, before the Conner net clarification, it never occurred to anyone that an ion token received in the activation phase would get removed along with an existing token. The oiccun/ion projector combo was something I saw thrown around on here as a theoretical strategy, I've never heard of anyone actually using it, but funkleton's right, the rules pretty clearly show that it won't work, and the Conner net clarification just confirms it.

The Oicunn-ion projector infini-ion combo DOES work though - but only if the Oicunn player does not have initiative.

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

The ionized ship is getting a new ion token when IT moves, not when oiccun moves. For some reason, before the Conner net clarification, it never occurred to anyone that an ion token received in the activation phase would get removed along with an existing token. The oiccun/ion projector combo was something I saw thrown around on here as a theoretical strategy, I've never heard of anyone actually using it, but funkleton's right, the rules pretty clearly show that it won't work, and the Conner net clarification just confirms it.

I've attempted to use it a few times, I wasn't aware of the initiative thing like Funkleton wrote it but in the games I played it, I did not have initiative so no mistakes there. I've managed to properly pull it off once (though my friend insists he let it happen) but in the other games I either make the wrong maneuver or my opponent manages to not bump me.

To correct Forgottenlore, Emperor Palpatine only affects "friendly" ships. Not the ship he's on. If you had another Deci that has Palpatine on board then it would work.

Wouldnt the ion token be removed after the ionized ship moved, so if occuin moved second you could bump/damage/ionize endlessly.

The ionized ship is getting a new ion token when IT moves, not when oiccun moves. For some reason, before the Conner net clarification, it never occurred to anyone that an ion token received in the activation phase would get removed along with an existing token. The oiccun/ion projector combo was something I saw thrown around on here as a theoretical strategy, I've never heard of anyone actually using it, but funkleton's right, the rules pretty clearly show that it won't work, and the Conner net clarification just confirms it.

I know it will come as a surprise but SableGryphon had a list that used this trick that he wrote an article about.

I wrote to FFG asking for verification on whether or not clearing of the ion token was an effect controlled by a player. They never responded.

I think I've sent them 4 or 5 rules questions but have never gotten a response.

"I'm sorry. My responses are limited. You must ask the right questions." -FFG, probably

I don't think I have ever seen a questiuon about how the rules work being answered. FFG only answer questions about how specific cards or combos of card function.

I don't think I have ever seen a questiuon about how the rules work being answered. FFG only answer questions about how specific cards or combos of card function.

The question was specifically about this interaction and whether or not it did come down to initiative.

To correct Forgottenlore, Emperor Palpatine only affects "friendly" ships. Not the ship he's on.

To correct Forgottenlore, Emperor Palpatine only affects "friendly" ships. Not the ship he's on. If you had another Deci that has Palpatine on board then it would work.

RRG, page 12:

"All ships controlled by the same player are friendly ships.

• Ships cannot attack or acquire target locks on friendly ships.

• A ship is friendly to itself and can affect itself with any of its abilities that affect friendly ships unless those abilities explicitly affect “other” friendly ships."