So, the Scyk has come up a couple of times lately, with people mentioning how they like them and want to fly them. However, if tournament lists are any indication (not to mention the developers stated concerns), the reality is that people aren't flying them. And the reason is obvious to anyone who has tried to build a list with them - their 2 attack dice require that they either act as filler, which the Z-95 does better for scum (mainly thanks to it's illicit slot and lower cost), or fit into an arc dodging, A-Wing type role, for which they aren't manoeuverable enough (and they can't take autothrusters).

So the title and some kind of cannon essentially become auto-include, but then the price rises precipitously - a Mangler cannon gives you something essentially equivalent to a naked Alpha interceptor (worse dial, somewhat worse action bar, slightly better damage output) but for 20 points, and again, you can't take Autothrusters, which were essentially meant as a fix for interceptors.

The consensus seems to be, then, that the Scyk needs a bump, but there are a few caveats. It can't get much cheaper, since it doesn't want to step on the Z-95's toes. It also probably doesn't want a second title, since it already has one. And finally, any fix has to take into account the unique balancing issues around things like the ability to equip a HLC - we don't want to design a complete monster.

I wanted to propose a fix that took into account both the Scyk's stated role as an interceptor and its supposed ultra customisability. Thus, in the vein of the two Defender titles that have just been announced, I propose the following two engine related modification cards:

"Racing engines"

Modification

One point

M3-A Only

Your action bar gains the <Boost> Icon. You may treat all 2 and 3 speed manoeuvres as green.

"Combat Engines"

Modification

One point

M3-A Only

At the start of the combat phase, you may assign one evade token to your ship.

These two modifications allow the player to pick a play style, and a Scyk pilot to match it, since each pilot has a definite preference for one or the other.

Serissu or the Tansarii Point Veteran will be able to make great use of Racing Engines, thanks to their EPT slots. With Push the Limit, Boost, the Scyk's native Barrel Roll action and it's newly enlarged set of greens, the Scyk has suddenly become a very potent arc dodger, capable of boosting and barrel rolling every turn, then shedding it's stress with an unpredictable green manoeuvre. A typical build might look like this:

Tansarii Point Veteran (17)

Racing Engines (1)

Heavy Scyk (2)

Mangler Cannon (4)

Push the Limit (3)

Total: 27 points.

Or, on a budget, removing the title and Mangler cannon might well be an option, given that the Scyk should be able to close to range 1 reasonably consistently (against low PS opponents anyway).

Where an EPT is not available, Combat Engines become more viable. A free evade token every round (note: token, not action, so it works even when stressed) is akin to a shield upgrade in many ways, and a regenerating one to boot. This mod would make HLC toting Cartel Spacers - the essence of the glass cannon archetype - much more viable by making them that much harder to kill (Gorilla glass cannons maybe?). A mini swarm of 4 24 point Spacers with HLC, the title and Combat engines would have damage output somewhat comparable to a TLT BTL-A4 Y-Wing squad (at exactly the same price point, if salvaged mechs aren't taken), but encourage a very different playstyle. And those spare 4 points? Well, one option would be to upgrade one of your Spacers to Laetin A'Shera and enjoy the synergy of his ability and the free evade.

So that's my proposed fix. I think it's thematic, and plays to the Scyk's existing strengths without being OP. And people might well take it in different directions than I've thought of. For example, might VI Serissu with Combat Engines and a cannon be viable? Or even skip the cannon and just let Serissu be the Scum Biggs she already is, just with a touch more survivability.

What say you, X Wing community? Too much? Too little? Could you see yourself using both mods in one list or another, or does one obviously win out over the other? And most importantly, would these new engines be enough to get Scyks back to the table?

I still say, make a 0 point title that gives boost, and allows it to be used with another title.

This way nothing needs to change. This is the way that FFG likes to do things.

... and its supposed ultra customisability.

Not sure where you got this idea. The Scyk barely had space to customize. Your dream release, the CloakShape was the ultra customizable ship that could plug in and out entirely new systems to keep it up to date.

The Scyk's main gimmick in lore was that it could swap it's main weapon to practically anything usually another low power energy weapon or a launcher. The "Heavy" Scyk was more customizable in terms of power and mass for the weapon.

... and its supposed ultra customisability.

Not sure where you got this idea. The Scyk barely had space to customize.

The text on the Cartel Spacer cards specifically says that they're highly customizable.

... and its supposed ultra customisability.

Not sure where you got this idea. The Scyk barely had space to customize. Your dream release, the CloakShape was the ultra customizable ship that could plug in and out entirely new systems to keep it up to date.

The Scyk's main gimmick in lore was that it could swap it's main weapon to practically anything usually another low power energy weapon or a launcher. The "Heavy" Scyk was more customizable in terms of power and mass for the weapon.

I'd love to see the Cloakshape available, but honestly, theme-wise, they'd probably give it a systems slot and call it solved.

Maybe add to the Scyk Title a free extra munitions? IDK, just late night rambling thoughts.

Tractor beams seem to be the way for it to go but it's so low PS that it doesn't work well enough. Maybe they'll get a syck only upgrade that will make them worthwhile or maybe the last bit of text on tractor beams will prove important.

... and its supposed ultra customisability.

Not sure where you got this idea. The Scyk barely had space to customize.

The text on the Cartel Spacer cards specifically says that they're highly customizable.

"MandalMotors' M3-A "Scyk" Interceptor was purchased in large quantities by the Hutt Cartel and the Car'das smugglers due to its low cost and customizability."

Yes, it was customizable - compared to say a TIE - but it wasn't highly customizable like say a CloakShape or a CEC freighter. That being said - it should at least have an Illict Upgrade slot.

As I mentioned before the Scyk main draw was its universal weapon mount and targeting system which allowed the ship to swap it's lasers for an ion cannon, concussion missiles or proton torpedos - or any other weapon only limited by mass and power draw. The Heavy Scyk had a more powerful power plant and a heavy duty weapon mount allowing even larger and more power hungry weapons.

It was customizable to fit various battlefield roles by swapping weapons: It could be a defense fighter with lasers, a support fighter with ions, a hunter-killer with missles, or a capital torpedo bomber with torpedoes. Refitting the weapons system was fast and easy compared to most other starfighters and could be easily performed between missions. The ship attracted buyers who desired a versatile fleet comprising of single class of ship (thus reducing logistics costs) without paying the price of true multi-role starfighters.

Other than weapons, the Scyk wasn't a notably moddable ship. And while it COULD perform each of these roles - it performed none of these roles exceptionally well (this is a fact that FFG has over emphasised).

Thus in terms of upgrades, titles rather than mods would be a more sensible way to go. Just like the Royal Guard TIE title broke the rules on number of modifications, a Scyk title could give a boost while allowing a second title to be added - this could possibly be a title that prevents the primary weapon from firing like the Outrider title.

Also the fix package to Scyks probably should include copies of the Juke EPT which works well with the ship.

You really can't put anything on the Scyk that increases its cost. That's the core problem: it's overpriced for what it brings to the table.

Now at 21 points the Cartel Spacer HLC would be decent enough, putting it at a point more than an Avenger Squadron pilot.

I'm surprised that the Scyk doesn't natively have cannon and illicit slots, scrap the title and it's extra cost. I can understand dropping the missile to differentiate it from the Z-95 but it seems illicit would have been PERFECT for this ship. I just imagine these things flying super-hot and dangerous, buzzing around being a menace to their enemy and perhaps themselves.

Yeah the two point cost to equip weapons is what kills it title should of been free, it's too fragile for to put nine points into to have it carry a HLC.

... and its supposed ultra customisability.

Not sure where you got this idea. The Scyk barely had space to customize.

The text on the Cartel Spacer cards specifically says that they're highly customizable.

"MandalMotors' M3-A "Scyk" Interceptor was purchased in large quantities by the Hutt Cartel and the Car'das smugglers due to its low cost and customizability."

Yes, it was customizable - compared to say a TIE - but it wasn't highly customizable like say a CloakShape or a CEC freighter. That being said - it should at least have an Illict Upgrade slot.

As I mentioned before the Scyk main draw was its universal weapon mount and targeting system which allowed the ship to swap it's lasers for an ion cannon, concussion missiles or proton torpedos - or any other weapon only limited by mass and power draw. The Heavy Scyk had a more powerful power plant and a heavy duty weapon mount allowing even larger and more power hungry weapons.

It was customizable to fit various battlefield roles by swapping weapons: It could be a defense fighter with lasers, a support fighter with ions, a hunter-killer with missles, or a capital torpedo bomber with torpedoes. Refitting the weapons system was fast and easy compared to most other starfighters and could be easily performed between missions. The ship attracted buyers who desired a versatile fleet comprising of single class of ship (thus reducing logistics costs) without paying the price of true multi-role starfighters.

Other than weapons, the Scyk wasn't a notably moddable ship. And while it COULD perform each of these roles - it performed none of these roles exceptionally well (this is a fact that FFG has over emphasised).

Thus in terms of upgrades, titles rather than mods would be a more sensible way to go. Just like the Royal Guard TIE title broke the rules on number of modifications, a Scyk title could give a boost while allowing a second title to be added - this could possibly be a title that prevents the primary weapon from firing like the Outrider title.

Also the fix package to Scyks probably should include copies of the Juke EPT which works well with the ship.

Glad you agree with me on the title update. Like I said FFG stuck to the fluff, but over coasted the title because they didn't want 5 hLC scyks. Giving it boost as a title for 0 pts, and allowing it to be used with another title fixes this problem.

I find the easiest is to have the "Heavy Scyk" title provide one additional Shield in addition to allowing the Scyk to equip a cannon/missile. It's fairly thematic, and works with the idea of a "Heavy" version of the normal fighter. You still wind up with a fairly fragile gunboat, but it is somewhat more cost effective.

True. It may help balance it, but it really doesn't fit the fluff. It clearly states that nothing made the ship tougher, but that it could easily swap out weapons and engines.

Would a Scyk only modification mimicking autothrusters be enough to fix it? Assuming it was either a free upgrade or a single point.

0 point title that makes them twice as damaging. Keep them real fragile but up the potential damage output.

You really can't put anything on the Scyk that increases its cost. That's the core problem: it's overpriced for what it brings to the table.

Yeah, that's the consensus. And given the present options, you're right. But I think that the two options I've presented up here can still be viable at one point given the way they work with the existing Scyk pilots.

For starters, we have to consider the Scyk's closest Imperial and Rebel competitors - for the Cartel Spacer, that's the Alpha Squadron TIE Interceptor and the Prototype A-Wing:

You can see where FFG were going when you look at all three of the factions base pilots for their interceptors. The Scyk has the Prototype's Attack Value and the Alpha's hitpoints (slightly better because of the one shield) for a price that's significantly lower than both, and you even get a higher pilot skill. But, of course, that purely numerical analysis doesn't take into account the realities of playing each of these ships.

The Prototype pilot will almost always be run with Chardaan refit, so its extra shield really only costs one point over the Scyk, and, as we all know, a red die is worth a tonne of points - going from two to three is huge, easily paid for by the 4 point bump for the Alpha vs. the Scyk.

The PS boost is probably illusory, to my mind, since PS2 is arguably worse than PS1; it doesn't get you out of the Predator danger zone, or let you shoot before dangerous PS2 ships like the TLT wielding Gold Squadron pilot, but it also doesn't necessarily mean your ship is going to move first, which is critical for making a good blocker.

The other two big factors are the Dials (The A Wing and TIE Interceptor just have a better dial - all the 2s are green, as are all the straights (bar 5 on the Interceptor), while the Scky only gets 2 banks and 2 and 3 straights green, and it loses 3 hards and a 5 straight in favour of (white) 1 banks; it's objectively worse) and, the focus of this thread so far, the lack of boost and autothrusters access.

And so we come to the point of that little analysis: Giving the Scyk boost isn't enough to fix it relative to its competitors in other factions. A 16 point Cartel Spacer with Autothrusters is a significantly worse ship than a 17 point Prototype pilot with Autothrusters: it loses a shield, has a significantly worse dial and it has a less useful (if admittedly higher) PS. It's actually closer with the Alpha squadron pilot, if you throw a Mangler cannon on it. A 22 point Cartel Spacer with Autothrusters is pretty comparable to a 20 point Alpha squadron with Autothrusters - the Manglers advantages (no extra green for your opponent at range 3, that auto crit) seem pretty close to being worth two points, but you're still dealing with that significantly worse dial and the less useful PS

And, let's not forget, that this is probably as good as it gets for the Scyk in terms of comparisons to similar ships. As your budget increases, the Interceptor and the A Wing both get better pilot abilities and their titles come into play, while the Scyk, in this scenario, is currently as kitted out as it can be, with two titles, a cannon slot and a mod slot already filled. Arguably, there's a place for a 25 point HLC Scyk with Autothrusters, but that's a super niche case - unless you're flying multiples, then you have one high threat, low hitpoint, low PS ship that will get focussed down quickly - quite possibly before it gets to fire.

Hence, the two modifications I proposed. A free evade token (not an action) every turn is basically equivalent to a regenerating shield, so a 15 point Spacer with Combat engines is much, much closer to an A Wing (effectively the same stats, but with Barrel Roll instead of boost). The regen partially compensates for the dial - the value one way or the other would depend more on your playstyle than anything that can be quantified across the board. Admittedly, there's no room for Autothrusters or Stealth Device on this kind of Scyk, and that's a shame, but FFG have kind of painted themselves into that corner - I don't think we're going to see multiple titles on one ship, so the mod slot is the only place these changes can go.

If anything, thinking about these changes again, I think they probably could be zero point modifications, if only because of that disparity of Autothrusters potential on the other two interceptors.

The fact is, these changes arguably don't go far enough to fix the problems with the ship - that 2 point cannon upgrade title is just a massive handicap, but arguably justifiable when you realise that (if memory serves) the Scyk is one of only a pair of 2 attack ships that can take a cannon (the other being the YT-2400) and the HLC's 7 points is priced to compensate a jump from 3 to 4 red dice, not from 2 to 4. It's just unfortunate that that also impacts things like the Ion Cannon as well. It's entirely possible that, even if these changes were adopted, there might not be life left in the current pilots. The Scyk fix might involve something like this and some badass pilot abilities that bring them back to the tables. But I really do think something like this is a minimum starting point - just giving them boost won't do the job.

Finally, as for the question of lore around what the Scyk can and can't do, a couple of points there. First, the old SWG lore is no longer canon - the Scyk can do whatever LFL decide it can do from now on, and if FFG want to take the word "customisable" and run with it further than Galaxies did, they can. Secondly, and far, far more importantly, Gameplay trumps Lore every single time. Don't get me wrong - I don't want to see TIE Interceptors with super strong shields or Y Wings with A Wing dials - when designing a ship, the lore gives you a place to start from, and the closer you can get it, the better. But if a ship just doesn't work - and the Scyk definitely seems to fall into that category - then letting lore hold you back is exactly the wrong way to go about building a game, and I'm confident FFG won't do that.

For starters, we have to consider the Scyk's closest Imperial and Rebel competitors - for the Cartel Spacer, that's the Alpha Squadron TIE Interceptor and the Prototype A-Wing:

Actually the closest matches are A-wing and Tie\Fo

the first one is 1 point more costly, gets EPIC DIAL, changes barrel for a boost, gets PS1 for blocking duty

Second one also has an epic dial, extra hull and extra slot.

???

Oh it's bad luck to be Scyk

Personally, I'd rather have the dial improved vastly but keep it squishy. This keeps it different but still competitive to the TIE/fo (This is the closest ship it is similar to). If anything I'd prefer them shootier. I don't mind the the free evade mod really - it does combo well with the Juke EPT.

I'd like to see an option to get rid of the primary weapon for a point cost rebate as well - this is both true to fluff and only useful if you up gun the M3-A so it won't clash with the Z-95 in roles. The G1-M4-C Dunelizard fighter, a heavier ship based on the M3-A also has this option.

A second title allowing it to attach a 3 pt or less secondary weapon that costs 0 points would help if you are not planning to put a Mangler or a HLC on the M3-A.

Lastly if you don't at least try to be true to the fluff, I might as well buy generic cool starships off shapeways and stat my own ships. What makes X-Wing cool is that is its Star Wars - a familar fantastic setting. Sacrificing the fluff makes it not Star Wars anymore even if its a better game.

Would a Scyk only modification mimicking autothrusters be enough to fix it? Assuming it was either a free upgrade or a single point.

See my title in the thread above. It gives them boost for 0 pts and allows them to equip another title.

For me there are two big problems with the scyk.

1. The title is over costed. They would have been better making it free but limiting cannons to Manhlers or cheaper.

2. They can't slow roll. This means they can't maintain a safe distance with their expensive cannons but end up either shooting into a joust and dying horribly or trying to circle the main furnall and miss lots of shots, making it pointless having invested in a cannon at all.

Vs

How about this for a tweak:

Light Scyk (title) : When you review your dial with a turn or straight, you may increase or decrease the movement by one.

Specifically, I would leave off "with a minimum value of 1" and so it would be the only ship in the game with a 0 turn. At least this way it would finally bring something unique to the table. I think I heard one of the developers say that they took the 1 straight off the dial at the last minute and regret it. It would fix that too. It might have to be a red maneuver, so you would effectively get a red 1 and 5 straight, and a red 0 and 3 turn.

Not sure what the point cost ought to be.

How about this for a tweak:

Light Scyk (title) : When you review your dial with a turn or straight, you may increase or decrease the movement by one.

Specifically, I would leave off "with a minimum value of 1" and so it would be the only ship in the game with a 0 turn. At least this way it would finally bring something unique to the table. I think I heard one of the developers say that they took the 1 straight off the dial at the last minute and regret it. It would fix that too. It might have to be a red maneuver, so you would effectively get a red 1 and 5 straight, and a red 0 and 3 turn.

Not sure what the point cost ought to be.

Scyks can't move ↑1. Their slowest ↑ is 2. Without the "with a min value of 1" is strange and confusing unless u specify that you can make a full stop maneuver (■).

That is the point, just like Tetren Cowall, the changed maneuver does not have to be on the dial, hence it is red.

I'm not disagreeing - I'm just saying the wording could be more precise - but if FFG wants to use it - they can clean it up

I would of been happy with the M3 A if the title was 0 points, provided an extra hull point but had the caveat that you must equip either a cannon, torp or missile upgrade.

This would mean a three agility/hull shield with a single shield is at minimum 16 points (Flechette). Doesn't push the cheaper Headhunter out but does give you options when making a scum list that isn't TLT spam or Aggressors.