Oh, almost forgot basic movement speed, movement chart etc.

I personally like the ship, and if I played rebels I would make lists to leverage its niche value. As it stands I play imperials and when I look across the table I can unambiguously say that I would MUCH rather see 1 MC80 than see 2 whales. Hands down.

Another counterpoint: If MC80 was worth its points, 3 MC80 lists would be just as viable as 3 ISD lists, but they aren't. Full stop.

I have a compulsion to buy all the ships that could potentially make viable lists and I tried really hard to justify buying a third MC80 but even full on, late stage Prack addiction I couldn't find a reason to take 3. 2 is even kinda dumb. 4 whales, however....

If MC80 was worth its points, 3 MC80 lists would be just as viable as 3 ISD lists, but they aren't.

This is really the only argument that needs to be made about why the MC80 sucks.

Triple ISD isn't great, but it's playable. I've seen it on the table a few times.

Triple MC80 is bad, and I've never even seen somebody play it for fun. Although now that I'm talking about it, I kind of want to try...

Three Little Poops

Fleet Points: 397

MC80 Command Cruiser (108)

- Admiral Ackbar (38)

- ECM (7)

- Home One (8)

MC80 Command Cruiser (108)

- XI7 Turbolasers (6)

- Leading Shots

MC80 Command Cruiser (108)

- XI7 Turbolasers (6)

- Leading Shots

Objectives:

- Advanced Gunnery

- Firing Lanes

- Minefields

You cant really take Ackbar with triple MC80 which is upsetting, Mon Mothma is useless and Rieekan seems a tad defeatist. Garm would be useful, but your probably not taking squadrons.

So:

MC80 Command, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

398 points.

Good luck taking that down.

You cant really take Ackbar with triple MC80 which is upsetting, Mon Mothma is useless and Rieekan seems a tad defeatist. Garm would be useful, but your probably not taking squadrons.

So:

MC80 Command, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

398 points.

Good luck taking that down.

Rhymer says Hi...and bye... Don't have to take 3 down only need to take one.

Personally I wouldn't take a 3 poop list without...wait for it... engine techs...

Dodonna is a possibly a good choice for admiral cause it leaves you more room for upgrades and home one is a good title to take, then either add defensive or offensive upgrades to taste or a couple of A wings

Engine techs mean speed 3 (at a steep command cost) and at the right time it might make the difference. I still would not want to take this to a tournament and face a B wing or Y wing spam or a rhymerball.

-LYraeus helped me with some of the menace

YT-1300 was his suggestion with neb bs

I couldn't do the neb Bs but the YT-1300 are great. The slow speed means you really have to be careful and place them correctly. HWKs are the key to get at Ryhmer himself.

I play larger point games so my current ball I face is as follows and the counter which is decent if the dice are ok to me holds them off long enough.

Rhymer

Vader

2x tie advanced

Soontir

Howlrunner

Degnar

3x Intercepters

Mithral

3x Yt-1300

Hwk

Wedge

Jan

3x X-wings

1x A-wing

1x YT-2400

The A-wing and YT-2400 add some first strike capability or also the ability to zoom using the freeing of the HWK over and get that last hit needed so a ship with one HP left doesn't get a GT on me the next turn. Also allows me to to jump pass a I defended corner of the ball. Sometimes the wife take out a interceptor and puts in an advance four a nasty four corner "Roman Square" with Mith, Dang, howl, Soontir, and Rhymer inside with no room to entire and just two advance sometimes alpha striking me lately to prevent a coordinated defense. Bi+<£. Obviously with the YT1300 you have to catch up to them and really only work with an Ackbar conga where you can place them where you are going. I using ET on my MC80s so they limit the ET ability until the right moment. Wife is getting too good at preventing any Ackbar slash. She converges with the ISD and two VSDs and flanks with the glad. 630 points so significant upgrades like GT keep me from staying together. I just hope she doesn't avoid my Squdrons entirely and jump to my rear MC80. I will be putting the one MC80 first followed by and AF then MC80 and my tail will be the decked out mC30 because the glad had been too much of a problem as of late. That is stacked with OE,admonition, TRC,ACM, Walex, and advance projectors. The projector buy you one turn and admonition buys you another going against the heavy hitters. Using Wallex to get back a an Evade for the turbo reroute circuits and hopefully on point 3 tokens for 3 dice on the 2 hit leaves me another advance projector use for their rear guns.

An AFa with expand Hangers, GH, RS, Point Reroute Defence. PRD seems 2 points too much from the results I've seen but no alternative rit now. One of the few cards except some officers like engineering teams etc costing too much.

Attempt to have a MC80 within range at some point in the later squdron battle to help hit the squadrons but I am forced to sacrifice the two extra dice a turn doing that. 4 ships per side in 630 points means each packs a punch.

You cant really take Ackbar with triple MC80 which is upsetting, Mon Mothma is useless and Rieekan seems a tad defeatist. Garm would be useful, but your probably not taking squadrons.

So:

MC80 Command, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

398 points.

Good luck taking that down.

Rhymer says Hi...and bye... Don't have to take 3 down only need to take one.

Personally I wouldn't take a 3 poop list without...wait for it... engine techs...

Modified to:

MC80 Assault, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots,

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Cluster Bombs, Quad Lasers, Leading Shots,

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Cluster Bombs, Quad Lasers, Leading Shots,

396 pts

Cluster bombs are the anti Rhymer I have decided. The only ship weapon that can really hurt rhymer at medium distance. Then Quad lasers with double AS fire mop up the rest of the bombers.

The Assault sits slightly behind the other two and they all slow roll. I dont see why they have to chase down their target, so not sure of the necessity of engine techs here. I would agree if you wanted to keep up with faster corvette etc, but in reality they just make it really hard to fly, what will already be really hard to fly in formation.

Home one would be nice, as would X17's, or XX9's, some ECM's/APT's, Lando, Walex and Raymus.... but alas cant afford any of those.

You cant really take Ackbar with triple MC80 which is upsetting, Mon Mothma is useless and Rieekan seems a tad defeatist. Garm would be useful, but your probably not taking squadrons.

So:

MC80 Command, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Phylon Tractors, Leading Shots, X17 Turbolasers

398 points.

Good luck taking that down.

Rhymer says Hi...and bye... Don't have to take 3 down only need to take one.

Personally I wouldn't take a 3 poop list without...wait for it... engine techs...

Modified to:

MC80 Assault, Dodonna, Projection Experts, Leading Shots,

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Cluster Bombs, Quad Lasers, Leading Shots,

MC80 Command, Projection Experts, Cluster Bombs, Quad Lasers, Leading Shots,

396 pts

Cluster bombs are the anti Rhymer I have decided. The only ship weapon that can really hurt rhymer at medium distance. Then Quad lasers with double AS fire mop up the rest of the bombers.

The Assault sits slightly behind the other two and they all slow roll. I dont see why they have to chase down their target, so not sure of the necessity of engine techs here. I would agree if you wanted to keep up with faster corvette etc, but in reality they just make it really hard to fly, what will already be really hard to fly in formation.

Home one would be nice, as would X17's, or XX9's, some ECM's/APT's, Lando, Walex and Raymus.... but alas cant afford any of those.

Quad lasers only work at close range, Rhymer can easily sit outside that range and still shoot, and you aren't killing Rhymer with a single cluster bomb, on average it will do 3 damage, and tbh I wouldn't even shoot with Rhymer, its only a single black dice, I'd just pound you with the other 4-6 bombers and keep Rhymer alive and the rest outside Quad lasers range, and only 1 blue AA dice.

I thought we were discussing the fireball, not triple MC 80 lists! Silly me!

Back on topic, I think some point has been made: the Fireball as defined in the OP (4 FS, rhymer, dengar vader) is king in a no squadron meta, but suffers in a squadron heavy one due to the high point cost, the threat range that Rhymer + rogue offers and the poor AS capability in terms of PPD and alpha strike potential.

So now there is just one question left to answer: how can we build a balanced imperial fighter team that is wasting as few points as humanly possible and ensures not only painful bombing runs but also decent AS potential?

Rhymer plus 13 tie bombers. 133 points

Spread out, they gotta catch em all!

The reason you need speed 3 is that you will get kited to death at only speed 2. Positioning and control of the board is absolutely crucial to using big cap ships. This is something I've learned from using ISDs with Ozzel a lot.

And back to the topic,

my medium Rhymerball uses 3 firesprays, a TA, Dengar and Rhymer. Its modest on points and flexible enough.

Rhymer plus 13 tie bombers. 133 points

Spread out, they gotta catch em all!

Unfortunately only a few will benefit from Rhymer, and with no Escort he'll just get pinned down and killed.

Plus that means your Bombers are spread all over the place and will be very difficult to maneuver effectively with squadron commands.

Rhymer plus 13 tie bombers. 133 points

Spread out, they gotta catch em all!

Unfortunately only a few will benefit from Rhymer, and with no Escort he'll just get pinned down and killed.

Plus that means your Bombers are spread all over the place and will be very difficult to maneuver effectively with squadron commands.

I had the spare points to upgrade to Rhymer.

Why use squadron commands? They are just going to drive into the middle of it.