Played my first game including new figures today. Knew I had a weak list and I never do well with new stuff immediately, but it was certainly a positive experience even though I got creamed.

Mixed up an older scum list I had played with Boba Fett and replaced him with a Wampa and a pair of HKs. Also have a question. I took Punishing Strike and liked it, and also used Temp Alliance to take Gideon with Diplomatic Mission. Is that legal? Can you use Temp Alliance to take an upgrade or attachment from the other faction? Can you use imperial Temp Alliance to take Punishing Strike?

Anyway I digress. Both the Wampas and HKs performed surprisingly, Especially when focused. My opponent and I both thought it was awesome when I did 5 damage from 10 spaces away. They ARE, however, quite fragile. The first died from one attack and the second from two weak ones. T

The Wampa also packs a punch for its cost and Hunger can get it into melee quickly. The long base is awkward, just like an E Web, but overall I'd say I liked it too. Probably liked it better than the HKs, honestly. Intend to test the elites of both, as well.

My opponent played Leia, who also seemed pretty boss. Her double attack ability is extremely potent, and her surge ability to recover Command Cards can be used to great effect.

Any thoughts on your first games with new stuff? And can you use a different faction's skirmish upgrades as part of Temp Alliance.

I had played a skirmish with the following list:

Leia

Echo Base Troopers ®
Medical Droid (forget his name)

Verena

R2

Gideon (with diplomatic mission)

Loku

The Upgrade for additional Command Card

Loku got killed early after missing a 5 space shot (surprisingly disappointing), but the combo of R2 drawing cards and Leia restocking the deck was amazing - 4 cards per turn. I was able to go through the entire deck by round 4 and used several key cards multiple times.. The combo of Verena and Medical Droid was also amazing.

I was able to use close combat at the end of a round to do 7 damage on the Repulsor Tank, was planning on finishing it off with another close combat when the next round started, but got take initiative played on me. She survived the Tank's attack, killed it, ran like crazy and was healed by the medical droid in my next activation. She's a beast. I love the fact that she becomes more useful/powerful the more useful/powerful her opponent is. Was also able to use her to take out an E-Web and then shank an adjacent officer with her knife, killing both in one activation. Very pleased with her.

You cannot bring skirmish upgrades from another faction, only actual deployment groups.

Loku got killed early after missing a 5 space shot (surprisingly disappointing)

Lokus only got a 66% of hitting at range 5, and it drops to 33% at range 6. Same as a heavy stormtrooper. The only way Loku can reliably hit anything at range 5+ is by spending two actions. Imo, Mak is easily the superior sniper if you're looking for a cheap unit that can pop damaged figures at a distance. But "Mak sucks", so I guess everyone is just hoping Loku doesn't.

Lokus Command Card combines well with Leia. Otherwise, he sucks.

Loku got killed early after missing a 5 space shot (surprisingly disappointing)

Lokus only got a 66% of hitting at range 5, and it drops to 33% at range 6. Same as a heavy stormtrooper. The only way Loku can reliably hit anything at range 5+ is by spending two actions. Imo, Mak is easily the superior sniper if you're looking for a cheap unit that can pop damaged figures at a distance. But "Mak sucks", so I guess everyone is just hoping Loku doesn't.

Loku is guaranteed to hit at range 4, and a 66% chance is pretty good. But for a sniper to not be able to hit distant targets reliably is silly. Or at least let them do superior damage when they DO hit.

I guess I was just blinded by his Mon Calamari coolness...

33% chance to whiff is a big risk imo. Loku does do superior damage when he hits thanks to the red die, but he's so squishy he really doesn't want to have to get to range 4 to attack. Mak also has 100% accuracy at range 4, but the 2nd blue die along with an accuracy surge means he has 97% accuracy at range 5 and his range 7 attack is just as accurate as Lokus range 5, and easier to pull off thanks to priority target, meaning Mak can better hang back out of danger and pull hit & run tactics.

Loku should have at least gotten a green die instead of the red, that would have justified the +1 point over Mak.

Edited my typo of 44% to the correct 33%.

44% chance to whiff is a big risk imo. Loku does do superior damage when he hits thanks to the red die, but he's so squishy he really doesn't want to have to get to range 4 to attack. Mak also has 100% accuracy at range 4, but the 2nd blue die along with an accuracy surge means he has 97% accuracy at range 5 and his range 7 attack is just as accurate as Lokus range 5, and easier to pull off thanks to priority target, meaning Mak can better hang back out of danger and pull hit & run tactics.

Loku should have at least gotten a green die instead of the red, that would have justified the +1 point over Mak.

I think you mean 34%

Why not pair Loku up with Gideon or C3-P0? Both can get Loku focused which makes him accuracy at 100% at range 5 when using Set Your Sights. Guess it sounds better on paper than what happens during actual games...

44% chance to whiff is a big risk imo. Loku does do superior damage when he hits thanks to the red die, but he's so squishy he really doesn't want to have to get to range 4 to attack. Mak also has 100% accuracy at range 4, but the 2nd blue die along with an accuracy surge means he has 97% accuracy at range 5 and his range 7 attack is just as accurate as Lokus range 5, and easier to pull off thanks to priority target, meaning Mak can better hang back out of danger and pull hit & run tactics.

Loku should have at least gotten a green die instead of the red, that would have justified the +1 point over Mak.

nitpicking... 33% miss

I feel both Mak and Loku need inherent pierce to their attacks to be taken seriously. Their damage output is too low to justify their role. Mak, for instance, can strike from a little bit of distance, but has 4 HP compared to the 4.5 hp of his equivalent cost of stormtrooper, who can put out much more damage more reliably. Loku can do more damage, but has to be in closer to hit reliably, by which he has 4 HP compared to the 6 hp of his stormtrooper value.

Main point, they are only one figure, die almost as easily as a single trooper, and have relatively equal health with less chance of doing damage. I love snipers. But they have to do high damage or be almost guaranteed to hit in order for them to be really useful. It is incredibly rare that Mak can even take down a single 3 hp stormtrooper, in my experience.

44% chance to whiff is a big risk imo. Loku does do superior damage when he hits thanks to the red die, but he's so squishy he really doesn't want to have to get to range 4 to attack. Mak also has 100% accuracy at range 4, but the 2nd blue die along with an accuracy surge means he has 97% accuracy at range 5 and his range 7 attack is just as accurate as Lokus range 5, and easier to pull off thanks to priority target, meaning Mak can better hang back out of danger and pull hit & run tactics.

Loku should have at least gotten a green die instead of the red, that would have justified the +1 point over Mak.

I think you mean 34%

Why not pair Loku up with Gideon or C3-P0? Both can get Loku focused which makes him accuracy at 100% at range 5 when using Set Your Sights. Guess it sounds better on paper than what happens during actual games...

Set your sights = cannot move. So you have to be in position and hope that someone wanders by.

44% chance to whiff is a big risk imo. Loku does do superior damage when he hits thanks to the red die, but he's so squishy he really doesn't want to have to get to range 4 to attack. Mak also has 100% accuracy at range 4, but the 2nd blue die along with an accuracy surge means he has 97% accuracy at range 5 and his range 7 attack is just as accurate as Lokus range 5, and easier to pull off thanks to priority target, meaning Mak can better hang back out of danger and pull hit & run tactics.

Loku should have at least gotten a green die instead of the red, that would have justified the +1 point over Mak.

I think you mean 34%

Why not pair Loku up with Gideon or C3-P0? Both can get Loku focused which makes him accuracy at 100% at range 5 when using Set Your Sights. Guess it sounds better on paper than what happens during actual games...

Set your sights = cannot move. So you have to be in position and hope that someone wanders by.

Does Gideon also not have a second ability that lets a friendly figure move two spaces?

Does that mean, that you want to use both actions of a 3 point figure (Gideon) to make a 4 point figure worth its points?

The way I see Loku, you want to get him focused and you want to use his double action ability. I'm thinking to Gideon or 3P0 him off the start, or wait one turn. Either way, if he's using set your sights, he's guaranteed to hit from 6 spaces away - he has auto 2 accuracy, plus 2 more accuracy from set your sights, and the minimum on a blue dice is 2 more accuracy. Now if he's focused before that shot, then you're adding in a guaranteed 1 more accuracy for 7 minimum up to 12 max.

A focused Mak could get up to 13 accuracy but would have to spend surge to do it or not have rolled any surge which you don't want since you want to use his surge to pierce 2 and/or add 1 damage.

So Mak's best nonfocused roll would be 4 damage/8 range with no surge or 3 damage/7 range with a surge to pierce 2 or add 1 damage

Mak's best focused roll would be 6 damage/11 range with no surge or 5 damage/10 range and a surge to spend

Loku best using set your sights auto 4 range for 5 damage/4(+4) range - your red die is a 50% 3 damage or 2 damage and the surge for pierce 1 or damage plus 1.

Loku best setting sights with focus auto 4 range for 7 damage/7(+4) range with again lots of surge options to keep it close to that top level of damage.

So to me, it looks like Loku loses a tiny bit of range, has a better floor when it comes to range, but gets more damage for his ability. You just have to use him more tactically and getting that focus train going and/or moving him out of his activation is a key since he needs to use his double action ability.

I really like him and want to try him out I also want to point out you can bring both of them in for less than the cost of two regular HK's - though they have some slick re-roll abilities but don't have priority target which both rebel snipers do when used to their designed purposes.

Does that mean, that you want to use both actions of a 3 point figure (Gideon) to make a 4 point figure worth its points?

I get what you mean, but honestly the first turn for a lot of characters is just moving so you don't have to have use Gideon to move Loku. In fact, I've noticed when I move my characters too far forward too fast I lose. I think I want to use Loku to shoot later in each round trying for the kill shot. And at a certain point you don't need to use the focus from Gideon on Loku anymore, Loku can self focus if you do it right. So then moving him with Gideon isn't bad.

I get what you mean, but honestly the first turn for a lot of characters is just moving so you don't have to have use Gideon to move Loku. In fact, I've noticed when I move my characters too far forward too fast I lose. I think I want to use Loku to shoot later in each round trying for the kill shot. And at a certain point you don't need to use the focus from Gideon on Loku anymore, Loku can self focus if you do it right. So then moving him with Gideon isn't bad.

My thoughts exactly, Loku isn't the boss killer, he plunks the lessers which keeps his focus ability going.

I get what you mean, but honestly the first turn for a lot of characters is just moving so you don't have to have use Gideon to move Loku. In fact, I've noticed when I move my characters too far forward too fast I lose. I think I want to use Loku to shoot later in each round trying for the kill shot. And at a certain point you don't need to use the focus from Gideon on Loku anymore, Loku can self focus if you do it right. So then moving him with Gideon isn't bad.

My thoughts exactly, Loku isn't the boss killer, he plunks the lessers which keeps his focus ability going.

That would be all well and good IF he can hit reliably from across the map. Give him a 1-2 point damage from 10 spaces, that's fine by me. But he suffers from less than adequate range/damage to reliably finish off another character's work. Making him almost dependent on Gideon or 3PO to hit/kill means HE isn't all that useful by himself, and that focus would be much more useful on Verena or even a trooper than being REQUIRED for Loku to pull his weight.

I get what you mean, but honestly the first turn for a lot of characters is just moving so you don't have to have use Gideon to move Loku. In fact, I've noticed when I move my characters too far forward too fast I lose. I think I want to use Loku to shoot later in each round trying for the kill shot. And at a certain point you don't need to use the focus from Gideon on Loku anymore, Loku can self focus if you do it right. So then moving him with Gideon isn't bad.

My thoughts exactly, Loku isn't the boss killer, he plunks the lessers which keeps his focus ability going.

That would be all well and good IF he can hit reliably from across the map. Give him a 1-2 point damage from 10 spaces, that's fine by me. But he suffers from less than adequate range/damage to reliably finish off another character's work. Making him almost dependent on Gideon or 3PO to hit/kill means HE isn't all that useful by himself, and that focus would be much more useful on Verena or even a trooper than being REQUIRED for Loku to pull his weight.

I get what you're saying, but I feel like he only needs the outside focus one time. I haven't gotten to play with him yet, so it may not work in reality, but I think once he gets the first focus from a friend as a leg up, then he can keep it going on his own. And I'm hoping that my heavier hitters are angering the enemy enough that they don't care too much about Loku until it's too late to realize he's taken out more than his 4 vp's worth.

That's the other thing, when you get down to filling out your squad's final points you can't compare a 4 cost to another heavy hitting 8-15 cost character. It becomes the question of how's he compare to a squad of troopers or the other cheap units. And I have a list I wanna try him in that hopefully has enough moving parts that Loku is the least of the enemy's concern

I'd like to try verena too but a lot of people say she's not worth it...

Off topic question: Baer and DerBaer, are you guys related? I'm just curious and I figured since you've responded on this thread it's as good a place as any to try and ask I like reading you're posts and analyses.

I apologize for my lack of knowledge with Skirmish, still new with this aspect of the game, what is the average range of corridors on the map? From what I see from the Core Set skirmish maps, range 10 is the exception not the rule. It appears to me that range 6-7 is the average distance that you need to shoot something.

I apologize for my lack of knowledge with Skirmish, still new with this aspect of the game, what is the average range of corridors on the map? From what I see from the Core Set skirmish maps, range 10 is the exception not the rule. It appears to me that range 6-7 is the average distance that you need to shoot something.

Which also means your sniper doesn't have to move as often thus making set your sights even easier to use.

I'd like to try verena too but a lot of people say she's not worth it...

My experience with Verena was spectacular, as long as you can heal her effectively she can bob and weave and is a great heavy hitter.

Back to Loku

Range 6-7 (as posted by another) does not mean that you don't have to move much. There are very rare circumstances in which you can sit in one spot within 6-7 tiles of multiple figures, in my experience. Either the opponent just moves out of range, or moves up and attacks, which Loku cannot withstand. So best case scenario, Loku is focused by Gideon, moves for both actions to get into position on a terminal or other VP source (range being 6-7). You MIGHT be able to pick off one trooper if you are lucky enough to roll well, not have someone come up on you to attack, and lucky enough for your opponent to take the bait. Not looking too good. Compare that to an E-Web who can reliably shoot clear across the map TWICE per turn with better attack results for only 2 points more... Both are hobbled by movement restrictions and perform better with a leader to boost them, but Loku definitely loses that contest, and E-Webs are rarely used as well.

I want to use Verena against Vader. And she'll often be focused because of Gideon/C3P0, so she'll be able to punch through his armor quite easily. But with 11 Health for 8 Cost...she's a bit on squishy side, especially for a piece that has to get into the thick of things in order to do her job.

I want to use Verena against Vader. And she'll often be focused because of Gideon/C3P0, so she'll be able to punch through his armor quite easily. But with 11 Health for 8 Cost...she's a bit on squishy side, especially for a piece that has to get into the thick of things in order to do her job.

Medical Droid. Use the Medical Droid. As I posted earlier, if timed well you can set up grunts to screen, use her close to the end of the round to run in on a powerful figure, strike hard and then back out to be healed the next round. Very little can threaten an 11 Health figure with a single attack.

I want to use Verena against Vader. And she'll often be focused because of Gideon/C3P0, so she'll be able to punch through his armor quite easily. But with 11 Health for 8 Cost...she's a bit on squishy side, especially for a piece that has to get into the thick of things in order to do her job.

Medical Droid. Use the Medical Droid. As I posted earlier, if timed well you can set up grunts to screen, use her close to the end of the round to run in on a powerful figure, strike hard and then back out to be healed the next round. Very little can threaten an 11 Health figure with a single attack.

I'm planning on using the droid too. I'm thinking...

Luke

Leia

MHD

Loku

Gideon and Diplomatic Mission

3P0

Elite Sabs

That's 7 activations and 8 units

Command Cards at least luke's, loku's, definitely MHD's revive! Probably the search command card - devotion. 3P0's etiquette and protocol can do some fun maybe keeping loku, 3P0, a sab or gideon alive another turn.

I'm holding out hope that smugglers come out before the store tourney in which case I might sub the sabs for an elite smuggler with smuggler's run and one more regular smuggler. I think they're going to be fun!

Mak gets the same range as Set Your Sights with a single action, which means he can use the second acton to move forward and then back away after the attack, making it harder to attack him and his poor durability less of an issue. Loku has to just sit there after he attacks which makes it much easier for the opponent to kill him with a passing/retaliatory attack.

The focus train does sound a little more interesting, until I realize that means Loku has to just sit in one spot to get the focus back.