Thinking that you could either go with the first option and get perpetual Crackshot that doesn't go away with supreme defense, or drop the Autothrusters and go for a Z-95.
The first option is 96 points. What can I spend the last 4 points on?
4x Green Squadron with Refit, PtL, Juke, and Autothrusters/AAAAZ
Well, you could go the 4 a-wings + z-95, but I wonder if the zed will be more of a liability not being able to keep up with the a's or else getting in their way? Would have to try it to see.
I would think the stress hog would be even better though. Costs you an a-wing, but double stressing something enables Juke...
Grey squad w/ BTL-A4, R3-A2 & TLT = 28
3 green squads w/ test pilot, PTL, juke, autos & chardaan = 24 x 3
100
Well, you could go the 4 a-wings + z-95, but I wonder if the zed will be more of a liability not being able to keep up with the a's or else getting in their way? Would have to try it to see.
I would think the stress hog would be even better though. Costs you an a-wing, but double stressing something enables Juke...
Grey squad w/ BTL-A4, R3-A2 & TLT = 28
3 green squads w/ test pilot, PTL, juke, autos & chardaan = 24 x 3
100
I don't think the Z getting in the way is the problem, shouldn't be an issue. It's that you have to sacrifice autothrusters on 4 ships just to get a useless 2 attack dice ship.
I really, really like your Stresshog idea. And the Stresshog is at PS 4 which is great since I've forced everyone in my area to bid to PS 4 to deal with my 3x Black Squadron, 3x Omega Squadron, 6x Crackshot list haha.
While I love a nice symmetrical list, I some options for you for the 4 points would be to:
- Drop AT on just one of the A-Wings in order to add one Proton Rocket
Sacrifices defense slightly overall for added firepower. Your opponent may also target this one first due to the missile...you can use this to your advantage.
- Drop AT on three A-Wings in order to add two Proton Rockets
Sacrifices a lot of defense in order to boost offense even further. The bonus here is that you can still have one A with Autothrusters that you can use as a flanker/hunter against those pesky turreted ships.
- Drop one A to a Proto with Chardaan + AT (or Tracers on a green) and add two Proton Rockets to your other A-Wings.
Sacrifices offense via Juke but gains a potent blocker that can enable other Jukers with Proton Rockets.
While stress is a nice bonus to have in a Juke list, you can simply use blocking to action deny your opponent (on the higher PS ships if using all Greens). There will also be times where you force your opponent into focus actions in order to defend against Juke but this usually limits their mobility by taking away the option for other actions (or punishing them for taking them). If you focus fire 2-3 Greens, your opponent will have to use focus on one of the attacks...but that leaves them open to the others. Because of this, the stress mechanic isn't necessarily needed.
With 4 points left over you have exactly enough to upgrade one Green to VI/PtL Jake.
While I love a nice symmetrical list, I some options for you for the 4 points would be to:
- Drop AT on just one of the A-Wings in order to add one Proton Rocket
Sacrifices defense slightly overall for added firepower. Your opponent may also target this one first due to the missile...you can use this to your advantage.
- Drop AT on three A-Wings in order to add two Proton Rockets
Sacrifices a lot of defense in order to boost offense even further. The bonus here is that you can still have one A with Autothrusters that you can use as a flanker/hunter against those pesky turreted ships.
- Drop one A to a Proto with Chardaan + AT (or Tracers on a green) and add two Proton Rockets to your other A-Wings.
Sacrifices offense via Juke but gains a potent blocker that can enable other Jukers with Proton Rockets.
While stress is a nice bonus to have in a Juke list, you can simply use blocking to action deny your opponent (on the higher PS ships if using all Greens). There will also be times where you force your opponent into focus actions in order to defend against Juke but this usually limits their mobility by taking away the option for other actions (or punishing them for taking them). If you focus fire 2-3 Greens, your opponent will have to use focus on one of the attacks...but that leaves them open to the others. Because of this, the stress mechanic isn't necessarily needed.
As to your comments about 4 jukes vs 3 jukes + stress hog, you are right to an extent. In any single round, both lists have the potential to deal about the same extra damage from juke assuming all of your ships can focus fire. The difference is, that its just easier to do with the stress hog as long as it gets an enemy in arc at Range 2/3.
One problem that a-wings have (like interceptors) is they often can only get in one shot before they have to turn away (from lower PS) or become a blocker (and likely not get a shot). This isn't always bad, but it does mean it can be hard to focus fire a single target someetimes. The stress hog makes it a bit easier, especially when you've stacked 3 or 4 stress tokens on one target, because you don't need to worry about blocking and you can just focus on getting your ships turned around and shooting at the sitting duck. So its not necessarily better, but I think its a bit easier to pull off. The downside though is that the stresshog is much easier to kill than a push the limit a-wing (generally).
Edited by blade_mercurialAdding two Proton Rockets takes up two Chardaan Refits, which effectively increase the cost by 4 each....with A-Wings they basically cost you 5 points when being considered for building because you have the option of the negative two cost versus the 3 point rocket. The difference is 5 points. Unless I missed something in the original list, 6 points nets you one Proton Rocket.
I agree about the stress hog being able to slow roll easier. However, if I was dropping an A I think I'd rather have those Proton Rockets for that initial pass. Its a tough call for me. The stress hog just seems weird (in my mind) to fly with some As because as you said, the As have to move past the enemy ships and essentially leave the Y-Wing in the dust. That being said, it is excellent at hanging back to catch enemy aces and that opens up the opportunity for your As to pounce on them. The Y-Wing's sacrifice would be well worth it in that case. Your opponent might even target the As that are closer as well, leaving your hog open to denying more actions.
Adding two Proton Rockets takes up two Chardaan Refits, which effectively increase the cost by 4 each....with A-Wings they basically cost you 5 points when being considered for building because you have the option of the negative two cost versus the 3 point rocket. The difference is 5 points. Unless I missed something in the original list, 6 points nets you one Proton Rocket.
Oops. I derped...
In another thread someone was talking about flying Green Squadrons with PtL and Wingman and Hull upgrade.
Maybe hull upgrade? Autothrusters has the potential to pay off multiple times with the chance of not working while hull upgrade guarantees one and only one extra health.
I think Autothrusters is still the way to go, just because there is a 4 point hole in the list doesn't mean I have to sub-par upgrades to fill them Autothrusters is kind undercosted anyways.
I think I'm going to fly 3 of these with the PS 4 TLT Stressbot. Drop stress on something and destroy it. With all the Acewing lists around, this should be great. Also, no trouble with TLT.