Idk guys, didn't you ever feel bad for choosing the obviously more logical choice to order online at a discount price rather than buy local?

I consider just driving to an FLGS every time Im about to put in an online order, but then I do the math, consider how many more ships I get for the same cost, and obviously choose to get more stuff for less, AND have money left for real life things.

It's not the fault of the FLGS that I can go somewhere else online for cheaper, but they really do get shafted.

As much as my wallet is unhappy, and as much as I know this is a pain for people who don't have local stores, I am very glad that it is no longer an obvious choice to bypass the FLGS and get cheap online stuff.

There will be more small stores to put on events or to hang out at that I will be able to easily give my money to, for I will KNOW that this price is as good as any other price.

It just, feels right, doesn't it?

And what about people that don't have a flgs local they don't buy online out of some need to penny pinch they do it because they have no other option.

For those people this is a tax with no benefit, they've done nothing wrong but are being punished anyway.

For them it's nothing but a bad deal.

They are now resolving the problem. so good for them.

I don't want to hear sob stories, these things need to change. be glad you had the discount while you could get it. accept this as another reality of where and how you live your life and move on.

So again, this new policy has nothing to do with bolstering FLGS sales and everything to do with increasing ANA's profit margins by increasing the wholesale price of products sold to online retailers. And I have a feeling that this time next year we are going to be back here again complaining because ANA raised the prices on all their products across the board.

by making online stores sell at less of a discount they are infact encouraging people to buy at local retailers. if you cant see how that works then this conversation is not worth having.

Mass market is a completely different thing and only shares a few products (at this time only the core sets have been available in mass market) leaving the entire rest of the line exclusive to specialty stores. Again the physical qualities of their physical products means letting people see the product in a physical store is an important step in marketing the product, shelf space in target is a huge marketing boon.

But again, if we can still buy product online at a 25% discount while my local retailers refuse to even have an occasional 10% sale, what incentive do I have to buy from them vs. the online retailer? That's assuming they even have what I want in stock which they almost never do. I live on the west coast, so that is part of the problem. We don't have good gaming stores out here because most people don't have time for hobby gaming and the cost of real estate is so high. This new policy does nothing to address these issues.

If ANA is going to pull the capitalism card, why can't I, as a consumer, pull the same card as well?

I live on the Left Coast as well, and we have plenty of good game stores. Mine frequently orders whatever I ask them to for me, whenever they don't have certain products in stock.

Anecdotal evidence is best evidence.

but why even wait for the store to order it? when the online option is available and is an easier option. The competitive advantage physical stores have is the immediacy of the product. They carry inventory so customers don't have to wait. A customer should seek out the best service and prices. I find it strange that people support a move that directly harms consumer choices.

Yes, it is this too. You might be blessed to be in any area that has decent local stores, I am not. And I know of only a few in the state I live in that are "decent" and they are hundreds of miles from where I live.

My main issue with Local stores here hasn't been so much price but availability. If I have to have my local store order a game for me, wait for it AND pay full retail, then why wouldn't I just do it myself online? And now that Amazon (and that is Amazon the company, not a third party seller on Amazon) is caring most of the FFG products at less than MSRP and 2 day free prime shipping, why wouldn't I go that route? That makes better business since. Remember, we are CUSTOMERS...this isn't a charity.

but why even wait for the store to order it? when the online option is available and is an easier option. The competitive advantage physical stores have is the immediacy of the product. They carry inventory so customers don't have to wait. A customer should seek out the best service and prices. I find it strange that people support a move that directly harms consumer choices.

Because shipping costs $$, and still takes times - something people here seem quick to forget. Oh, I'll place online orders when the shipping is free, but then I have to buy in bulk. Which is more immediate, waiting to place an online order because I need to save up, or because not everything I want is in stock; or paying $15 for the one toy I want right now and waiting a few days? And what do you do when you accidentally receive the wrong product, or it's damaged? I imagine you wait for shipping... again. That's something I don't have to bother with when I can hold the actual item in my hand before I even lay down cash.

Seems like what GW did when online retailers were heavily discounting years ago.

I'd always much rather purchase in the shop that provides a venue for our community. However when push comes to shove it's nice having online as an option when there's nothing available locally

This cover everything or just minis and cards?

All ANA (re. FFG) products. Board Games and RPGs included.

Great so those of us who lack a convenient game store have to pay extra due to an insane whim of the company. This doesn't bode well for what FFG will become in the future.

Idk guys, didn't you ever feel bad for choosing the obviously more logical choice to order online at a discount price rather than buy local?

I consider just driving to an FLGS every time Im about to put in an online order, but then I do the math, consider how many more ships I get for the same cost, and obviously choose to get more stuff for less, AND have money left for real life things.

It's not the fault of the FLGS that I can go somewhere else online for cheaper, but they really do get shafted.

As much as my wallet is unhappy, and as much as I know this is a pain for people who don't have local stores, I am very glad that it is no longer an obvious choice to bypass the FLGS and get cheap online stuff.

There will be more small stores to put on events or to hang out at that I will be able to easily give my money to, for I will KNOW that this price is as good as any other price.

It just, feels right, doesn't it?

And what about people that don't have a flgs local they don't buy online out of some need to penny pinch they do it because they have no other option.

For those people this is a tax with no benefit, they've done nothing wrong but are being punished anyway.

For them it's nothing but a bad deal.

Nobody is getting price gouged here; product will still be available online, at a fair market price. One that is demonstrably close to current prices. So why all the rage? Principle? Principle is a virtue of the needless, and nobody here is starving for want of plastic space ships.

Where do you guys live that you can play in bars? me and a friend tried to play magic in a bar and they asked us to leave. We were told its illegal to play cards or roll dice where you drink. something to do with gambling laws. I live in Michigan. if it wasn't for B&M stores we would only be able to play in our house, witch would end all tournements., of course casinos are diffent.

Weird. I know for certain there is one local bar that allows board games in Michigan.

Well there's so many posts here I wish i could multi quote you all, but I'd take up a whole fraking page.

There's a few points I want to make to stir this lovely bubbling pot we have here. (I may even troll a bit too).

1. FFG and Asmodee are a business, If they lose money, profit and aren't making any money, they will go into bankruptcy and close, ergo, No fraking toys for you spoiled little brats.

Therefore, their decisions to to charge online stores more, because they aren't possibly making money off them is to keep this business afloat to provide quality products for you.

Games workshop is another topic of hotly contested debate i could refer to, but that would just be mean. (I'm not that big of a troll)

I invested heavily into GW products, having to assemble and paint them was a chore and fraking heavily over priced, especially fantasy, having to buy so many boxes to play a game.

At least with 40k, 1 or 2 boxes and yo could play a friendly easy game. Hence why they changed fantasy to be more newbie and consumer friendly. They clearly weren't making money off of it before hand.

If you look at GW profits for the last couple of years, its slowly been decreasing.

FFG creates fantastic quality products they you don't need to invest heavily in if you don't want to. Take X-wing for example, which is what the topic is about anyway, 1 starter box and you can play a game with another person. its only 3 models, assembled, painted and ready to play.

Each expansion is a single model and a lot cheaper to add to the game unlike GW with fantasy or even 40K. you only need 3 models on average each player to play a full and fun game of X-wing.

Oh wait, lets troll some more, have I mentioned I'm from Australia, and suffer the same inflated prices that the UK and other parts of Europe suffer because of shipping costs and popularity of the products. I pay like 30% more for X-wing then the Americans pay. Not to mention, even If i wanted to purchase online from an American online retailer, I have to pay for shipping costs as well. WTF?!?! Not to mention currency conversion rates.

If you cant fork out a little more for a game you "want" to play, then don't. The game will die off because of lack of popularity and profit and there we go. Be grateful, that the minis come painted. I collect to play and display, once I finish I can safely put them back into my display case and enjoy them.

I could continue on about other FFG games, and the value for money you get not having to buy excessive amounts, but I think I've fed enough fuel to the fire for now

econ 101 market will balance itself. When the FFG gets a big glut of ships due to the large volume not being sold as in the past they will be forced to sell at reduced prices. however if demand is greater than supply then the opposite holds true.

Okay, maybe my understanding is fuzzy, but I thought what a retailer sells a product for doesn't really affect what the manufacturer makes. The retailer buys the product from the manufacturer/distributor, and that's where the manufacturer makes their profit, right? So it doesn't matter to their bottom line what the retailer sells it for, because they've already been paid.

Am I off-base on that?

You are almost correct.

When FFG sells to a store they factor in the benefit of being in a physical store and the store's own promotion of their products into the price they charge that store.

An online store does not promote the product and does not give it physical shelf space, so they are in effect giving FFG much less service and should not get the same discount as a store that does a bunch of work and rents retail space.

An online store does promote the product! how many posts have I seen on here about various sales from CSI or MM?? I would say they promote the product better than most of the LGS's I mean "magic stores"... Virtual shelf space is world wide!!

Okay, maybe my understanding is fuzzy... , So it doesn't matter to their bottom line what the retailer sells it for, because they've already been paid.

Am I off-base on that?

The brick and mortar retail stores provide visibility and a sense of community. Visibility increases sales and the community increases the length of time someone stays with a line before abandoning it. B&M stores have expenses associated with the retail space and thus they charge more for their product to offset the cost of the physical space. Online retailers don't have the physical site expenses and thus can sell for cheaper. The rational/assumption is that B&M store owners are incapable of adapting to the new reality of retail (which is insulting actually) and thus have to be subsidized to avoid being driven out of business because less places to see/play a game.equals less sales.

-Maxgravity

I get that. What I'm asking is does it work like this:

1) FFG makes Super Duper X-Wing 1000 ship for $10 a piece.

2) FFG says "Hey retailers, you want this, it's $20 a piece."

3) Retailers order oodles of SDXW1000 at $20 a piece.

4) FFG makes profit of $10 on each SDXW1000 and are now out of the loop.

5) Retailers charge whatever they feel like for SDXW1000 and it affects FFG's profits not at all, since they already profited in Step 4.

An online store does promote the product! how many posts have I seen on here about various sales from CSI or MM?? I would say they promote the product better than most of the LGS's I mean "magic stores"... Virtual shelf space is world wide!!

I once caught MM advertising an upcoming Magic set with a false banner, one that used cards that were known to be fake mockups. I wouldn't give them too much credit when it comes to promoting product, and I certainly wouldn't say they do it 'better.'

you only know about a MM sale because you are already into the game. there are online outlets like team covenant that do promote the games with content and videos and i suspect they will be one of the few exceptions.

"magic stores" is a great label for them.

Magic the gathering already has strong price control measures in place, stores support the game because the game supports their store. there are still online sales for magic but the margins are much thinner.

Magic is a prime example of how this model works and it's positive effects.

a virtual self is only as big as your advertising spend.

Idk guys, didn't you ever feel bad for choosing the obviously more logical choice to order online at a discount price rather than buy local?

I consider just driving to an FLGS every time Im about to put in an online order, but then I do the math, consider how many more ships I get for the same cost, and obviously choose to get more stuff for less, AND have money left for real life things.

It's not the fault of the FLGS that I can go somewhere else online for cheaper, but they really do get shafted.

As much as my wallet is unhappy, and as much as I know this is a pain for people who don't have local stores, I am very glad that it is no longer an obvious choice to bypass the FLGS and get cheap online stuff.

There will be more small stores to put on events or to hang out at that I will be able to easily give my money to, for I will KNOW that this price is as good as any other price.

It just, feels right, doesn't it?

And what about people that don't have a flgs local they don't buy online out of some need to penny pinch they do it because they have no other option.

For those people this is a tax with no benefit, they've done nothing wrong but are being punished anyway.

For them it's nothing but a bad deal.

That is one way of looking at it. Another is you will still be able get product at fair market prices, albeit a little more than you are used too. It's unfortunate that prices will be going up for some people. Generally speaking, nobody likes to pay more. In this case one could be grateful for all the money they've saved buying at discounted online prices while it lasted and begin preparing themselves for the new pricing. All good things come to an end eventually.

Well that sucks.

An online store does not promote the product and does not give it physical shelf space, so they are in effect giving FFG much less service and should not get the same discount as a store that does a bunch of work and rents retail space.

For the record, when you walk into MM there is an entire wall of every single X-wing product. Plus they hold tournaments nearly every month.

So while they are one of the "evil olgs's", they are a pretty good lgs as well.

An online store does not promote the product and does not give it physical shelf space, so they are in effect giving FFG much less service and should not get the same discount as a store that does a bunch of work and rents retail space.

For the record, when you walk into MM there is an entire wall of every single X-wing product. Plus they hold tournaments nearly every month.

So while they are one of the "evil olgs's", they are a pretty good lgs as well.

most online retailers have a B&M store specifically because it is a contractual necessity in order to get product from a distributor.

Money talks and everything else walks. X-wing is selling hand over fist. They won't do anything to disrupt that. I don't think legit sights like CSG and MM have anything to worry about nor do I think we'll see an increase in prices.

An online store does not promote the product and does not give it physical shelf space, so they are in effect giving FFG much less service and should not get the same discount as a store that does a bunch of work and rents retail space.

For the record, when you walk into MM there is an entire wall of every single X-wing product. Plus they hold tournaments nearly every month.

So while they are one of the "evil olgs's", they are a pretty good lgs as well.

most online retailers have a B&M store specifically because it is a contractual necessity in order to get product from a distributor.

That may be but I was responding to your point about online stores not promoting & shelf space. To that point, MM locally does a very good job at promoting the product every bit as much as the other game stores in town.

While I am a bit miffed that I will have to spend more at my lgs (who is also an olgs) to subsidize other game stores, I won't lose any sleep over it. It is still a great price.

Your not subsidizing other game stores if anything this move ends the subsidy ffg was giving to OLGS

The truth of the matter is, at the margin there will simply be less demand if the price is higher appreciably as we can see some people do factor in the cheaper costs online a an important consideration. This is simple economics 101, and a gross population effect; the higher the price, people who are on the fence are less likely to buy- they might buy one expansion instead of 2 or limit which ones to purchase rather than get everything. Or perhaps, the cross game spill over demand might take the hit- maybe someone who might have tried out another game like Armada might not.

Maybe FF thinks there is plenty of demand and simply dont mind losing some sales. It might be a negligible effect, but If the inventory starts pilling up then the tune will probably change very quickly.

I personally think, the low entry costs are what is causing super rapid growth and wouldnt mess with it. Strong gross sales cures all ills in general, but maybe they just cant keep up.

I am not surprised, but I am disappointed. This will slow my purchases (which, to date, had all been from the LGS--where I do not hang out, play, etc. and pay an additional 4¢ above MSRP on many items).

I rather doubt that FFG is going to hunt down the scalpers...err..."resellers" on Amazon or anywhere else that are currently charging $60 (plus $4.72 for shipping) and up for Rebel Aces or $24.99 (plus $11.99 for shipping) for a single Bantha Rider, so until they do that their claim that they are looking after the industry is pure garbage. The absurd price gouging causes as much harm (artificially inflating the price of entry, creating ill-will, etc.) as "artificially low" prices.

IF FFG/ANA goes after the gougers, then I will reluctantly accept their market interference. If not, then I will aggressively and selfishly pursue my interests as they are doing.

Realistically this is the change.

Before: online 40% off, FLGS 10% off

After: online 20% off, FLGS 10% off

Does it suck personally for you if you only ever buy online? Yes. Is it a good change for the long term heath of the game? Yes.

That's the dumbest thing I have ever read on this forum.

Why is that a good change for the long term health of the game? What real evidence are you basing that on?

Then you can't have been around for very long.

I'm not certain why you think it is dumb.

I think Peterson is absolutely correct, and Asmodee NA is making a very sound decision. Yes, it will suck for those people buying only online (and not playing at FLGSs) - but it can help the FLGSs, because it can help them compete against the online retailers, who have had to suffer what is essentially an unfair disadvantage while did more to grow the hobby as a whole.

What follows is all hypothetical (like most opinions in here). But,

This change seems poised to affect an extremely small -- potentially insignificant - subset of purchasers.

Most who currently buy their XWM at an LGS (out of loyalty, convenience, or any other reason) will continue to do so.

Most for whom price is the chief concern, but buy XWM online because of the savings will cease to do so.

All that leaves are people who are concerned about price but so attached to XWM that they will transfer their online purchasing to an LGS.

Anecdotally, this move will actually cost at least one LGS some sales. Ever since a local retail space opened up here a year ago I've made all my purchases there (even though they regularly price ships at 1 or 2 dollars above MSRP). It's convenient, and it saves me the guilt of being of a freeloader when I play a game there every month or two. Now that I know online discounts won't be a possibility in the future, regardless of my interest in taking advantage of them, it seems pretty wise to get my Wave 8 from an online place before the discount era ends. Smoke 'em while you got 'em. If this announcement wasn't made my purchasing habits would have remained unchanged, and that LGS would have obtained my Wave 8 spending.

It seems like both "sides" are overreacting just a wee bit here.

Let's say the online discount goes from 40% to 20%, realistically. This isn't ... the end of the world, even if you have to buy one or two fewer ships. I'm not trying to be insenstitive, but to hear some people talk it's like suddenly they are getting rid of online sales completely or charging 400% of MSRP. The narrative seems to be they are going to FORCE you to buy from a store, which is just not true. It'll most likely still be slightly cheaper online. So, geez, kind of sucks if you're used to getting things at practically half the price but it's not like you can't still play the game.

On the flip side trying to say that it's a moral imperative to buy from a local store is weird as well. Gaming communities benefit greatly from a nice LGS, no doubt. But if that LGS doesn't make it inviting, cater to their customers, offer some free mats to play on, etc... and then want to charge full MSRP all the time... well it's no wonder people are going to buy online for a huge discount. It's only natural, and unrealistic for a store to expect people to support them if they're not willing to work for your business. X-Wing is not the kind of game that practically requires a club either, it can easily be played at home, at a meeting place, in the little rooms in libraries everywhere, etc... If you local club wasn't already offering at least a small, say 10% discount knowing you can always go online and get 40% off, well that's kind of on them in my view.

Anyway, I think the bottom line is that if the online prices go from a somewhat crazy 40% off to a still decent (and more normal) 20% ish I think all will be well. You can still get your stuff online for a nice price compared to MSRP at a club, and no one should feel forced to buy anywhere.