No way there are too many options.

Don't make new players feel they need to meta game or anything though. Let them just use ships that sound fun. Then they can decide what kind of play they enjoy and buy ships in that area.

I might meta game at a tournament but in casual play I always play something different each time. I really enjoy the variety of lists.

No. Don't be ridiculous.

MORE! MORE OF EVERYTHING! MORE!!!!!1!!!1!ELEVEN!!

Yes and no.

I think it's very healthy that 36 points of Defender, TIE Interceptor, TIE Fighter, or TIE Advanced will get me 4 _very_ different builds that are also very good.

I think it's detrimental to the game that I need to know that Marksmanship, Opportunist, and Expose are terrible.

I've tried coming up with "new player buying advice", and at this point there are so many specialty upgrades that it's a tiny bit daunting.

I actually do think the game is in the best state it's been in a long time, and I'm excited to see where it goes next.

I would agree. There are so many combos that casual players simply do not know the synergies and with all the options it's next to impossible to know just by reading the text.

I've been thinking that the diversity would still be great if there is a published list of the most common synergies. B-Wings with FCS; Horn with???; etc...

Then you'd have the best of both worlds. Continued diversity with easy builds for new players. That is one of the reason I've been wishing FFG would publish a book of missions with suggested pre-built squads. Of course you don't have to use them decent pre-built squads are helpful. Otherwise Net Decking is the best choice for new people if they want something good. Other wise just play for fun and use whatever options sound good. But then you're back to having sooooo many options.

I love having so many options as a new player. Yes, it can be a bit paralyzing trying to build a list and a bit discouraging that so many options aren´t available to me to play yet, but on the other hand every game of X-Wing is a new experience.

I think more options can only be a good thing. It keeps the game fresh, time and time again we've seen new upgrades breath life in old ships/cards.

For causal players this means just means more options. As for competitive players it just means more time/focus to explore the benefits, drawbacks and counters to a wider variety but it's always fallen on them to sort through the newer stuff and come out with the best and that abiility will only be of greater importance as we get more waves

If you feel its overwhelimg then only play with a couple of waves' ships/upgrades for a few weeks you'll change your mind.

The simple answer? Yes.

If you started at the beginning and slowly absorbed each new rule and card as it was issued, then you should be okay.

But if you are new, then the sheer number of upgrades available is overwhelming!

Spreading out the rules of the game among every single ship you sell is great marketing, but horrible for new gamers.

I know a guy who bailed on the game around wave 2, after a few games, as he was 'bored' by having to add up points and build a list from what was available back then. Now he'd likely pass on even one game.

Personally I can cope (with some mild annoyance at certain cards being unavailable as I'm never going to buy certain ships..). but new guys are really up against it.

Personally, I LOVE the idea that there's so much out that play style can trump list crafting. Down with the meta! Long live diverse and imaginative builds! I'd hate to be able to predict win or loss merely on the basis of which ships are on the playmat.

As long as most people throw on Push The Limit, Veteran Instincts and Autothrusters without spending a microsecond of though, as long as people talk about stuff being autoincludes, then the answer is a resounding no.

Right now the meta is really varied. Overall it's good, but it's hard sometimes to build a squad that can adequately deal with squad archetype 7 while not losing to squad archetype 10.

It's no longer a rock (paper) scissors meta, it's like a Pokemon meta now. Like rock paper scissors, but with some actual nuance. Also, the 'paper' part of the phantom/turretwing meta never actually mattered because it wasn't even a soft counter to rock while still autolosing to scissors and eventually stopped existing.

You have to build a well rounded squad now. And sometimes that well rounded squad is 50% grass Pokemon and 50% normal Pokemon and someone with their 100% fire list sweeps you. Pheaver's Poe stresshog bandit TLT Y-Wing list is a great list that can take on most things, but if it faces 6 PS 4 Crackshot TIEs you might want to just concede before setup haha. You may have a chance but you're going to have an uphill battle.

So I find it difficult to make a list that can deal with most things well that doesn't (semi)autolose to something else. Which is fine, it doesn't happen super often.

It is probably difficult for new players to enter into the game, it is the reason why only builders are very useful now.

Oh it's never enough options!

It actaully makes me feel depressed because I feel like I can almost play any style or ship very well.

Your feelings are dumb.

Wait wait wait... Am I reading into this that FFG has "ruined the game" by leveling the field and that they've done a fairly decent job of shattering whatever meta-builds are out there?

What's next? Dogs and cats living together?

The final seal on the Dark Lords hellish prison will be broken when munitions are fixed.

Did someone mention something.,,

Guiding chimps?

What?

DOOMED we are!

Lol. yeah its almost like... what do I even want to play with? What's the merit difference between these two ships, if both are flown excellently and with a plan?

haha.

I dunno. Debate: If we had total list building parity, meaning that literally almost any pilot could win with near equal level difficulty/consistency, could that be bad in some way?

--

As for what I really think in theory. Golden times.

I love diversity of choice. Just... Wow. I don't know what to even focus on anymore.

It's good that there are so many options. What you ideally want is a situation where there are no clear top choices from a very broad range. I think the game currently is basically like that.

Some options are more 'fixes' or errata rather than upgrades that really offer more customization. I don't like that at all. That stuff just costs money and doesn't make a better game for me, other than give me a sense of "finally they're doing what should have been done months ago," and "come on, I'm not buying that model just for a card, you swindling bunch of ****."

Hmmm I like the number of options. The only thing that is a negative is that they are spread out so much. A new player is going to be well served by someone who can offer some direction on list building right away.

It's only daunting for new players if they insist on owning everything right away. I started late August, just after wave seven, I bought 2 cores a y wing and Vader so I could play episode 4 thematic games. I added in a K wing, most wanted and the hounds tooth and all of a sudden I could make a few lists.

There are endless resources online to give advice for new players including this site, the X-wing miniatures wiki and loads of unboxing videos (I got loads of information from the team covenant unboxings on you tube, they explain the merits of ships and upgrades as well as making recommendations for other builds.)

Join a gaming group; I joined an X-Wing club near work and they've been playing for a lot longer than I have, they are more than happy to advise on builds, lend ships or cards for me to try out.

With respect to a varied meta, how can this be a bad thing? One of the reasons I didn't get into X Wing earlier was the lack of choice early on, it wasn't until scum came out that it really caught my attention. Now there are plenty of great competitive options, PWT still works, TLT, Palpmobile, Poe and friends etc, with the wave 8 stuff and imperial veterans coming out the possibilities are really exciting!

Unless you are trying to pay to be competitive, then there is no reason for there to be a problem for new players. Play with the ships and cards you have. Yes, I know so many people say Proxy Proxy Proxy... but to get good at list building, I really think it is a vital exercise for players to look at what they have and bring to the table the best squad they can with the ships and cards they have. This cuts down on the list paralysis and really gets you to thinking about what you can do and what works well with cards in your hand.

The best list builders have Collection options, so you can do it sitting at a computer instead of pulling out all your cards and looking at it anyway. Yes, you'll see cards that you don't have but it is easy to select from your available options. Yes, as you add more ships and cards to your collection, it can take longer if you are starting from scratch, but if you have been playing as you have been building, you already know what works and what you like to fly. Then you begin to look for something that changes it a little or something different than what you have been flying.

I think this is one of the things that I enjoy the most about this game. I get to collect ships and cards. I get to spend time doing list building and theory crafting. I get to play a very tactical game that is very competitive. New players can pick it up fairly quickly and have fun learning. It hits most of my hobby buttons and keeps getting better over time.

More more more, please.

More Astromechs!

More Illicits!

More Scum ships!

And more shield tokens...j/k.

It actaully makes me feel depressed because I feel like I can almost play any style or ship very well.

Your feelings are dumb.

It actaully makes me feel depressed because I feel like I can almost play any style or ship very well.

Your feelings are dumb.

Lord Dark Helmet?

It takes a long time to digest our current options, aye, particularly when old lists are still viable.

That's a good thing, though. If the answers were easy, seakers of the truth would get bored.

I for one welcome our new and continually expanding options; my only complaint is that I don't have the opportunity to play often enough to properly explore them all.

There are ships, pilots, and combos I've yet to try and as a player who only flies casual and avoids tournaments, it keeps the game very exciting and fresh for me.

As long as most people throw on Push The Limit, Veteran Instincts and Autothrusters without spending a microsecond of though, as long as people talk about stuff being autoincludes, then the answer is a resounding no.

PTL, autothrusters, and VI are autoincludes on certain ships, but not on others. In fact, putting all three of those on a Green Squad pilot would not be a great use of points.

No

There are, however, a very large number of questionably useful pilot and upgrade cards.