There isn't enough liquor for this conversation.

I'm just trying to nail down what makes people happy in the star wars fandom anymore. Surely, there has to be something that everybody can agree on.

That they like something about the franchise. That's the thing. That's all you need to know.

Now stop asking for more than that because that's where, as you mentioned previously, get frustrated and your feelings get hurt.

It really IS ok that not everyone sees the world like you and enjoys different things. Really.

Believe me, I'm fully aware of that. But your insistence that I believe everybody should think the same things as I do really does ring hollow. I just wish there was less negativity about everything.

I'm just trying to nail down what makes people happy in the star wars fandom anymore. Surely, there has to be something that everybody can agree on.

That they like something about the franchise. That's the thing. That's all you need to know.

Now stop asking for more than that because that's where, as you mentioned previously, get frustrated and your feelings get hurt.

It really IS ok that not everyone sees the world like you and enjoys different things. Really.

Believe me, I'm fully aware of that. But your insistence that I believe everybody should think the same things as I do really does ring hollow. I just wish there was less negativity about everything.

This from a guy who started a thread to spew his own brand of negativity? Why not "be the change you want to see in the world" and stop with all this sophomoric posturing?

And again, this is all perspective. You keep talking like the whole world is negative and no one gets it. When I read the Rebels thread, I see a bunch of people having a lively debate which is then book-ended by you telling people what is and isn't acceptable. Take a breath, be objective and go back and look at the negativity in that thread and where it originates. I won't say it's all from you but there's more than your fair share of instigation and gasoline throwing and it's almost always because the poster didn't agree with you or you don't like the fact they are questioning something or airing a grievance.

You're like the host of a horrible party who is intent on making sure everyone has a GREAT time by telling them what they should and shouldn't be talking about or who they should be talking to. Except it's not a party in your house with people you know, it's a Star Wars game forum with strangers.

I'm just trying to nail down what makes people happy in the star wars fandom anymore. Surely, there has to be something that everybody can agree on.

That they like something about the franchise. That's the thing. That's all you need to know.

Now stop asking for more than that because that's where, as you mentioned previously, get frustrated and your feelings get hurt.

It really IS ok that not everyone sees the world like you and enjoys different things. Really.

Believe me, I'm fully aware of that. But your insistence that I believe everybody should think the same things as I do really does ring hollow. I just wish there was less negativity about everything.

This from a guy who started a thread to spew his own brand of negativity? Why not "be the change you want to see in the world" and stop with all this sophomoric posturing?

And again, this is all perspective. You keep talking like the whole world is negative and no one gets it. When I read the Rebels thread, I see a bunch of people having a lively debate which is then book-ended by you telling people what is and isn't acceptable. Take a breath, be objective and go back and look at the negativity in that thread and where it originates. I won't say it's all from you but there's more than your fair share of instigation and gasoline throwing and it's almost always because the poster didn't agree with you or you don't like the fact they are questioning something or airing a grievance.

You're like the host of a horrible party who is intent on making sure everyone has a GREAT time by telling them what they should and shouldn't be talking about or who they should be talking to. Except it's not a party in your house with people you know, it's a Star Wars game forum with strangers.

Strangers...OMG I see it now! This whole forum is nothing but creepy old men playing with little toy spaceships and watching cartoons! And their end goal is finding more (preferably younger) people to play their game.

STRANGER DANGER! STRANGER DANGER!

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFTTTTT

Now there's a valuable post.

Just trying to nail down what this forum is really all about.

I mean, besides people being trolls trying to hijack threads to get a rise out of someone or to say how much they think a ship sucks in the game or in a cartoon and express it as actual fact. There's also the incessant need to argue all sorts of pointless details that will become moot on the next StatWars.com update, next episode, or newest expansion reveal.

Actually just trying to find the humor in the situation. Currently all the fun has been sucked out of a lot of the threads on here. Bad vibes man.

*Sits down and starts to eat Popcorn*

Can we all just chill out and have a general discussion without all the barbs? Do I have to start referencing Star Trek. Cause, far as I am aware that's the nastiest thing anyone can do on a Star Wars forum.

Don't make me misquote Harry Potter into Star Wars guys. I WILL DO IT.

Exactly. I was going to go there. The point is that as a group we don't always agree, but we are all pretty awesome dudes - who are bound by a sweet hobby and love of little plastic ships.

Sometimes there are canon debates /coughBKLcough/ Sometimes debates over meanings, and reasons, and if a ship should have been Rebel (Of course it should). Sometimes some pretty tense arguments regarding the prequels and their ships.

As it happens the number one line I most hate from star wars comes from ANH. I hate this line even more than "This is podracing" "Yippee" "are you an angel" and the much mocked "I killed them all... " speech.

As a Stormtrooper under 5"10 with two kids who also dress up as a stormtroopers, anyone who smugly says "aren't you too small for a stormtrooper" thinking they are so clever and original needs to be shanked in both eyes.

I am not exaggerating, and actually mean that literally.

Not everyone has to agree with me, this is likely a fringe case.

A lot of debates go back to the most basic, primal debate of all.

Stones or Beatles.

But, I don't think you're a little short for a Stormtrooper, even if you do misquote ANH.

I just wish there was less negativity about everything.

The thing is, there isn't. You're just only seeing the negativity.

Like, we were discussing the new trailer, and I had several things to say about it. The one negative thing I say about it (that the Quasar Fire-class carrier shouldn't have been a design given to a Rebel ship), is the one thing you decided to spend 3 pages arguing about.

But, I don't think you're a little short for a Stormtrooper, even if you do misquote ANH.

Shh, it's before my 2nd coffee in the morning.

There is negativity about everything, but a lot of it should be tolerated, simply because it is a bad idea to avoid each and every sensitivity. But I can see some of Captain Lackwit's point - currently, Star Wars fans are in a luxury seat, constantly being served all kinds of new stuff, whether it's gaming, movies, toys, TV shows, websites, media attention... The amount of Star Wars you can gorge yourself in is utterly decadent. There really is very little reason to complain. I'm a bit at a loss why there is a lot of negativity, when there seems to be so much to enjoy. Maybe someone else can explain this.

My sympathies are most similar to the Captain's when it concerns the prequels - for a while, the main reaction to TFA was to start bashing the prequels once again, as if they were last year's movies. Now, when I go to this forum, I kind of expect to go to a sort of 'safe place', where I can talk about Star Wars with other Star Wars fans. So it's not where I expect to see my favourite films trashed on a regular basis. The Prequels are Star Wars, I am on a forum fmior Star Wars fans, why am I constantly being told here that what I really love and enjoy is supposed to be total crap? That is one kind of negativity I would gladly see gone, but as it is, there is little I can do about it.

Exactly. I was going to go there. The point is that as a group we don't always agree, but we are all pretty awesome dudes - who are bound by a sweet hobby and love of little plastic ships.

Totally agree. Part of the reason I like these forums is (was) that generally speaking, there is less negatively, fewer personal attacks, less drama queening/attention whoring and more discussion about Star Wars and X-Wing

That is one kind of negativity I would gladly see gone

I agree, I don't mind the prequels, I had issues with them but there were parts I liked. But honestly at this point there is no need whatsoever to say much more than "I didn't like them". We all know why people didn't like them, we all know what the issues with them were.

But far too often there is this completely uncalled for and unacceptable lashing out at people who dare to like them, or even not hate them. As if that single fact is enough to justify all sorts of personal attacks.

The same goes for the Rebels post. If you don't like the show, and have stated why you don't like it already, you quite frankly have no reason to be posting in that thread. If you don't watch the show, then you have no place to comment on it.

Liking the show and critiquing the things that don't make sense is ok.

Stormtroopers NOT just shooting the bounty hunter that was clearly going to attack them, and truly useless Rebel A-wing pilots. For example.

Liking the show and critiquing the things that don't make sense is ok.

I agree, and I've found your comments in that thread to be completely reasonable and constructive. The issue you mention with the Stormtroopers was poor writing, and there's nothing wrong with pointing it out.

However, and I'm sure you'd agree there's a huge difference between 'I didn't like this part because...' and 'Rebels suck because it's made for kiddies, so I've never watched a single episode.'

If you think it's a kiddy show and don't want to watch it... Feel free, it's unlikely that watching it will change your already formed opinion. But none of us really care to hear you go on and on about why it's bad.

Oh absolutely...

I think I just noticed something about Rebels, specifically the writers and certain situations. When they have Kanan and/or the other Jedi characters fighting other force using opponents they can write cool fight scenes for the most part that seem authentic (I won't say realistic because it's space wizards with laser swords).

But when they have one or two 'muggle' heroes surrounded and outnumbered they don't know how to believably write themselves out of the mess. The AT-TE vs 4 AT-ATs (or whatever they were) was a case where the writers wanted land based submarine combat, and the results were ok, not great, and a bit silly. The Stormtrooper/Mando fight isn't even worth getting into again.

And the A-wings are all PS1, obviously.

So maybe the writers should take a page from some of the better Clone Trooper centric episodes of CW to help with this problem.

Liking the show and critiquing the things that don't make sense is ok.

Stormtroopers NOT just shooting the bounty hunter that was clearly going to attack them, and truly useless Rebel A-wing pilots. For example.

Just trying to nail down what this forum is really all about.

I mean, besides people being trolls trying to hijack threads to get a rise out of someone or to say how much they think a ship sucks in the game or in a cartoon and express it as actual fact. There's also the incessant need to argue all sorts of pointless details that will become moot on the next StatWars.com update, next episode, or newest expansion reveal.

Actually just trying to find the humor in the situation. Currently all the fun has been sucked out of a lot of the threads on here. Bad vibes man.

Man I can't even find fault with this post. Y'aint wrong.

Stones or Beatles.

Neither preferred but if I had to pick- Beatles. Easily.

I just wish there was less negativity about everything.

The thing is, there isn't. You're just only seeing the negativity.

Like, we were discussing the new trailer, and I had several things to say about it. The one negative thing I say about it (that the Quasar Fire-class carrier shouldn't have been a design given to a Rebel ship), is the one thing you decided to spend 3 pages arguing about.

How many times did you spout f*** in anger over it? I did it exactly zero times.

There is negativity about everything, but a lot of it should be tolerated, simply because it is a bad idea to avoid each and every sensitivity. But I can see some of Captain Lackwit's point - currently, Star Wars fans are in a luxury seat, constantly being served all kinds of new stuff, whether it's gaming, movies, toys, TV shows, websites, media attention... The amount of Star Wars you can gorge yourself in is utterly decadent. There really is very little reason to complain. I'm a bit at a loss why there is a lot of negativity, when there seems to be so much to enjoy. Maybe someone else can explain this.

My sympathies are most similar to the Captain's when it concerns the prequels - for a while, the main reaction to TFA was to start bashing the prequels once again, as if they were last year's movies. Now, when I go to this forum, I kind of expect to go to a sort of 'safe place', where I can talk about Star Wars with other Star Wars fans. So it's not where I expect to see my favourite films trashed on a regular basis. The Prequels are Star Wars, I am on a forum fmior Star Wars fans, why am I constantly being told here that what I really love and enjoy is supposed to be total crap? That is one kind of negativity I would gladly see gone, but as it is, there is little I can do about it.

See that's exactly what I'm talking about..! It's been 15 years, there's many different interpretations of Star Wars, and Rebels isn't even terribly kiddy..! I realize those who enjoy the prequels are in the minority but... Why've we gotta defend everything we like, against an angry horde- 100% of the time? That's what gets me.

I mean you seriously can not say you enjoy the prequels on almost any Star Wars forum without someone getting triggered in a tumblresque way. God forbid you say, like me, that Episode III is your second favorite Star Wars film pre-VII.

(I actually still can't decide if I like VII outright more than III or not. I think I do. It's obvious that my first favorite is ESB, I hope.)

It's just so... mind boggling. This is the greatest time to be a Star Wars fan... So why not just... Sit back and relax?

Liking the show and critiquing the things that don't make sense is ok.

I agree, and I've found your comments in that thread to be completely reasonable and constructive. The issue you mention with the Stormtroopers was poor writing, and there's nothing wrong with pointing it out.

However, and I'm sure you'd agree there's a huge difference between 'I didn't like this part because...' and 'Rebels suck because it's made for kiddies, so I've never watched a single episode.'

If you think it's a kiddy show and don't want to watch it... Feel free, it's unlikely that watching it will change your already formed opinion. But none of us really care to hear you go on and on about why it's bad.

And that's the thing! I like genuinely decent critique! DariusAPB's posts are usually great, and I fully agree that Stormtroopers are a tad too incompetent. I mean, I laughed my ass off at the bit where the stormtrooper ran, arms flailing, after the speederbike but ****, Rebels. Show a little more common-soldier competence..!

Though for what it's worth, seems out non-hero Rebels get toasted even more than Stormtroopers do. So everybody's just woefully inept and I like that.

But VanorDM- you're right about when people go on and on and on about how bad something is, it's easy to stop caring about what they've got to say about it, because... That's all they've got to say. "It's bad" isn't even critique. It's just saying what you think- and that's fine, really.

But... To return every single episode and having maybe watched it..? That's what really gets my goat. It's just trolling after a certain point. It's exhausting.

Liking the show and critiquing the things that don't make sense is ok.

Stormtroopers NOT just shooting the bounty hunter that was clearly going to attack them, and truly useless Rebel A-wing pilots. For example.

On the other hand, I remember how Cobra soldiers would shoot and fight. From that perspective, we've come a long way!

True. Very true- and let's not forget how legitimately competent First Order men and women were in TFA.

Those guys got to work. I like them. They're good villains.

I think I just noticed something about Rebels, specifically the writers and certain situations. When they have Kanan and/or the other Jedi characters fighting other force using opponents they can write cool fight scenes for the most part that seem authentic (I won't say realistic because it's space wizards with laser swords).

But when they have one or two 'muggle' heroes surrounded and outnumbered they don't know how to believably write themselves out of the mess. The AT-TE vs 4 AT-ATs (or whatever they were) was a case where the writers wanted land based submarine combat, and the results were ok, not great, and a bit silly. The Stormtrooper/Mando fight isn't even worth getting into again.

And the A-wings are all PS1, obviously.

So maybe the writers should take a page from some of the better Clone Trooper centric episodes of CW to help with this problem.

I can definitely agree with that.

Honestly, I didn't... Really like the AT-TE VS AT-AT thing. I like how some bits went- the AT-TE literally climing onto the AT-AT's leg like a little dog. But it was rather ridiculous. It did however, settle the debate on which walker class would win.

I mean it's not even a question anymore- and thank god for that, that one got old. They're totally different vehicles. The AT-TE was never a command vessel, it was always a tank. The AT-AT however, is essentially a walking outpost. I mean hell all it's missing are some side mounted blaster turrets. It could seriously use some, I think.

_______________________________________________________________________

And there we go.

That's the kind of discussion that really gets somewhere. "How can it be better? What was bad, and how could it be avoided later? What happened here?" is all well and good.

"It's kiddy and stupid and Disney is ruining Star Wars" just... Isn't. It's an absolute. From what we've seen, Jedi and Sith like to deal those.

We should all strive to be less like Jedi or Sith. They tend to ruin everything.

Ok, knights of Ren all the way then.

Or Nightsisters? Oh, they don't take dudes. Bummer.

Force users in general, really.

I am terribly, terribly curious about the Knights of Ren, though...

Force users in general, really.

I am terribly, terribly curious about the Knights of Ren, though...

Legends now of course, but I always really liked the Aing-Tii.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Aing-Tii