How did Kylo Ren get his ass handed to him though? By someone who was unaware they even had the force a few hours earlier.

I guess Luke skipped lightsaber training.

Someone dares to stand up to him? He is already unbalanced by constantly failing to be as evil as Darth while thinking he should be perfect.

First that betraying stormtrooper, then the crumbling of all around him and then this, this backwater girl with no training dares?

That's enough to lose.

How did Kylo Ren get his ass handed to him though? By someone who was unaware they even had the force a few hours earlier.

I guess Luke skipped lightsaber training.

Someone dares to stand up to him? He is already unbalanced by constantly failing to be as evil as Darth while thinking he should be perfect.

First that betraying stormtrooper, then the crumbling of all around him and then this, this backwater girl with no training dares?

That's enough to lose.

Actually I can buy that argument... and I guess in fairness he did take a bowcaster shot to the gut before hand as well.

How did Kylo Ren get his ass handed to him though? By someone who was unaware they even had the force a few hours earlier.

I guess Luke skipped lightsaber training.

Someone dares to stand up to him? He is already unbalanced by constantly failing to be as evil as Darth while thinking he should be perfect.

First that betraying stormtrooper, then the crumbling of all around him and then this, this backwater girl with no training dares?

That's enough to lose.

Yeah Rey threw him off of his game. Guy is a few screws lose at the best of times let alone when he can't just be the bully.

Kilo Ren looks more likely to be a member if ISIS then the son of Han and Leia.

The guy has giant ears hidden by his black hair with a long crooked nose. Not trying to insult the guy just point out he looks nothing like them. Great voice for the part though. They should have just kept the mask on...the one that serves no purpose.

Wow, that's a bit out of order.

And Ren lost to Rey due to a)him holding back to taunt her about her force powers

b)being shot in the gut by a bowcaster

My reaction? Spectacular. Disney has saved my childhood after Lucas ruined it with episodes 1-3.

Saw the death of a character coming a long way off, in fact I blame Leia for their death more than anyone else. Alas, it was likely the right move as they left it too long to make these films and the chances of said actor living long enough to make another trilogy aren't as good as they could be.

Also, look up some pictures of young Harrison Ford. There is definitely a likeness.

As for being beaten, he was dealing with a gut shot and had just done something that would likely have left him a bit off balance, emotionally.

Also, look up some pictures of young Harrison Ford. There is definitely a likeness.

As for being beaten, he was dealing with a gut shot and had just done something that would likely have left him a bit off balance, emotionally.

That's true and at that point in the movie he obviously didn't find it easy. Hmm, the more I think about this movie the more I like it. Glad to be going to a second showing in a few days.

How did Kylo Ren get his ass handed to him though? By someone who was unaware they even had the force a few hours earlier.

I guess Luke skipped lightsaber training.

A bowcaster shot to the gut maybe?

Also, look up some pictures of young Harrison Ford. There is definitely a likeness.

As for being beaten, he was dealing with a gut shot and had just done something that would likely have left him a bit off balance, emotionally.

A theory I read ahead of the movie that he was Han and Leia's kid used that similarity to sell it, and it was enough to convince me that I wasn't particularly surprised at the reveal.

Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

The first one obviously didn't count. The dude he was fighting got his ass handed to him by a random stormtrooper and there is no evidence that he had any force sensitivity.

OK....I finally saw it on Sunday. I started to read through this thread....but there are 21 pages already! I got about half way and am going to skip to the end.

I liked it. I did.......but......I felt there was something missing.

To me, it felt too fast paced. It was go, go, go from the very beginning. There was not enough time to digest what happened or do a decent transition to the next scene. I think it could've just slowed down a little bit more. Ep IV always had a couple of seconds of staring into the twin suns of the desert or Vader chatting with an Imperial officer about some background info. The new one gave just enough information to rush you into the next scene. I almost feel like the fight at the Pirate Queen's place was the same one as the final fight at the end. What transition was there?

So....because of that rush job, I felt like we didn't really get much background info. The Knights of Ren? Who? Where did the Resistance come from? It was just enough info to go on and no more.

I know I need to see it again to really get a feel for it. When it comes out on video I'm going to have to watch it and re-watch it to really get it. Maybe there will be an extended release that will have all those spare moments between scenes?

Someone else said they could've let the movie "breathe" and I agree with that.

As for it being a repeat of Ep IV...they did say they were taking everything that was good about the original and redoing it. I'm fine with it being an almost reboot as it didn't suck. That was the one requirement. I liked it. I did, but I just want more.

OK....I finally saw it on Sunday. I started to read through this thread....but there are 21 pages already! I got about half way and am going to skip to the end.

I liked it. I did.......but......I felt there was something missing.

To me, it felt too fast paced. It was go, go, go from the very beginning. There was not enough time to digest what happened or do a decent transition to the next scene. I think it could've just slowed down a little bit more. Ep IV always had a couple of seconds of staring into the twin suns of the desert or Vader chatting with an Imperial officer about some background info. The new one gave just enough information to rush you into the next scene. I almost feel like the fight at the Pirate Queen's place was the same one as the final fight at the end. What transition was there?

So....because of that rush job, I felt like we didn't really get much background info. The Knights of Ren? Who? Where did the Resistance come from? It was just enough info to go on and no more.

I know I need to see it again to really get a feel for it. When it comes out on video I'm going to have to watch it and re-watch it to really get it. Maybe there will be an extended release that will have all those spare moments between scenes?

Someone else said they could've let the movie "breathe" and I agree with that.

As for it being a repeat of Ep IV...they did say they were taking everything that was good about the original and redoing it. I'm fine with it being an almost reboot as it didn't suck. That was the one requirement. I liked it. I did, but I just want more.

I agree with a lot of this, I have no idea what happened between Episode VI and VII and the movie unfortunately didn't help with that at all. Rey would have been the perfect clueless protagonist to explain these things to as she was out of touch and it would have given the story a reason to fill us in on the gaps. Instead the movie just seems to assume you know what happened over the past 30 years.

I don't buy into the Ep IV repeat criticism. Not close enough at all for me to follow that thinking. Definitely some similarities but not enough to say that. Good callbacks to all the original films, though.

The Kylo-Rey fight is easy to explain and I'm not the only one saying it.

1. Bowcaster to the gut

2. Already tired out from one lightsaber fight while also bleeding out (while the fight itself may not have tired him much, the wound will tire with any amount of physical activity)

3. Rey did have ability in martial arts before force grabbing the saber (staff fighting) and had latent force talents, she was also already shown to be a quick study with the mind trick (even if it was a bit Mary Sue, it was in the story and supports her ability to pick up force ability quickly)

Actually, my only issue with the entire film is that it's the first saga film in which someone did not have a limb removed (unless I missed it, pretty sure no one did, though).

Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

against a plumber.

what a feat

OK....I finally saw it on Sunday. I started to read through this thread....but there are 21 pages already! I got about half way and am going to skip to the end.

I liked it. I did.......but......I felt there was something missing.

To me, it felt too fast paced. It was go, go, go from the very beginning. There was not enough time to digest what happened or do a decent transition to the next scene. I think it could've just slowed down a little bit more. Ep IV always had a couple of seconds of staring into the twin suns of the desert or Vader chatting with an Imperial officer about some background info. The new one gave just enough information to rush you into the next scene. I almost feel like the fight at the Pirate Queen's place was the same one as the final fight at the end. What transition was there?

So....because of that rush job, I felt like we didn't really get much background info. The Knights of Ren? Who? Where did the Resistance come from? It was just enough info to go on and no more.

I know I need to see it again to really get a feel for it. When it comes out on video I'm going to have to watch it and re-watch it to really get it. Maybe there will be an extended release that will have all those spare moments between scenes?

Someone else said they could've let the movie "breathe" and I agree with that.

As for it being a repeat of Ep IV...they did say they were taking everything that was good about the original and redoing it. I'm fine with it being an almost reboot as it didn't suck. That was the one requirement. I liked it. I did, but I just want more.

I agree with a lot of this, I have no idea what happened between Episode VI and VII and the movie unfortunately didn't help with that at all. Rey would have been the perfect clueless protagonist to explain these things to as she was out of touch and it would have given the story a reason to fill us in on the gaps. Instead the movie just seems to assume you know what happened over the past 30 years.

No one knows what happened over the thirty years. At least not yet. That is what the novels and comics are filling in and those have only gone in to the first year or so to date. Other than Before the Awakening which happens just before the film opens.

And it isn't really any faster than say Episode IV, look at how much stuff happens there and we don't know anything about what happened before when we first see that movie.

So, soldiers never get sanitation duty in the armed forces?

Again - Kylo Ren fought not one, but TWO lightsabre duels, and won the first one.

against a plumber.

what a feat

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

No one knows what happened over the thirty years. At least not yet. That is what the novels and comics are filling in and those have only gone in to the first year or so to date. Other than Before the Awakening which happens just before the film opens.

And it isn't really any faster than say Episode IV, look at how much stuff happens there and we don't know anything about what happened before when we first see that movie.

I'm OK with not knowing everything, but I feel like I don't know enough. As stated, part of it is just due to the pace of the movie. I felt I didn't get enough time to digest what little they gave out before I was rushed into a new scene.

Even then, there was a bit more discussion on the back drop in Ep IV. The Emperor dissolved the Senate. There is concern for order, but he will use Imperial Governors. The Republic was guarded by the Jedi for 1000 generations. There was a Clone Wars. Luke wants to leave his home to go off to the Imperial Academy. Han Solo needs to pay off Jabba the Hutt.

I don't mind finding out more later, but I feel like they didn't give enough now.

They have to save material for later movies and books etc. Remember this is a trilogy right from the start with a whole host of extra material. None of which is what episode IV had going with it 38 years ago.

Do we now get also an old age version of Han Solo, Princess ... or General ... Leia and Luke? - since we mix fighters and stuff of all ages.

Episode IV was designed as a trilogy...or so I thought.

Still, I think they could've given us more info than what they did. I think it was a detriment to the outcome of the movie. I think it would've been GREAT if they spaced the scenes out a little bit and gave us a tad bit more information.

Instead, it was GOOD.

Episode IV was designed as a trilogy...or so I thought.

Still, I think they could've given us more info than what they did. I think it was a detriment to the outcome of the movie. I think it would've been GREAT if they spaced the scenes out a little bit and gave us a tad bit more information.

Instead, it was GOOD.

Depends on what day of the week you ask George.

Finn is not a plumber. He is a fully trained Stormtrooper and one of the most celebrated by no less than Captain Phasma herself. Sanitation was just one of his crap extra duties. Pun intended.

Not disputing this at all (as I don't know) but where did you get this info?

So, soldiers never get sanitation duty in the armed forces?

Not in a garrison environment. Yeah in the field on a COP (combat outpost) lower level soldiers will be burning poop. But back at a base in the states that's all done by civilians.

I don't buy into the Ep IV repeat criticism. Not close enough at all for me to follow that thinking. Definitely some similarities but not enough to say that. Good callbacks to all the original films, though.

Really? It was nearly a parallel to Episode IV (with elements of 5 & 6 sprinkled) right down to the cantina scene and trench run. Only thing that was different was new characters and locals.