Delta Squadron Pilot (30) + TIE/x7 (-2)

28 points

What does this give us? A 3 attack, 3 Agi/6 HP small base that gets some action economy on 3-5 speed maneuvers.

As a single ship, I don't like this very much. Compare to ATC Darth Vader at only 2 points more. Vader has 1 less HP and no white-K, but more damage and astounding action economy.

Yea, but even a Delta 4K turning every turn with focus/evade is hard to deal with. I'm looking forward to fielding 1-2 Delta x7's as a solid anchor. I can't wait to try triple defenders out.

A k-turning Defender/x7 gets an evade token even if he gets blocked or has stress or a combination of both. While stress and getting blocked are Vader's weaknesses.

In the current meta, I think that is the Defender's greatest strength. They don't care about stress. Though, we have to see how Wave 8 effects things.

And thats the biggest shout out to the ion cannon. We're basically looking at a new evolution of the TLT. That said theres nothing wrong with the flechette cannon either since theres not many ships in the game that really like getting hit with a stress every turn. Some like say procket vader would actually prefer to be ionized.

I wonder if Stealth Device would be worth it on a /X7 vs. TLT's? You get 4 Green dice, a Focus, and an Evade. Or is it easier to just go for the hull upgrade?

I wonder if Stealth Device would be worth it on a /X7 vs. TLT's? You get 4 Green dice, a Focus, and an Evade. Or is it easier to just go for the hull upgrade?

That's a good question. SD would certainly make the Defender one of the most durable ships available.

I think for HLC Vess, SD might be the way to go (maybe even throw on a LW), but it's probably not worth the investment on generics. You probably want those generics to be shot at anyway, and an SD on top of focus/evade might be a bit overkill - an evade token isn't as useful when it never gets used.

Rexler Brath:

Tie/D

Ion Cannon

Predator

=43 pt

Col. Vessery

Tie/D

Ion Cannon

VI

=39 pt

Mauler Mithel

VI

=18pt

Total: 100 pt

Tried this bad boy out last night against my nemesis; Corran Horn. First game killed him in one round, second game ioned him and killed him in two rounds.

Defenders and I are bros now.

PS1 Defender + TIE/D + ion cannon *3

Colonel Vessery - TIE/D, Flechette Cannon, Ruthlessness

Onyx Squadron Pilot - TIE/x7 x 2

Wipe them out. ALL OF THEM.

Any thoughts on making Maarek competitive? Sadly, I suspect he's just not quite there at almost certainly 36 points (both fits between Rex and Vess and happens to be what he costs to add to the Adv.) but I so want him to be good. Probably just the x7 with Calculation for a total of 35 points. Maybe the MKII to get him back up to 36?

I'm likely to say, forget the title. Mangler Cannon + Predator/Lone Wolf. Go Y-wing hunting.

How to make mareek competitive:

Pray he costs the same as vessery; 1 point for 1 PS over glaive

Use for relevant PS over aggressor; sometimes very useful ability

Tie/D with predator and Tie/x7 with juke both seem useful

Cannon strips shields; pred can get crits

Juke helps push the sometimes crits through

Good v chuncky ships where the ability can trigger on red dice

Don't believe ability is worth enabling with crap likw marksmanship unless yts and vts come back HARD; epic play

Basically, Maarek = Glaive Squadron+

Any thoughts on making Maarek competitive? Sadly, I suspect he's just not quite there at almost certainly 36 points (both fits between Rex and Vess and happens to be what he costs to add to the Adv.) but I so want him to be good. Probably just the x7 with Calculation for a total of 35 points. Maybe the MKII to get him back up to 36?

Heres the thing, he may not be as competitive as vess from the start, but vess' ability requires support. Last man standing and hes just a ps 6 defender.

I took maarek out yesterday with predator and ion cannon and he was savage. First crit I picked was blinded pilot on a stresshog. I also pulled multiple direct hits. At potentially the same cost or 1 pt more than vessery I think I would prefer stele honestly. That said I was also running a fleet officer shuttle which helped immensely with action economy.

I am really hoping the Glaive is 33 points, but I would bet they are 34 w/ an EPT.

But I think this has potential: Glaive w/ x7 + Juke and Carnor w/ PTL + ATs. Comes in at 99 points. Fly the Glaives straight down their throat while Carnor flanks and enters their formation. Then you just joust with the Glaives while Carnor hangs on at range 1.

Maybe an all-/x7 squad could do some form of new tactics where they zoom in for one round, then completely disengage and set up for another joust without receiving any fire. It's hard to imagine this actually playing out in-game, however. Does anyone have any examples/replays of such a strategy existing?

I'm breaking radio silence on the new Defender expansion for the first time. I'll probably make a separate post later. The MathWing numbers peg the PS1 Delta/x7 as having a jousting efficiency of about 102% for reasonable assumptions of how often you can get the free evade to trigger. They are more cost efficient than a PS1 TIE Fighter (99%) for their points.

Except Defenders have a white K-turn.

Stock standard unsupported TIE Fighters (no Howlrunner), if they weren't already, should now be completely obsolete. The TIE Defender/x7 is simply better in almost every conceivable way. This also applies to TIE/FO's, although the vanilla versions were never efficient enough to begin with anyway.

The Defender/D is another interesting case. It's less points efficient, and its a glass cannon instead of tank, but it has its uses. I haven't dug into tractor beam specifically yet, but it has potential as the first shot (out of many) vs a mid/high AGI target.

Vessery/x7 is an absolute monster. His absolute jousting efficiency (ignoring his pilot skill) if he gets a free target lock 50% of the time is now around 97% - 98%. Pre-x7 he was only about 74.5%. For comparison purpose, Backstabber was generally regarded as the most cost efficient PS6 pilot in the game (albeit a glass cannon that dies instantly), and he is only 88.8% efficient with his ability triggering 50% of the time. Vessery wins out having a white K-turn, better cost efficiency, an EPT, and lasting longer than half a joust.

The PS6 at 34 points clocks in at 89.4% efficient, which is already a hair better than Backstabber. Except these PS6's, like Vessery, don't die like bugs on a windshield, and they have an EPT (presumably), and they have a white K-turn. I'm assuming the Glaives have an EPT since the red Royal Guards do, and FFG knows better than to make a PS6 generic without an EPT at this point. 34 points is then the only value that makes sense.

Naturally I needed to get some test games in to gather some analytical data, so I have been flying:

100 points

Vessery (35) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

Glaive (34) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

Glaive (34) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

I have only played 3 games so far, but the empirical game data backs up the mathematical assumptions that I have been using. It's not hard to nearly continuously dial in 3+ speed maneuvers and keep arcs on targets. Occasionally you will have to shift targets. They are relatively immune to stress. Having 6 stress and K-turning anyway, and getting an evade token on top of it is just complete shenanigans when you are already more efficient than a TIE Fighter.

Maybe an all-/x7 squad could do some form of new tactics where they zoom in for one round, then completely disengage and set up for another joust without receiving any fire. It's hard to imagine this actually playing out in-game, however. Does anyone have any examples/replays of such a strategy existing?

I'm breaking radio silence on the new Defender expansion for the first time. I'll probably make a separate post later. The MathWing numbers peg the PS1 Delta/x7 as having a jousting efficiency of about 102% for reasonable assumptions of how often you can get the free evade to trigger. They are more cost efficient than a PS1 TIE Fighter (99%) for their points.

Except Defenders have a white K-turn.

Stock standard unsupported TIE Fighters (no Howlrunner), if they weren't already, should now be completely obsolete. The TIE Defender/x7 is simply better in almost every conceivable way. This also applies to TIE/FO's, although the vanilla versions were never efficient enough to begin with anyway.

The Defender/D is another interesting case. It's less points efficient, and its a glass cannon instead of tank, but it has its uses. I haven't dug into tractor beam specifically yet, but it has potential as the first shot (out of many) vs a mid/high AGI target.

Vessery/x7 is an absolute monster. His absolute jousting efficiency (ignoring his pilot skill) if he gets a free target lock 50% of the time is now around 97% - 98%. Pre-x7 he was only about 74.5%. For comparison purpose, Backstabber was generally regarded as the most cost efficient PS6 pilot in the game (albeit a glass cannon that dies instantly), and he is only 88.8% efficient with his ability triggering 50% of the time. Vessery wins out having a white K-turn, better cost efficiency, an EPT, and lasting longer than half a joust.

The PS6 at 34 points clocks in at 89.4% efficient, which is already a hair better than Backstabber. Except these PS6's, like Vessery, don't die like bugs on a windshield, and they have an EPT (presumably), and they have a white K-turn. I'm assuming the Glaives have an EPT since the red Royal Guards do, and FFG knows better than to make a PS6 generic without an EPT at this point. 34 points is then the only value that makes sense.

Naturally I needed to get some test games in to gather some analytical data, so I have been flying:

100 points

Vessery (35) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

Glaive (34) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

Glaive (34) + x7 (-2) + Crackshot (1)

I have only played 3 games so far, but the empirical game data backs up the mathematical assumptions that I have been using. It's not hard to nearly continuously dial in 3+ speed maneuvers and keep arcs on targets. Occasionally you will have to shift targets. They are relatively immune to stress. Having 6 stress and K-turning anyway, and getting an evade token on top of it is just complete shenanigans when you are already more efficient than a TIE Fighter.

Dammit, Major Juggler! If you go around telling people the Defender is mathematically awesome, EVERYONE is going to fly them. That makes me a Defender Hipster....

Those numbers aren't too surprising. Both titles are really big swings.

so, juggy, do you feel vindicated after calling the unfixed Defender crap well before it was released ?

the tie does have the advantage of numbers, though.

and these are really relevant in the field tie-fighters excel in and a tie/d can't even hope to compare to:

they clog up space and block like a dream.

the fighter isn't obsolete in any way. instead, I think (have to try) that a mini-swarm (or sCHwarm ) plus an ace tie/d with tractor will be fun to fly.

nah the Tie Fighter (Standard; unsupported) was obsolete for a while (Wave 5 onward) unless you were some kind of jedi master/sith lord swarm player

they've been replaced by the new standard: Crackshot Blacksquadron

they're great against TLTs and can actually hit through more than 1 agility

don't expect to ever see an academy pilot again, except as a last ditch filler ala Heaver's Z-95

Plus, what else are you going to spend 12 pts on.

How about Engine Upgrade on a Defender with high pilot skill? He can do a k-turn and then boost

Maarek is good for his PS and EPT ability....and he gets to occasionally do crits.

I also like:

Onyx Squadron Pilot (32)
Hull Upgrade (3)
TIE/x7 (-2)

Onyx Squadron Pilot (32)
Hull Upgrade (3)
TIE/x7 (-2)

Onyx Squadron Pilot (32)
Shield Upgrade (4)
TIE/x7 (-2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Straight forward tanky ships with 3 attack dice. Should give TLT lists a lot of trouble. 21 hitpoints are a lot to chew through especially behind 3 agility and the occasional evade token thrown in. PS 3 will get you shots before a standard 4 TLT list gets to fire.

It's too bad the Imperial Veterans pack doesn't seem to have lower PS generics. I don't own the TIE Bomber kit yet and was hoping to get by with just two Imperial Vet kits.

Edit: good thing it comes with Crack Shot though! Don't mind have multiples of that.

It's too bad the Imperial Veterans pack doesn't seem to have lower PS generics. I don't own the TIE Bomber kit yet and was hoping to get by with just two Imperial Vet kits.

Edit: good thing it comes with Crack Shot though! Don't mind have multiples of that.

I hear that. I finally got a single Khiraxz, for a single Crack Shot, but never envisioned using more than one K at a time, so I'm still mostly Crackless. Along comes Veterans, and I'm seriously contemplating buying 2, as it would give me 4 bombers, and enough of all the titles to fill out at a squad. Throw in the additional Prox Mines, Crack Shot, and 2nd red Defender for aesthetic flexibility and it's just golden for me. All meat, no fat.

Lack of low PS Defenders and Bombers is a little disappointing, though.