Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Poe will eat this dude for breakfast.

Cheers

Baaa

No doubt Poe is a beast (and should be), but Valen may lure his opponents into a false sense of security.

Valen (with title and PTL) ends up in R2 of Poe and has taken his TL/Evade and a Focus. After Poe fires, and possibly does no damage to Valen who is turttled, Valen boosts or BRs into R1 and fires back with a TL. Valen should also have some friends with some follow up shots as well.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

He has won a regional though, so actually he is not too bad if used correctly.

He has won a regional though, so actually he is not too bad if used correctly.

Ahh, the X-Wing forums. So many definitive claims and so much hyperbole, all too frequently disproven by reality. To listen to some players, you'd think only 10% of pilots/ships are even remotely useable.

And then Valen Rudor is part of a regional winning list.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

or just using the points from prockets to upgrade him into the inquisitor instead

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

Better hope that Party Rocket killed the opponent because now you're useless beyond range one.

Well, once again thats not accurate. Tie swarms are doing VERY well in this meta and they only have two dice.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

Better hope that Party Rocket killed the opponent because now you're useless beyond range one.

Well, once again thats not accurate. Tie swarms are doing VERY well in this meta and they only have two dice.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

Better hope that Party Rocket killed the opponent because now you're useless beyond range one.

Well, once again thats not accurate. Tie swarms are doing VERY well in this meta and they only have two dice.

Tie swarms are not Valron Rudor.

Right, but you are trying to say that two attack dice are not worth it. They are worth it as evidenced by the meta. Valen Rudor has also been in a regional winning list and has been in multiple top 16. He definitely is not easy to use, but when used correctly he is dominant. ESPECIALLY late game vs U-Boats. two dice turrets vs his ability, repositions and green dice... he would never by in arc.

Didnt read all the pages, but heres a thought:

Squad Leader EPT.

You fire at Valen and he gives someone else an action. Somewhat situational, but i could see times where the real target (say your bomber) is out of arc for the guy thats firing first so he fires at Valen. Valen then gives his action to the bomber through Squad Leader, allowing it to either TL or Focus for a harder attack on his turn or barrelroll out of arc.

Also gives Valen a bit of a pseudo defense, since it can easily make people not want to fire at him even at range1 because he could make another ship do something really annoying.

Or perhaps hes actually a ship that wants expose. He's PS6, so its quite possible someone fires before him so he has his agility. After defending, cut his agi down and increase his attack for his turn.

Simply ignore Valen Rudor until he is the last ship.

A response might be "Good! Ignore him and I'll shoot at you!"

Well I say "Good! Roll your 2 attack dice at me!". Look, lets say you've got 3, or even 4 ships. I can't kill them ALL at the same time... I wish I could. But I can't. So I'm going to have to prioritize. I prioritize usually by threat, but sometimes I just might go for a ship that's easy to kill also. Maybe a naked z-95 is at range 1 of my Ghost and I can roll 5 dice on it.... sometimes I just might do that, especially if the game is running late and I need points. But the other 99% of the time I shoot at the biggest threat.

Valen Rudor is NEVER going to be the biggest threat. Ever.

I understand that he will be able to shoot at me, but so will every other ship you bring. Lets say you are running Aces. Vader, Soontir Fel, and Valen Rudor. Well Vader and Fel are OBVIOUSLY going to be my primary targets. You might kid yourself into thinking that I'm letting Valen Rudor run wild, but lets say you replaced him with an academy pilot - he'd STILL be the one "running wild" because he doesn't pose a significant threat to my fleet. He only has 2 dice, and he's NOT one of the ships that can make those dice into a threat. The Inquisitor is a threat. A TIE Advanced with the X1 title is a threat. Omega Leader is a Threat. Valen Rudor is about a threatening as a debris cloud. Sure I MIGHT roll a crit, but I'll take my chances and fly over it anyway.

Still can't be the same action though.

Red dice win games, and no amount of action economy gets him above two hits.

Except Boosting or Barrel Rolling into range 1...

...or into range 1 with a Proton Rocket.

Better hope that Party Rocket killed the opponent because now you're useless beyond range one.

Well, once again thats not accurate. Tie swarms are doing VERY well in this meta and they only have two dice.

Tie swarms are not Valron Rudor.

Right, but you are trying to say that two attack dice are not worth it. They are worth it as evidenced by the meta. Valen Rudor has also been in a regional winning list and has been in multiple top 16. He definitely is not easy to use, but when used correctly he is dominant. ESPECIALLY late game vs U-Boats. two dice turrets vs his ability, repositions and green dice... he would never by in arc.

Hey as a bit of an experiment I went though and looked at all the options he has and brought me to this question.

What happens when I drop a bomb during the combat phase, will it explode on the next activation phase?

What about a conner net dropping on someone during the combat phase, will they skip their next perform action step?

Was looking at the cute idea of squad leader on rudor, decoy on a higher ps ship, then if rudor gets shot he passes the buck to another ship like a bomber or any other ship 1-2 away from him. A very hand-shakeing combo that won't yield to many results I would think but still brings up interesting interactions that normally shouldn't be possible.

So I took Rudor to a small tournament over the weekend. Smaller venue, figured it'd be a nice place to give him a go.

And I was honestly impressed by how he performed. Title+Juke gave him consistent damage (I shot down an IG with him!), but more impressively is how hard he was to kill! Multiple times he was in a position where he'd take concentrated fire, but simply boosted or rolled after the first shot (which, more often than not, didn't touch him). And even when I could avoid a second shot, I could still add a focus for defense. Only taking one shot? Can still position myself for next turn! Only time he died is when I maroned him onto a rock and couldn't escape multiple shots.

Otherwise, he mostly just slipped around blasting whatever was needed. For a paltry 27 points, he was a wonderful addition to my squad... Which took second place on the day and had the highest MoV on the day. Heck, lost to a regional winner and the same list he used by 4 points, with only time likely stopping Rudor from getting one last kill.

He also was just in another regional winning squad.

Only time he died is when I maroned him onto a rock and couldn't escape multiple shots.

Ya know he can still take actions on the rock, right? I mean, you can't barrel roll or boost if the template crosses the rock, but it'd be an odd spot where *both* got blocked.

Got myself out of a TIE Defender's double-tap that way. He fired a tractor beam at me, used it to throw me onto a rock. Sooo...I just barrel rolled right off the other side of it. LOL...

(And yes, this was before the errata nerf to Rudor)

Only time he died is when I maroned him onto a rock and couldn't escape multiple shots.

Ya know he can still take actions on the rock, right? I mean, you can't barrel roll or boost if the template crosses the rock, but it'd be an odd spot where *both* got blocked.

Got myself out of a TIE Defender's double-tap that way. He fired a tractor beam at me, used it to throw me onto a rock. Sooo...I just barrel rolled right off the other side of it. LOL...

(And yes, this was before the errata nerf to Rudor)

No, I didn't! We both just decided that's how it works and went with it. Well, ****, could've easily saved him then.

And what nerf?

Interesting question came up at the regionals this last weekend. Does Tactician lock Valen down at range 2?

The conclusion was no.

At first it seems like it would. Tactician triggers "after attack" and Rudor triggers "after defend". Chronologically the attack comes before the defend, thus the stress is delivered and Rud-boy is shut down.

However, it doesn't quite work that way. Page 9 of the rulebook describes the defender as "the ship that is successfully targeted during the 'declare target step'.

Pages 4 and 5 describe the attack sequence, " To perform an attack, the ship resolves the following steps in order..."

It then goes on to list 7 steps starting with " 1. DECLARE TARGET " (and now we have successfully chosen the defender) and finishing at "7. Deal Damage"

Step 4 is Roll Defense Dice and step 5 is Modify Defense Dice. 6 is Compare Results. After that the defender is done defending. That's when Rudor triggers. Then you deal damage in step 7, and the attacker has resolved all of his attack steps. Now Tactician triggers, only Rudor isn't there (unless he was barely in range 2 and he couldn't boost in).

Did we get this right?

Interesting question came up at the regionals this last weekend. Does Tactician lock Valen down at range 2?

The conclusion was no.

At first it seems like it would. Tactician triggers "after attack" and Rudor triggers "after defend". Chronologically the attack comes before the defend, thus the stress is delivered and Rud-boy is shut down.

However, it doesn't quite work that way. Page 9 of the rulebook describes the defender as "the ship that is successfully targeted during the 'declare target step'.

Pages 4 and 5 describe the attack sequence, " To perform an attack, the ship resolves the following steps in order..."

It then goes on to list 7 steps starting with " 1. DECLARE TARGET " (and now we have successfully chosen the defender) and finishing at "7. Deal Damage"

Step 4 is Roll Defense Dice and step 5 is Modify Defense Dice. 6 is Compare Results. After that the defender is done defending. That's when Rudor triggers. Then you deal damage in step 7, and the attacker has resolved all of his attack steps. Now Tactician triggers, only Rudor isn't there (unless he was barely in range 2 and he couldn't boost in).

Did we get this right?

Correct! If you have initiative, then you can go before Tactician. If you don't have it, you get bogged down. I think it's kind of cool, to be honest. Adds another layer of strategy to the game.

And I was honestly impressed by how he performed. Title+Juke gave him consistent damage (I shot down an IG with him!), but more impressively is how hard he was to kill! Multiple times he was in a position where he'd take concentrated fire, but simply boosted or rolled after the first shot (which, more often than not, didn't touch him). And even when I could avoid a second shot, I could still add a focus for defense. Only taking one shot? Can still position myself for next turn! Only time he died is when I maroned him onto a rock and couldn't escape multiple shots.

So, firepower wasn't an issue? Excellent. It's one thing to look at it on paper, but it's another thing to fly it. Juke is perfect for him with the title as he gets the free Evade action. So, he'll get the TL to modify dice and then the Juke to reduce the defense. Also, maybe he Boost or BRs into R1 for the extra die?

The Tacoma champ said how he'd boost into range 1 and PTL for attack mods if it was a higher PS ship. If they were lower, he'd PTL to get defensive mods or arc dodge initially.

Only time he died is when I maroned him onto a rock and couldn't escape multiple shots.

Ya know he can still take actions on the rock, right? I mean, you can't barrel roll or boost if the template crosses the rock, but it'd be an odd spot where *both* got blocked.

Got myself out of a TIE Defender's double-tap that way. He fired a tractor beam at me, used it to throw me onto a rock. Sooo...I just barrel rolled right off the other side of it. LOL...

(And yes, this was before the errata nerf to Rudor)

No, I didn't! We both just decided that's how it works and went with it. Well, ****, could've easily saved him then.

And what nerf?

As noted in the other posts - basically that the enemy MAY get to shoot twice before Rudor's action takes effect, if they have initiative instead of you.

IE., they shoot at you and it triggers both their second attack and Rudor's action. Which of those two things happens first (their attack or Rudor's action) depends on whether they have initiative or you do.

How most of us had previously been playing it is that any time a new thing triggers, that newest thing fully resolves before you return back to the flow of the game that triggered it. But new FAQ says it doesn't work like that.