If you honestly don't think a 46 point Kath in a firespray isn't tournament worthy, let me just forgo the second place I took (first was with in grasp but I misplayed so hard) store championship and 3 other local tournaments I won with her and guri. Yep, completely unusable, complete trash.

Double Poe Rebs mirror match at Worlds finales.

That's all.

Which happened to be the 2 only Poe's in Top 32 also. I guess then he must be really overpowered!

That's all XD

S&V keep getting the short end of the scyk

Who said Kath was garbage?

Who said Kath was garbage?

Warpmans rant about ships, listed firespray as none tournament level. So one would deduct that included the named pilots.

Who said Kath was garbage?

Fun?

Fun.

Still not competitive.

especially the imperial Kath

and yeah, quote "GARBAGE" word

It just sucks that rebels get the most variety

It should be a scum feature

"Build whatever your loonatic desires dictate, fly that heap of upgrades, stay frosty"

as instead we have Crab Brobots with 2 distinctive builds, BOTH completely revolving around the choice of sensor slot.

and a ton of ships that are unmoddable compared to filthy rebel scum and\or sick suck Scyk

I'd say there is more to Brobots. The Elite slot can also vary pretty drasticaly - both VI and Crackshot have their merits, so does Lone Wolf in certain setups. When using Advanced Sensors none of these options go away, but PTL and Predator also come into the mix. Then there are two choices for cannons, Mangler or HLC, both significantly different. While Glitterstim mostly wins these days, Interial Dampeners still are pretty great. The greater number of ships flying these days also makes Pilot choices actually a choice - only quad TLT and Crackswarms around you? Get IG-88 A into the mix! No build is as diverse as Brobots can be.

That doesn't even include any combinations with other ships, like TLT thugs or Bossk/Boba.

I don't think its chance that Pheaver chooses, and wins, with Rebs. They rely the least on chance, and can still outfly and outsustain Imp aces. Imps are doing pretty well, but ultimately, Rebels are just more forgiving. Poe's 6hp, 2ag, and regen will eventually outlast a 3 hp Fel over the course of several games.

It just sucks that rebels get the most variety

It should be a scum feature

"Build whatever your loonatic desires dictate, fly that heap of upgrades, stay frosty"

as instead we have Crab Brobots with 2 distinctive builds, BOTH completely revolving around the choice of sensor slot.

and a ton of ships that are unmoddable compared to filthy rebel scum and\or sick suck Scyk

I'd say there is more to Brobots. The Elite slot can also vary pretty drasticaly - both VI and Crackshot have their merits, so does Lone Wolf in certain setups. When using Advanced Sensors none of these options go away, but PTL and Predator also come into the mix. Then there are two choices for cannons, Mangler or HLC, both significantly different. While Glitterstim mostly wins these days, Interial Dampeners still are pretty great. The greater number of ships flying these days also makes Pilot choices actually a choice - only quad TLT and Crackswarms around you? Get IG-88 A into the mix! No build is as diverse as Brobots can be.

That doesn't even include any combinations with other ships, like TLT thugs or Bossk/Boba.

basically it all revolves around sensor choice

Take FCS? Crack, PTL, maybe VI

Rake ADV? Predator\PTL\VI

but as long as there are PS9, VI is nigh useless :C

HLK is build-specific. Mangler sounds a more balanced choice

A and D crab bros are too meta-specific.

D crab is super fun in the 3-side mission though xD

Double Poe Rebs mirror match at Worlds finales.

That's all.

It wasnt a mirror match, It was, they have 1 good ship in common, I bet if it was Imperials vs imperials, there'd be double soontir's or whispers. Stop crying, the meta will change again and rebels will start sooking. Each wave focuses on different things.

Double Poe Rebs mirror match at Worlds finales.

That's all.

It wasnt a mirror match, It was, they have 1 good ship in common, I bet if it was Imperials vs imperials, there'd be double soontir's or whispers. Stop crying, the meta will change again and rebels will start sooking. Each wave focuses on different things.

We're all waiting for that happy moment.

Maybe our grandgrandchildren will see bias change

basically it all revolves around sensor choice

Take FCS? Crack, PTL, maybe VI

Rake ADV? Predator\PTL\VI

but as long as there are PS9, VI is nigh useless :C

HLK is build-specific. Mangler sounds a more balanced choice

A and D crab bros are too meta-specific.

D crab is super fun in the 3-side mission though xD

I'd say that is quite a bit of variety

The PS situation isn't as dire. As long as people like their PTL super Corran and their PTL super Dash getting to 8 will be worth something. Crackshot overall wins in flexibility, though. Concerning the cannon - as of late I had the impression people preferred the HLC by quite a bit. When I ran Brobots B had a Mangler, so he could always proc his ability, and C had an HLC, since it clearly is better without Bs ability.

basically it all revolves around sensor choice

Take FCS? Crack, PTL, maybe VI

Rake ADV? Predator\PTL\VI

but as long as there are PS9, VI is nigh useless :C

HLK is build-specific. Mangler sounds a more balanced choice

A and D crab bros are too meta-specific.

D crab is super fun in the 3-side mission though xD

I'd say that is quite a bit of variety

The PS situation isn't as dire. As long as people like their PTL super Corran and their PTL super Dash getting to 8 will be worth something. Crackshot overall wins in flexibility, though. Concerning the cannon - as of late I had the impression people preferred the HLC by quite a bit. When I ran Brobots B had a Mangler, so he could always proc his ability, and C had an HLC, since it clearly is better without Bs ability.

Predator Mangler is cool in a way that even if you manage to push but 1 damage through, it is a CRIT. sometimes it's more than enough for FUN to begin

+to that HLK has a blind spot at R1. No B-crab pseudo-gunnery shenanigans that we all love FCS crabs for

recently I started playing mangler+HLC crabs. non-identical crabs work wonders sometimes, especially with PTL+Sensor

HL Crab is behind, taking focus+TL onto some beefy foe, bumps with green, staying in place, and mangler-crab with predator\crackshot whoops into the fray, blocking or MANGLING the foe

yet still.

IGs look like a separate faction.

S&V isn't customizeable fun or bizarre as it should be :C

Seriously, warpman, have you even tried guri? She alone makes the starviper a true contender. HWK pilots do just fine, just because they don't fit your play style doesn't mean they are bad. The YV-666 is a tanker that can be fitted minimally or loaded and still works very well. I think you just run into a common problem. I call it "netlist fever". So caught on what is popular that you don't try something that works just fine.

Seriously, warpman, have you even tried guri? She alone makes the starviper a true contender. HWK pilots do just fine, just because they don't fit your play style doesn't mean they are bad. The YV-666 is a tanker that can be fitted minimally or loaded and still works very well. I think you just run into a common problem. I call it "netlist fever". So caught on what is popular that you don't try something that works just fine.

Guri is great but too expensive for what she does in my opinion. That said loading her up with Advanced Protons is just hilariously bad news for anyone than ends up in the kill zone.

Seriously, warpman, have you even tried guri? She alone makes the starviper a true contender. HWK pilots do just fine, just because they don't fit your play style doesn't mean they are bad. The YV-666 is a tanker that can be fitted minimally or loaded and still works very well. I think you just run into a common problem. I call it "netlist fever". So caught on what is popular that you don't try something that works just fine.

PS5. True **** on wheels against low-skill foes, fishfood against anything PS6+

And suddenly you realize that meta is mostly composed of them

and yeah, want her to NOT be naked? And WHOOP she's costing more than Vader or Soontir.

HWK? Some might have been good, but FFG was too afraid to make them viable, so you don't even mess enemy aces PS for activation. and still fly a cardboard box. if word "fly" can be used on THAT DIAL

YV landed in a meta with TLTs. Imagine TLTs coming out in wave 2. Would we see any lambdas, falcons, decis?

Nope.

It's a 180' arc lambda for 27 points. Want to make use of the TON OF SLOTS? It starts costing like a high-PS boost-PWT. and it's still a lambda cousin. Or TLT Cuisine ,

When you don't want to see auto-losses you don't play "somewhere around average" or "would be cool in wave 2" or "could have rocked if the meta was different"

You play ships that are point-efficient, with synergizing upgrades and play to the meta.

That's not something to be told about abovementioned ships, I'm afraid.

Guri does just fine. She has taken down her fair share of PS 8+ pilots. But then again... You actually need to know how to fly... She isn't new player friendly.

YV are just fine. This whole TLT thing is getting ridiculous. It's the freaking boogie man of x-wing. They are no where near that scary nor are they going to Swiss cheezy that ship. I've been playing since wave 0, and honestly if the TLT came back when, it might of helped stop fat han, but what really hurt him was the MoV scoring.

Anyone that disregards a HWK soon learns their folly. They again, work just fine, but you have to work them into a list you like and that works with it.

The moment you believe any ship in this game makes an auto win/lose, it gives a true telling of skill level.

That's it I'm flying scum Kath and something else in the next local tournament in 2 weeks. Maybe few Z's or couple Y TLT's.

Go bobba and Kath, give her HLC and come in slow while bobba dives in they'll focus on him as she takes em apart.

Guri does just fine. She has taken down her fair share of PS 8+ pilots. But then again... You actually need to know how to fly... She isn't new player friendly.

YV are just fine. This whole TLT thing is getting ridiculous. It's the freaking boogie man of x-wing. They are no where near that scary nor are they going to Swiss cheezy that ship. I've been playing since wave 0, and honestly if the TLT came back when, it might of helped stop fat han, but what really hurt him was the MoV scoring.

Anyone that disregards a HWK soon learns their folly. They again, work just fine, but you have to work them into a list you like and that works with it.

The moment you believe any ship in this game makes an auto win/lose, it gives a true telling of skill level.

[citations needed]

Guri does just fine. She has taken down her fair share of PS 8+ pilots. But then again... You actually need to know how to fly... She isn't new player friendly.

YV are just fine. This whole TLT thing is getting ridiculous. It's the freaking boogie man of x-wing. They are no where near that scary nor are they going to Swiss cheezy that ship. I've been playing since wave 0, and honestly if the TLT came back when, it might of helped stop fat han, but what really hurt him was the MoV scoring.

Anyone that disregards a HWK soon learns their folly. They again, work just fine, but you have to work them into a list you like and that works with it.

The moment you believe any ship in this game makes an auto win/lose, it gives a true telling of skill level.

Guri costs like a truck and hits like a truck. if you don't dodge her arc.

Guess what happens if your opponent isn't another "I don't play things that appeared in meta" hipster

YV would have been fine if the Daredevil stayed a red maneuver. and if TLT's didn't turn it into cardboard box.

It's a boogie-man until you fly a 1-evade ship with no damage mitigation whatsover. Then it's your nightmare.

Anyone who knows how easily HWK dies turns it into 30 points of pure MoV in no time.

And the only one who really hates HWK is TiePhantom. The rest don't really care.

If you think it's a competitive choice, your right to. It seems you're special in that way

There are counter-matchups, and ships that have less counter-matchups than they are to.

And then there are ships that have more counter-matchups than matchups they desire.

That's an auto-lose situation.

You have more chances to auto-lose than to win. And that s u cyks

[citations needed]

From the store champ 2015 thread:

The Fresno Crazy Game Store SC list was published on the facebook side for our group, but here is the complete listing thanks to our TO.

In total, we had 18 players, including 7 Rebels, 7 Scum, and 4 Imperials.

Scum and Villainy owned the day, taking all four top spots!

------------------------------

1st Place - Clay G. (6th seed after Swiss) (dungeonfish)

Squadron: Y-Wing Scum Swarm

Syndicate Thug (18)

* BTL-A4 Y-Wing (0)

* Ion Cannon Turret (5)

* R4 Aggromech (2)

25 pts

Syndicate Thug (18)

* BTL-A4 Y-Wing (0)

* Ion Cannon Turret (5)

* R4 Aggromech (2)

25 pts

Syndicate Thug (18)

* BTL-A4 Y-Wing (0)

* Ion Cannon Turret (5)

* R4 Aggromech (2)

25 pts

Syndicate Thug (18)

* BTL-A4 Y-Wing (0)

* Ion Cannon Turret (5)

* R4 Aggromech (2)

25 pts

------------------------------

2nd Place - Garrett J. (1st seed after Swiss)

Squadron: StarViper & Firespray

Guri (30)

*Virago (1)

*Sensor Jammer (4)

*Hot Shot Blaster (3)

*Lone Wolf (2)

*Authothrusters (2)

42 pts

Kath Scarlet (38)

*Push the Limit (3)

*Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

*K4 Security Droid (3)

*Hot Shot Blaster (3)

*Engine Upgrade (4)

58 pts

I didn't lose cause of the list I fought, I lost because of a huge tactical error on my part. I flew a list I knew people would disregard and one that didn't fit the perceived meta at the time.

Edit: 3 fat Hans, 3 brobots, and 1 thug life meta lists were there. I played against a variant of each, only lost guri in Swiss twice, the only lose of the day was at the final table.

After reading a bit of this thread and reading a lot of nonsense, let me make one thing very clear.

Imperials are right now in no way inferior to Rebels. They are not even a tiny little bit worse.

Their Aces are most certainly not worse, and you have an equal number that is competitively playable. Vader, Soontir, Jax, Echo, Whisper (well yes they are still there in many tournaments), and for me Omega leader gets more and more up into the top league because he is such a nice endgame piece. For Rebs you have Poe, Horn, Doni, maybe Jakes too, and that's about it.
There are differences of course Imps have mostly PS9 vs PS8 Rebels. And Imps are much harder to pin down for a shot and to hit once you get one. Rebs have a turret and shield regeneration. Imps have Palpy as a supporting mechanic too which is not bad either. Most importantly, i don't see any side that would be noticeably stronger here. What i do see is whiny imp players that think shield regen is OP. Well it's not, Poe has 2 Agility and will crumble when blocked or put under heavy fire, and Corran is the most expensive small ship played if fully kitted out. He will also die when stressed, blocked or just green dice fail him (like imps actually)
Miranda is agi 1, so if she does not outfly you, you should handle her easily, and if she does, well then it's your own fault i guess!

Their Generics are at least as playable as Rebel ones. Rebels have TLT Y-Wings, Z-95 and the occasional A-Wing blocker, Imps have Tie Fighters, FO's (mostly Crackshot), Accuracy corrector Advanceds.

For PWTs you don't see much Han Solo anymore, but there are still Dashes around and Some Kenkirk or Chiraneau. Not many problems for imps to be seen here anymore, they even can go for Palpy on the VT-49.

For the most part, Imps are whining about no turrets and shield regen. I have no idea why actually, because they have their own strengths and if they like the Rebels strengths more, well then go play Rebels i guess, instead of complaining about a pretty well balanced meta.
Sorry for the rant here, but i saw the meta develop from the beginning, and imperials dominated it for a long time. A lot of guys kept telling you that playing Phantoms and Interceptors was the ultimate test of skill too. And now, when the meta is balanced like probably never before, they start complaining about Empire being a weaker faction? Come on!

For my part i fly more Empire than i ever did before, because it is interesting and really competitive too. So if you can't cut it, it's not because other factions ships are better!

Edit: I also think Scum is fine. It needs more competitive options (in number) but the ones it has are pretty solid

I just wish that they would de-nerf the Phantoms...still burning about that.

I just wish that they would de-nerf the Phantoms...still burning about that.

You are one of few.

In general the game is much more balanced and there are far fewer absolute situations than most people present on the forums, especially some of the louder members. Unless there's a huge mismatch in skill or one list is significantly worse than the other most games will be close.

Also palp aces is love, palp aces is life.