Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

This is someone who read what they just did with another game, perhaps a few of the knee jerk reactions, and completely not understanding what they did. The Most Wanted List is not a "ban all good combos" list that this is.

Indeed, the NAPD Most Wanted List is actually a pretty reasonable list of special influence increases on a handful of cards that either limit design space or are too powerful in faction; nothing is actually banned, you just have to spend more of your limited Influence to take certain cards than you did before. The closest way I can relate it to X-wing is if they were to errata point increases, like say they were to errata VI to be 2 points instead of 1.

This list is pretty well nonsense, and X-wing doesn't have significant enough problems to require anything like it.

Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

No. This is one ridiculous post by a player. There is nothing official about this. At all.

This isn't a joke and it isn't a ridiculous post either. It is just an idea someone proposed and asked his fellow gamers what they thought of it. There is no need to harshly critique the proposer just because he wanted to express a concern.

I do want to apologize for sounding harsh and critical.

I have already looked at some post in these forums with people asking to ban certain cards. I personal do not like or understand that attitude. I do not know why anyone would want to restrict a game, especially a tournament, in such a way. It makes no sense. Give people the freedom to play and pick what they like and are good with and I am sure we will see some amazing builds in the future.

I find your lack of logic..... DISTURBING!

I felt a great disturbance in The Force...as if dozens of gamers cried out, and were suddenly silenced

I've only just started playing X-wing a few months now and I haven't done tournament play as of yet but I intend to do so very soon.

I can understand the reasoning behind the idea, but I believe the proscribed list so far can't work because it doesn't factor in all of the new ships and upgrade cards from wave 8, as well as the Gozanti pilots. I really think "Guidance Chips" will be a subtle game changer this year in the tourneys.

I believe FFG really pays attention to how players run their lists. They choose to keep variety by adding more options each year with the addition of new cards and changes to old rules at certain times (Do you really think they only just figured out the "ordanace problem" or were they just waiting to add enough card options to the game so that the "fix" wouldn't overpower everything for years?).

Trust in the force (FFG)

Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

This is someone who read what they just did with another game, perhaps a few of the knee jerk reactions, and completely not understanding what they did. The Most Wanted List is not a "ban all good combos" list that this is.

I agree with Sentinal and Sithborg I too, had a total kneejerk reaction and I apologize. I hope my second post make more logical sense.

I felt a great disturbance in The Force...as if dozens of gamers cried out, and were suddenly silenced

As if a dozen gamers LOL'd hard and couldn't keep silent xD

Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

No. This is one ridiculous post by a player. There is nothing official about this. At all.

This isn't a joke and it isn't a ridiculous post either. It is just an idea someone proposed and asked his fellow gamers what they thought of it. There is no need to harshly critique the proposer just because he wanted to express a concern.

I do want to apologize for sounding harsh and critical.

I have already looked at some post in these forums with people asking to ban certain cards. I personal do not like or understand that attitude. I do not know why anyone would want to restrict a game, especially a tournament, in such a way. It makes no sense. Give people the freedom to play and pick what they like and are good with and I am sure we will see some amazing builds in the future.

There is most definitely a place for banned and restricted lists and the like in games like this, when some card or combo slips through testing that is so destabilizing that there's no other choice, but they're not something to be taken lightly. Nothing in X-wing is so busted as to require that sort of treatment though. I think the closest we've had is Tactician being errata'd to 1 per ship ahead of the Hound's Tooth, and the changing of Decloak timing in the Cloak mechanics.

three pages of telling him it is a bad idea... hardly seems necessary.

I think there's also room for this kind of list in specialized tournaments or other events. Say a OT only tournament, where only ships from the OT are allowed.

Or a wave 2 only tournament where only ships and upgrades from wave 2 are allowed.

For basic tournaments though, no this kind of list isn't needed right now and hopefully never will be.

Huh?

If that is the restricted list you can expect a large number of players to just say "screw it" as it is a royal pain to follow. Besides, who is going to check that everything is followed because if something slips in who is going to remember all of those obscure restrictions.

IF one wanted to shake up a tournament with a restricted list I say keep it simple. Perhaps forcing a singleton game where there can be no repeats among upgrades and no more than two or three of any given ship type.

The Battle of Yavin would be banned under that suggestion.

Sorry Episode Four, you're not allowed in here. We don't serve your kind.

As opposed to the OP's suggestion?

Although it may not be clear the "IF" at the start of that one paragraph is completely intentional. I'm not for a list of restrictions but if someone desperately feels they are needed then they should be kept simple. Saying you can't bring upgrades in multiples and preventing ship type spam is just a suggestion to start from; the actual goal would be to make the game more available to people who don't happen to own every possible squadron but do happen to have access to one copy of almost every expansion.

Curious what "Battle of Yavin" would be banned under my half hearted suggestion. I believe the three Amigoes is still viable under a "3 ships of the same type" restriction but I fully acknowledge that same restriction kills classic TIE swarms.

And I guess a final point is that my comment was written after reading only the first page with the "huh?" and other comments directed at the original post. Maybe I should have quoted it to avoid confusion but I don't want to give that list of BS any more page space.

Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

No. This is one ridiculous post by a player. There is nothing official about this. At all.

This isn't a joke and it isn't a ridiculous post either. It is just an idea someone proposed and asked his fellow gamers what they thought of it. There is no need to harshly critique the proposer just because he wanted to express a concern.

I do want to apologize for sounding harsh and critical.

I have already looked at some post in these forums with people asking to ban certain cards. I personal do not like or understand that attitude. I do not know why anyone would want to restrict a game, especially a tournament, in such a way. It makes no sense. Give people the freedom to play and pick what they like and are good with and I am sure we will see some amazing builds in the future.

There is most definitely a place for banned and restricted lists and the like in games like this, when some card or combo slips through testing that is so destabilizing that there's no other choice, but they're not something to be taken lightly. Nothing in X-wing is so busted as to require that sort of treatment though. I think the closest we've had is Tactician being errata'd to 1 per ship ahead of the Hound's Tooth, and the changing of Decloak timing in the Cloak mechanics.

Sorry, this is my first Miniatures game I have gotten into. No idea what to expect. Played lots of games, There always needs to be fixes with some if not most of them. The beginning of the first post was and is confusing. Looks and sounds official.

Sorry, but this idea is terrible.

For one thing, if you start restricting a bunch of combos, then a whole bunch of a new ones will emerge in their place. Then you'd have to ban those combos, and so on, until you can't play anything at all.

The other thing is none of these combos are broken. Sure, they are strong, but nowhere near broken. I have seen super Poe go down in flames many times already so he's far from invincible.

I think what FFG has been doing is what is keeping the environment fresh. This restricted combo list is unnecessary, and when something is unnecessary it is better to not have it at all because it's just more stuff people need to be aware of.

yay!
We need another page of people telling OP he is wrong!

Okay so first things first. In light of recent news from Android Netrunner preparing for store tournament season they posted sort of a restricted lists for competitive play called NAPD's Most Wanted list. Not going too much into details but it adds some extra restrictions that doesn't ban cards but makes them more difficult to place in decks. now I want to make my position clear that I consider X-wing a miniatures and not a card game where model position is more important than card stats and jousting values so I don't consider a restricted/ban list necessary for X-wing.

Comments? questions?

That's an impressive amount of emphasis on the claim that a restricted list isn't necessary, considering that it's followed by a lengthy list of restrictions.

yay!

We need another page of people telling OP he is wrong!

Well, posts like this are the metaphorical equivalent of kicking a wasp's nest. A lot of angry buzz is generated, and the wasps just keep stinging.

Seriously, I just started playing and now they are going to start banning/restricting stuff. I really hope this is a joke. I could see the necessity if the same ships keep making it the the finals every year. You have got to give players a chance to use different tactics, pilots, ships, etc. to adapt to a "winning list".

This "everybody has to have a fair chance" crap is really starting to get on my nerves. Why not limit how many ships one can use, or tell people you can only use the ships on a given list, before a tournament. I know I cannot afford to buy everything at once, I want to be competitive so I have to figure out how to win with what I have. If you take what I can play with, then why even play.

If you give 20 people the exact same ships, pilots, upgrades, they will fly them different. Let people play what they want to play and see what happens.

Again, I hope this is a joke.

No. This is one ridiculous post by a player. There is nothing official about this. At all.

This isn't a joke and it isn't a ridiculous post either. It is just an idea someone proposed and asked his fellow gamers what they thought of it. There is no need to harshly critique the proposer just because he wanted to express a concern.

He asked for feedback. My feedback is that it's ridiculous. I'd pull out harsh, but I don't want to be perma-banned.

At some point itll probably happen in SOME fashion.

In think banning more than 1-2 upgrades per ship is a bit much though

A lot of those ships are pretty underpowered without the right upgrades, imo, such as the Decimator.

^ unless a link directs you to another FFG page, assume everything are just player ideas.

And often, really stupid ones at that.

Is this an attempt to make the T65 relevant again?

To me, this is a game that rewards skill in list-building as well as skill in flying. Seems to me this restricted list would reduce our game to a close analog of the "war" card game we all played as kids but with cool plastic ships. If the meta is so stable that ships are autoincludes or certain classes are completely neglected then fixes need to be looked at (and FFG is usually prety good at doing just that). The coolest thing to me about this game is that certain builds percolate to the top until they are shot down by the bubble right behind. To paraphrase Douglas Adams, the problem with creating a completely foolproof list is underestimating the ingenuity of complete fools.

Is this an attempt to make the T65 relevant again?

It looks like "DAYM, MY X DOESN'T EVAPORATE EVERYTHING! BAN EVERYTHING THAT DOESN'T SUCK!"

this thread looks like lardy trolling, telling the truth

If Paul Heaver would have won worlds again with the same fat han and 3 headhunters list maybe we could look in bans. As it is the only constant lists you will see in every major tournament are rebel/scum 4 ship, dual ig88s, and tie swarm. All of those are constantly evolving. You will see them this tournament season and next year as well, but with different upgrades and pilots.

screw this i'm out.

Made an account just to respond to this post.

https://media.giphy.com/media/Ow59c0pwTPruU/giphy.gif

Love the game btw. It's my new drug.

Well I think it is obvious that there is no way this would happen in the competitive scene. This list was made pretty much in the tread asking to make a list from crap aka the anti-meta list. So my idea was to take all the pilot-upgrade combos from the top of the premier events (U.S. regional Champions, Top 4 nationals, Top 16 worlds) and compile them all into one list to get as anti-meta as you possibly could and then cycle them out as premier events came along. But yeah I guess the size of that list is intimidating to other players.

Then again I guess 3 pages of people telling me how awful of an idea this is was probably my fault as I wasn't clear on my intentions.

THIS WASN'T A SUGGESTION FOR FFG. This was merely a format proposal for other players who were tired of the cookiecutter 100 point standard match ups to try something fresh. But considering how much hate it received I guess I will just limit the list to the last premier tournament results (Worlds Top 16, Nationals Top 4, or US Regional Champions) after all the events just happen so it will be a much smaller list that hopefully doesn't just say play last year's ,meta.

As for considering new ships and upgrades from future releases there is no need to put them on the list as they bring in fresh interactions that are untested, and that's really the whole point of this restricted list was to try combinations that we don't know what will work. We all know Soontir will work with PTL but what about VI? We all know IB-88B works with other IG-88s but what about putting him in a squadron that is not bro-bots.

Anyways I hope this clears up everything for those that care, for those that don't I'm sure there are more memes to post.