Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

against a plumber.

what a feat

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

the first time he sees blood he breaks and quits

Most celebrated? For what? Outstanding crap extra job completion?

But he got lightsaber training obviously ... or otherwise he would have cut himself into halves ...

The way I see it, Finn was trained to be a certain way and thought of himself as a "good guy". Next thing he knows, he's being dropped into a combat zone where they are butchering normal people. One of his friends dies and he loses it. The more he watches he sees the First Order flaming people's houses and gunning down unarmed civilians. I thought it was decent enough.

I wouldn't think a Storm Trooper would be on sanitation duty, but I guess if they have enough troops, you can't be a soldier all the time. You can have a secondary job while you wait for the next conflict.

But he got lightsaber training obviously ... or otherwise he would have cut himself into halves ...

well there was that one stormtrooper ("TRAITOR!") who showed that even the basic mooks have trained for melee combat, even if it is with that weird mace/tonfa thing

But he got lightsaber training obviously ... or otherwise he would have cut himself into halves ...

well there was that one stormtrooper ("TRAITOR!") who showed that even the basic mooks have trained for melee combat, even if it is with that weird mace/tonfa thing

I wonder how Stormtroopers recognize other Stormtroopers while not in the Stormtrooper glove ... are they all black now?

But he got lightsaber training obviously ... or otherwise he would have cut himself into halves ...

well there was that one stormtrooper ("TRAITOR!") who showed that even the basic mooks have trained for melee combat, even if it is with that weird mace/tonfa thing

I wonder how Stormtroopers recognize other Stormtroopers while not in the Stormtrooper glove ... are they all black now?

that would add a dark (no pun intended) racial subtext to the First Order for sure

but it just seems that they log all their troopers from the moment they are indoctrinated

if you look closely when Phasma is showing the traitor trooper to Ren, you can see a little baby Finn face in the holographic display

so yeah, I'm willing to bet they log every **** that every trooper has taken, to say nothing about having their physical features on file

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

Not disputing this at all (as I don't know) but where did you get this info?

Before the Awakening.

Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

against a plumber.

what a feat

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

the first time he sees blood he breaks and quits

Most celebrated? For what? Outstanding crap extra job completion?

You're gonna have to read the book I've already spoiled too much. Before the Awakening chapter one is all about Finn and his training.

But he got lightsaber training obviously ... or otherwise he would have cut himself into halves ...

well there was that one stormtrooper ("TRAITOR!") who showed that even the basic mooks have trained for melee combat, even if it is with that weird mace/tonfa thing

I wonder how Stormtroopers recognize other Stormtroopers while not in the Stormtrooper glove ... are they all black now?

that would add a dark (no pun intended) racial subtext to the First Order for sure

but it just seems that they log all their troopers from the moment they are indoctrinated

if you look closely when Phasma is showing the traitor trooper to Ren, you can see a little baby Finn face in the holographic display

so yeah, I'm willing to bet they log every **** that every trooper has taken, to say nothing about having their physical features on file

Hmmm ...

I wouldn't wonder if the awakening also affected Finn ... maybe he is also kind of sub force-sensitive

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

don't think it's because that guy was a friend (though I fully expected Finn to go full on berserker and wreck Poe's ****)

poor Finn just got overwhelmed by the battle at large and couldn't handle it

the last straw was being ordered to butcher the remaining vilalgers

he turned traitor primarily to run the **** away from the first order because he just couldn't handle that lifestyle anymore. His heroics after the fact were all after he got attached to Rei

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

don't think it's because that guy was a friend (though I fully expected Finn to go full on berserker and wreck Poe's ****)

poor Finn just got overwhelmed by the battle at large and couldn't handle it

the last straw was being ordered to butcher the remaining vilalgers

he turned traitor primarily to run the **** away from the first order because he just couldn't handle that lifestyle anymore. His heroics after the fact were all after he got attached to Rei

Calling fn-2187's actions heroic sounds dangerously like you're a rebel sympathizer!

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

Not all movie.

There was the bit where Poe ditched fn-2187 just as soon as they were clear, and abandoned him on a desert planet to either die or be recaptured by the First Order.

No wonder he looked surprised when they were reunited on D'Qar. Hell, Poe looked happier to be reunited with his droid.

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

don't think it's because that guy was a friend (though I fully expected Finn to go full on berserker and wreck Poe's ****)

poor Finn just got overwhelmed by the battle at large and couldn't handle it

the last straw was being ordered to butcher the remaining vilalgers

he turned traitor primarily to run the **** away from the first order because he just couldn't handle that lifestyle anymore. His heroics after the fact were all after he got attached to Rei

Calling fn-2187's actions heroic sounds dangerously like you're a rebel sympathizer!

wouldn't that be resistance sympathizer now ?

No one knows what happened over the thirty years. At least not yet. That is what the novels and comics are filling in and those have only gone in to the first year or so to date. Other than Before the Awakening which happens just before the film opens.

And it isn't really any faster than say Episode IV, look at how much stuff happens there and we don't know anything about what happened before when we first see that movie.

I'm OK with not knowing everything, but I feel like I don't know enough. As stated, part of it is just due to the pace of the movie. I felt I didn't get enough time to digest what little they gave out before I was rushed into a new scene.

Even then, there was a bit more discussion on the back drop in Ep IV. The Emperor dissolved the Senate. There is concern for order, but he will use Imperial Governors. The Republic was guarded by the Jedi for 1000 generations. There was a Clone Wars. Luke wants to leave his home to go off to the Imperial Academy. Han Solo needs to pay off Jabba the Hutt.

I don't mind finding out more later, but I feel like they didn't give enough now.

The Alliance restored the Republic. Leia started the Resistence to deal with the FO because the Republic isn't.

First Order replaced the Empire and is now ready to strike the Republic with a super weapon they have built.

They also indoctrinate babies and turn them into soldiers.

There was a big battle at Jakku, at least as big as Endor because the Empire lost multiple star destroyers including an SSD.

Luke went looking for the first Jedi temple and starting training new Jedi

Han Solo and Leia had a kid, He betrayed his uncle and killed the new Jedi with the Knights of Ren who work for Snoke and the FO. And Luke went into hiding and left a map behind.

Someone left Rey on the worst planet in the Galaxy.

The falcon was stolen several times until it ended up on Jakku. In the mean time Solo kept smuggling. He also hung out with Maz

That's all from the movie. They had to introduce a lot of new characters and estaish a good bit of history. They have two more movies to answer more questions. We will see what Snoke is up to and where he comes from, who Rey's parents are and all the other things we are wondering about.

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

Not disputing this at all (as I don't know) but where did you get this info?

Before the Awakening.

It bugs me a bit that I need to read a book written for 8-12 year olds to get background information.

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

Not all movie.

There was the bit where Poe ditched fn-2187 just as soon as they were clear, and abandoned him on a desert planet to either die or be recaptured by the First Order.

No wonder he looked surprised when they were reunited on D'Qar. Hell, Poe looked happier to be reunited with his droid.

I believe he was happier to see bb8. Fn-2187 was decidedly o.k. with hearing that Poe just peaced out.

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

Not the whole reason. It's just the final straw.

I found it hilarious that the whole reason fn-2187 turned traitor was because his friend got dusted by Poe. Then fn-2187 is buddy buddy with Poe all movie unknowingly.

don't think it's because that guy was a friend (though I fully expected Finn to go full on berserker and wreck Poe's ****)

poor Finn just got overwhelmed by the battle at large and couldn't handle it

the last straw was being ordered to butcher the remaining vilalgers

he turned traitor primarily to run the **** away from the first order because he just couldn't handle that lifestyle anymore. His heroics after the fact were all after he got attached to Rei

Calling fn-2187's actions heroic sounds dangerously like you're a rebel sympathizer!

wouldn't that be resistance sympathizer now ?

why... Rebels is so much cooler!

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

Not disputing this at all (as I don't know) but where did you get this info?

Before the Awakening.

It bugs me a bit that I need to read a book written for 8-12 year olds to get background information.

Then don't read it. It's a good read and at 191 pages doesn't take long. I started last night and am almost done.

I'm really hoping that with all the symmetry between ANH and TFA that this movie's Obi-Wan (Han Solo) isn't telling the full truth in relating why Luke disappeared. It would make sense for Luke to go into seclusion if his own dark side tendencies had caused the corruption of his students and he bailed to keep from screwing up any more of them.

Rey having received some training and then having some Jedi version of the MIB Neuralyzer used on her would explain a lot.

I don't buy into the Ep IV repeat criticism. Not close enough at all for me to follow that thinking. Definitely some similarities but not enough to say that. Good callbacks to all the original films, though.

The Kylo-Rey fight is easy to explain and I'm not the only one saying it.

1. Bowcaster to the gut

2. Already tired out from one lightsaber fight while also bleeding out (while the fight itself may not have tired him much, the wound will tire with any amount of physical activity)

3. Rey did have ability in martial arts before force grabbing the saber (staff fighting) and had latent force talents, she was also already shown to be a quick study with the mind trick (even if it was a bit Mary Sue, it was in the story and supports her ability to pick up force ability quickly)

Actually, my only issue with the entire film is that it's the first saga film in which someone did not have a limb removed (unless I missed it, pretty sure no one did, though).

Not the first. No limbs lost in ANH or Phantom Menace. So far the trend is actually that the second and third parts of the trilogy feature severed limbs, so we may be able to make a full tradition of this yet.

Star Wars was not originally going to be a trilogy, but they were hoping for it. Apparently Vader was originally going to die when Han ambushes him during the trench run, but they changed it because he was the only villain they had left at that point. They went into the writers room for ESB knowing they were making a trilogy out of it, which is why those two have a better sense of continuity. Especially in the completely unedited versions there are some small inconsistencies between ANH and the other two, because ANH wasn't made to be part of a trilogy from day one like the others were.

I don't buy into the Ep IV repeat criticism. Not close enough at all for me to follow that thinking. Definitely some similarities but not enough to say that. Good callbacks to all the original films, though.

The Kylo-Rey fight is easy to explain and I'm not the only one saying it.

1. Bowcaster to the gut

2. Already tired out from one lightsaber fight while also bleeding out (while the fight itself may not have tired him much, the wound will tire with any amount of physical activity)

3. Rey did have ability in martial arts before force grabbing the saber (staff fighting) and had latent force talents, she was also already shown to be a quick study with the mind trick (even if it was a bit Mary Sue, it was in the story and supports her ability to pick up force ability quickly)

Actually, my only issue with the entire film is that it's the first saga film in which someone did not have a limb removed (unless I missed it, pretty sure no one did, though).

Not the first. No limbs lost in ANH or Phantom Menace. So far the trend is actually that the second and third parts of the trilogy feature severed limbs, so we may be able to make a full tradition of this yet.

Episode IV was designed as a trilogy...or so I thought.

Still, I think they could've given us more info than what they did. I think it was a detriment to the outcome of the movie. I think it would've been GREAT if they spaced the scenes out a little bit and gave us a tad bit more information.

Instead, it was GOOD.

Star Wars was not originally going to be a trilogy, but they were hoping for it. Apparently Vader was originally going to die when Han ambushes him during the trench run, but they changed it because he was the only villain they had left at that point. They went into the writers room for ESB knowing they were making a trilogy out of it, which is why those two have a better sense of continuity. Especially in the completely unedited versions there are some small inconsistencies between ANH and the other two, because ANH wasn't made to be part of a trilogy from day one like the others were.

Maul gets cut in half in episode I

Ponda Baba gets his arm cut off in episode IV

I made it to page 13 before the negative and hate became powerful. I'm taking that as a plus, actually, as the internet is filled with hate and loathing.

My reaction? I liked it. I kept myself clear of spoilers and limited my interpretations of the trailers to 'it looks pretty.' The acting was better than any of the films. Search your feelings, you know it to be true. The story isn't much different but there are big differences. The music... Ok, nothing stood out. That can be a good thing but there has always been a big tune that is memorable.

Action scenes are short and quick. That's ok. I always want more star fighter battles, and could sit through two hours of it with no story, but sacrificing battle scenes for more character interaction is a good thing. I felt that was a weakness in some of the Lord of the Rings franchise. Eventually it feels like the movie is an excuse to film a big battle.

Personally I have no complaints about JJ Abrams work on this. I hated Star Trek but I like what I saw here.

Flaws? A few. Game breaking? No.

7/10 seems an easy rating.

3po lost an arm in ANH and got totally blown apart in ESB. Sure he got better, but still counts as dismemberment. Oh and his eye got chewed out in ROTJ. Talk about brutal.